BAK Long Range

[Speedysteve]

Here's some basic testing done.....moved all of the SU airbases well away from here and moved in 1 x PVO (attached to Moscow District ultimately) and 1 x BAK (attached to STAVKA ultimately).

Here's Axis recon intercepted by fighters from PVO:

[Speedysteve]

Showing the PVO and BAK base in the area............

[Speedysteve]

Here's some BAK GS on a SU attack. Note ground units attached to Western Front and BAK to LR Air Command = STAVKA

[TulliusDetritus]

Very useful advices so thank you. And thanks as well for those tests, Speedy [:)] Now I understand much better the air thing. I will start putting to good use the PVO and BAK commands, that's for sure.

And I do need new air bases. I will follow cpt flam's suggestion and assign 6 air units to each air base. And I will disband many (SAD). I should be harvesting more air bases (ShAD, etc.).

[Speedysteve]

NP Tullius. It's my job to test [;)]

A few further comments:

Don't expect to see masses of commitments early on. To give you an idea with these tests I saw PVO commitment about 1 in 10 raids. BAK command bombers about 1 in 20. Personally I think this ratio should be better. Something for the future maybe.

Of course by having many bases overlapping you'll increase your chance of commitment.
A further point to add is these tests were all conducted in the first 2 months of the campaign so the SU is not geared up and plane readiness was low in general which wouldn't help air commitment!

With regard to airbase use I use them all! You'll have enough squadrons to fill up most of your airbases including SAD's. They may withdraw in 42 but you can freely re-assign the groups from the NR then. That's my method anyhow.

[TulliusDetritus]

Speedy, the truth is I want to get rid of these SAD bases as soon as possible. On last turn (now it's february 1942) 3 front-line SAD bases were disbanded. And therefore around 20 tactical bomber units were sent to the National Reserve. So this means like 3 fronts have lost all their tactical bombers. I want air bases which will be staying until the fall of Berlin.

And in fact I have more than enough air units. Last time I checked there were like 333 (!!) in the national reserve [X(] Quite well trained and high morale almost the lot of them [:)]

[mmarquo]

"I will follow cpt flam's suggestion and assign 6 air units to each air base"
 
It is not that easy - becareful to monitor the support/support needed on the airbase report. When support < support needed there are penalties. You will notice that the larger craft need more support and vice versa; I can guarantee that 4 or 5 PEs or SUs requiere much more support than smaller fighters.
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Marquo
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[mmarquo]

Speedy - I think your test confnirmed what APvel said; the closest airbase supports the ground combat. And since air units from different fronts can't be in the same combat anymore, I assume that STAVKA, PVO, BAK and the Fronts each count as independent commands for the puropose of this calculation? In other words, we will not see units of these independent commands in the same ground combat?
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Marquo

[Oleg Mastruko]

ORIGINAL: Mynok

I will point Oleg towards this thread in case he can provide some insight. He is getting massive ground support for his attacks. Be interesting to know how he's basing stuff.

I see it thanks.

I am not sure how I do it really, I wasn't even aware how good/bad I am in the air.

It's 43 scenario and things are pretty well organised from the start, as others said - IAD fighters, ShAD Il-2 Sturmoviks, BAD bombers (by 43 it's mostly Pe-2s), DBAD - heavy bombers (I have no idea whether they do anything really as they are attached to Stavka), VVS - special bases for transports and recon.

G infront of any base name means it has guards status (GDBAD - Guards DBAD etc)

All units except DBAD are subordinated to Air Army HQ, say 16th Air Army, which is in turn subordinated to Front HQ. Each of my fronts have one air army assigned, with varying number of bases.

So the average front, say 1st Baltic, has its Air Army, say 5th Air Army, and it has 2-3 IADs, 1-2 BADs and as many ShADs (2-3) as I can gather to help with the offensives. Each of those bases has 4-8 air units of the respective kind.

It's simple really I didn't change much of it from scenario start, just added new units from reserve and moved bases close to front.

I don't know my air doctrine setings but I keep them quite low (ie fly missions whenever you can with whatever you can).

One thing I take care to do is whenever I add a new unit from national reserve, I raise the number of "commitment" or whaetever it's called on the base screen. It's yet another, WHOLLY unnecassary layer of micromanagement - each base can have this number from 1 to 9, I guess it means number of units it will fly/support but I have no idea why would anyone have this number lower than actual number of units in the base. Anyway, I take care to raise the number when I add units to base, so it's not set to 3, if I have 7 units in the base.

I will look more closely on my combat results now that you say I have huge support (haven't noticed it at all, I am relying on artillery). I belong to Flavo's school of avoiding to micromanage air if possible and using them as flying mortars [:D]

[76mm]

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

One thing I take care to do is whenever I add a new unit from national reserve, I raise the number of "commitment" or whaetever it's called on the base screen. It's yet another, WHOLLY unnecassary layer of micromanagement - each base can have this number from 1 to 9, I guess it means number of units it will fly/support but I have no idea why would anyone have this number lower than actual number of units in the base. Anyway, I take care to raise the number when I add units to base, so it's not set to 3, if I have 7 units in the base.

