Maybe a New AAR

[PeeDeeAitch]

The South

My god, this was a disappointment. While I expected problems with the 1st Panzer and their drive, I somehow missed completely that the Lvov Pocket would be reached. Pockets are my big problem, though I can make them, they always break down because I am an idiot.

Luckily, turn 2 saw a lot of killing in the Lvov Pocket, and so while this was an annoyance, it wasn't too bad. My plan here was also to rest the southern Panzers, and given the proximity of the railhead I figured on about 35 movment for the tanks on turn 4 - that would be enough to cause some grief. The spearhead was quite a ways east already.

[PeeDeeAitch]

The 11th Army does not spread out when I play. They remained focused and strong - their goal is to smash east, maybe play a bit on the Black Sea coast, but potentially drive fast enough to lead to an Uman-style pocket if things fall out right. Here you see them driving hard.

[PeeDeeAitch]

I believed I had set up for a great turn 4. The 4th, 3rd, and 2nd Panzer Groups were all gassed up. The 1st would have fuel in the 30s. A turn of rest, the infantry close, the only thing that could upset the applecart would be hubris.

No chance of the gods striking me down, is there?

[Sabre21]

Is this a pbem or server game?

[cpt flam]

great to see the 2 sides in action
very interresting

[JAMiAM]

ORIGINAL: Sabre21

Is this a pbem or server game?

Old-style PBEM, Andy.

[Klydon]

ORIGINAL: JAMiAM


Wherever possible, I have also tried to engage with an ezoc, each of his stacks. I want to keep his fatigue high, prevent refit benefits, and reduce his ability to move around and concentrate force in attempts to maximize any hasty attacks. I suspect he won't have enough MPs to do much more than to rectify his supply situation, and during my end of turn logistics phase, much of the territory in this pocket will convert back to my side. This will slow down his infantry on their march to reinforce 4th Pz Group.

Excellent game and great read for an AAR.

I wanted to point out something JAM mentioned (in bold) about having units next to Axis units to keep fatigue up. This is likely a false ideal as noted by some research I did in a thread in the war room.

tm.asp?m=2762268

There are other reasons to leave Russian units next to Axis as JAM mentions (no refit, etc) and one thing he didn't mention is while fatigue doesn't seem to matter either way, the amount of damage elements that remain damaged does seem to change between having a unit left next to them or not.

Looking forward to seeing how all this unfolds in future turns.

[JAMiAM]

ORIGINAL: Klydon

ORIGINAL: JAMiAM


Wherever possible, I have also tried to engage with an ezoc, each of his stacks. I want to keep his fatigue high, prevent refit benefits, and reduce his ability to move around and concentrate force in attempts to maximize any hasty attacks. I suspect he won't have enough MPs to do much more than to rectify his supply situation, and during my end of turn logistics phase, much of the territory in this pocket will convert back to my side. This will slow down his infantry on their march to reinforce 4th Pz Group.

Excellent game and great read for an AAR.

I wanted to point out something JAM mentioned (in bold) about having units next to Axis units to keep fatigue up. This is likely a false ideal as noted by some research I did in a thread in the war room.

tm.asp?m=2762268

There are other reasons to leave Russian units next to Axis as JAM mentions (no refit, etc) and one thing he didn't mention is while fatigue doesn't seem to matter either way, the amount of damage elements that remain damaged does seem to change between having a unit left next to them or not.

Looking forward to seeing how all this unfolds in future turns.

Thanks Klydon. While it may be true that the adjacent units don't directly affect the fatigue level recovery, the extra MPs the tarred units have to spend in moving from/through ezocs, and the attacks necessary (even hasty) to clear the hexes so that other units can more freely move all cause fatigue.

[Sabre21]

There is also attrition combat that occurs whenever opposing units are adjacent to one another. As James points out though, the tarbaby tactic causing additional mp's is the best reason to do it IMO too.

[76mm]

ORIGINAL: Sabre21

As James points out though, the tarbaby tactic causing additional mp's is the best reason to do it IMO too.

I've never understood this argument. If you start next to a German unit, doesn't it cost fewer MP for the German to simply hasty attack your adjacent unit than to enter the unit's ZoC (if it were one hex away), and then attack?

[JAMiAM]

After opening the turn, checking casualties, the logistics report, and running my usual high number of air recon, I switched over the soft factors display from my normal of morale, to fuel. No, I'm not concerned with the level of my fuel, since the Soviets always seem to have plenty after the first couple of turns. I was anxious to find out where PDH had spent for his HQ Buildups. I felt the 4th Panzer Group, near Pskov was a given, and was not disappointed. Scared, perhaps, but knowing what PDH was going to do before he did it, gave me some perverse satisfaction. Now, if I could just muster enough Russian bodies to throw in the way, in order keep him out of Leningrad by turn 5, I would be ecstatic.

This screenshot was taken at the end of the turn, and if you look carefully, you can see the bright green indicators of his Pz Group units fuel. Marx may have insisted that religion is the opiate for the masses, but Stalin orders up some prayers.

[JAMiAM]

Here, in the approaches to Smolensk, the Gateway to Moscow, we see a lot of German mobile units "green-lighted". There looks to be one corps in the red, but otherwise, all mobile units with a high enough detection level to see their soft factors appear to be gassed up and ready to rumble on turn 4. Likewise, this shot was taken at the end of the turn.

[JAMiAM]

Here in the South, we see that the 1st Panzer Group isn't getting any love this turn, from the German Quartermaster General. Though PDH ran some air resupply missions, presumably for fuel, the mobile units are sitting in the red, or yellow, at best. This tells me the main thrust for turn 4 will be in the north, so I can continue playing close to the Axis here, as last turn's escapades allowed a little breathing space between my armies and the German infantry divisions coming up from the west. He still has some pocket reduction to accomplish, as well, and that should tie down some Germans for another turn. The pocket is too big to leave strictly for the Axis minors, and besides, PDH likes to move fast, and hit hard. He needs to clear the pocket as soon as possible, and that means sending in the guys who can do it reliably - German infantry.

[PeeDeeAitch]

Turn 4

Reports that nothing could stop me were a bit premature. Here is what I was greeted with upon opening up the game. Mud, all along the front. It hit on the worst turn - right after HQ buildup, with my units just getting back into supply after the turns 1 and 2 dash, the infantry not yet up.

Had JAM had a few extra units, he actually had a chance to kill a couple of mobile units who were no longer in supply due to the extra movement costs of mud. Here is the large view. Circled are the railheads, the FBDs would be slowed this turn as well - mud killed another thing as the plan to use the Baltic Rail Conversion for the northern center supply hit a wall of muck.

[Sabre21]

ORIGINAL: PeeDeeAitch

Turn 4

Reports that nothing could stop me were a bit premature. Here is what I was greeted with upon opening up the game. Mud, all along the front. It hit on the worst turn - right after HQ buildup, with my units just getting back into supply after the turns 1 and 2 dash, the infantry not yet up.

Had JAM had a few extra units, he actually had a chance to kill a couple of mobile units who were no longer in supply due to the extra movement costs of mud. Here is the large view. Circled are the railheads, the FBDs would be slowed this turn as well - mud killed another thing as the plan to use the Baltic Rail Conversion for the northern center supply hit a wall of muck.

Looks like time for Plan B.

[PeeDeeAitch]

Turn 4 plans gone awry.

Here is an idealized shot (no mud viewed) taken at the end of the turn that shows what I had before me. I know JAM understands the importance of the Land Bridge, and so I suspected that there were units (probably those slow and offensively poor tank divisions) hiding in the woods. The Dvina was well guarded, but what caught my eye the turn before was the Dnepr bend.

My plan was actually to smash the corner of the Dnepr, and widen that with at least 2 Armor Corps, then use the other two to exploit. All those juicy planes and such in the rear would likely be displaced, and more importantly a whole new axis of advance could be opened and threatened. Sadly, this was not to be. Instead I ended up with what you see here, a couple of clean-ups in the mud and wait.

[PeeDeeAitch]

The north, Muddy turn 4

The north saw some of my biggest frustrations with the mud. Not that units were in danger, but that so many possibilities could not happen. JAM had reinforced the region, likely again with units in the woods again, but I had 4 panzer divisions, 3 motorized division, and the Lehr. I figured I could encircle Pskov, and have units beyond. The infantry by my reckoning, would have been able to reach the nearest units and do stacked hasty attacks that would help free up the panzer corps.

It was not to be. The mud might well have saved Leningrad - each turn is a clock and the terrain there favors the defender who places units well and knows how to build entrenchments.

[PeeDeeAitch]

The South

The south was going to be more slogging, but the ace in my sleeve was that the railhead was quite a bit closer to the panzer corps HQs. Given how I ended turn 3, with perhaps 15-20 movement per unit, I expected to see mid-30s MPs for turn 4. The infantry would not be able to help much, except in the back of the panzer protuberance. Still, I figured another 10-12 hexes of bulge would make things uncomfortable...especially if the spectre of two panzer groups descending from the north became a possibility.

I do understand that I did not see all the defenders - mud hides a lot. However, it was only my turn 4, and so I had a feeling that the Soviets were not all that strong.

Again, the overall goal was to keep fluidity, movement, and chaos among the defenders - that should be one overall aim for all German players.

[Klydon]

Suckage on the mud. This is why I think its tough to play with random weather and I say that willing to play either side with fixed weather with no issue at all.

I think its clear the weather model and zones will have to go on the "to do" list at some point as I know it isn't a high priority, but there needs to be something done with it. There are several different options, but some include smaller and more weather zones (getting screwed from Leningrad all the way down into the AGS area in one shot is too much) and also I think something beyond simple mud like having light mud (reduced movement, but not as bad of a combat modifier; this would simulate the actual weather issues the Germans did in fact run into, especially in the south early in the campaign) and then the nasty regular mud we are used to having.

Also curious on what has been moved industry wise so far? Getting an extra turn on that is huge as well.

[PeeDeeAitch]

ORIGINAL: Sabre21
Looks like time for Plan B.

I ditched plan B, and also Plan C - I went straight to Plan Q. Of course, Plan Q is so secret even I do not know the details, but I think prayer is a big part of it.

(for the record, I sound like I whine and bitch and moan, but really I play on because this is a game - life throws enough curveballs, I don't need to make this into something more than it is)