Yikes, had never noticed this, will have to check what my commitment levels are.

[Oleg Mastruko]

ORIGINAL: 76mm

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

One thing I take care to do is whenever I add a new unit from national reserve, I raise the number of "commitment" or whaetever it's called on the base screen. It's yet another, WHOLLY unnecassary layer of micromanagement - each base can have this number from 1 to 9, I guess it means number of units it will fly/support but I have no idea why would anyone have this number lower than actual number of units in the base. Anyway, I take care to raise the number when I add units to base, so it's not set to 3, if I have 7 units in the base.

Yikes, had never noticed this, will have to check what my commitment levels are.

It's not really "commitment" it's called by some other name.... support or something I am too lazy to check right now....

Anyway I really don't know why it's even in the game I mean why would anyone willingly keep this number lower than number of units in the base?? If you have 6 units in the base obviously you want all 6 to work/operate/fly/eat....

[mmarquo]

I am not sure that you can; perhaps the AI will remove units from the base to the NR if the number exceed to committment number? But for sure you need to watch the Support/Support Needed ratio as too many air units on a base will have bad effects.
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Marquo

[76mm]

ORIGINAL: Marquo

I am not sure that you can; perhaps the AI will remove units from the base to the NR if the number exceed to committment number? But for sure you need to watch the Support/Support Needed ratio as too many air units on a base will have bad effects.

Well, I have no idea what this commitment figure is, but try to keep 9 air groups in all of my air bases, and they stay there. I recognize that I don't get full use out of them because of a shortage of support, but my thinking (perhaps incorrect) was that support would build up more quickly the more air groups are in the base, so it was better to have planes sitting on the base than sitting in reserve?

[Oleg Mastruko]

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

It's not really "commitment" it's called by some other name.... support or something I am too lazy to check right now....

In fact it's really called air commitment, I checked.

[Encircled]

Another one who hasn't been keeping an eye on that here.

Will change that asap

[Emx77]

ORIGINAL: Oleg Mastruko

One thing I take care to do is whenever I add a new unit from national reserve, I raise the number of "commitment" or whaetever it's called on the base screen. It's yet another, WHOLLY unnecassary layer of micromanagement - each base can have this number from 1 to 9, I guess it means number of units it will fly/support but I have no idea why would anyone have this number lower than actual number of units in the base. Anyway, I take care to raise the number when I add units to base, so it's not set to 3, if I have 7 units in the base.

Obviously, you are misinterpreting air commitment function. Air group commitment doesn't influence air units flying support mission from base.

From manual:

8.4.2.1. AIR GROUP UNIT COMMITMENT SYSTEM

The air group unit commitment system allows players to semi-automatically manage the deployment of air group units to and from the national air reserve and air base units at the air base unit level. Rather than select individual air group units, the player can adjust the number of units and the type (based on range) for each individual air base unit. The air group commitment settings are ignored if the player uses a different method to manually transfer air group units.

There are two components to the system, aviation range and aviation commitment level. The aviation range is computed by dividing the aircraft radius by 10 and can be ‘less than 20 hexes’, ‘less than 40 hexes’, more than 41 hexes’ or ‘all ranges’. Aviation commitment level ranges from 0 to 9 and designates the number of air group units the player desires at that particular air base unit. To use the air group unit commitment system, the player adjusts the aviation range and commitment level for an air base unit in the air base unit detail window and then selects the ‘MOVE’ button (5.4.18).

First, air group units that do not meet the aviation range profile of the selected air base unit are transferred to the applicable national air reserve. Next, air group units in excess of that air base unit’s commitment level are transferred back to the national air reserve, with the weakest units moving first. If the air base unit then has fewer air group units than the commitment level, the appropriate number of air group units that meet the aviation range profile move from the national air reserve to that air base unit, with the strongest units moving first.

[76mm]

Actually I'm home now and just checked my airbases; as far as I can tell the commitment level increases to match the number of air groups assigned to an air base. At any rate, I have not changed this setting ever, and all of my air bases have the same number of air groups and commitment level.

I've also noticed that some of my airbases have much MORE support than they need, while others have much LESS than they need--hopefully they will cross-level? I mean, some of them have 100% more support than they need, while others have about 25% of requirements. Seems rather odd...

[WarHunter]

ORIGINAL: 76mm
I've also noticed that some of my airbases have much MORE support than they need, while others have much LESS than they need--hopefully they will cross-level? I mean, some of them have 100% more support than they need, while others have about 25% of requirements. Seems rather odd...

All airbases are equal, but some are more equal than others.

[mmarquo]

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The air committment number can be changed manually and I encourage doing so; different craft require different levels of support - you can have 9 fighter groups/base but if you have 9 long range bombers the required support will greatly exceed the support level, and then bad things happen...

[JAMiAM]

ORIGINAL: Marquo

76mm-

The air committment number can be changed manually and I encourage doing so; different craft require different levels of support - you can have 9 fighter groups/base but if you have 9 long range bombers the required support will greatly exceed the support level, and then bad things happen...

Dr. Egon Spengler: There's something very important I forgot to tell you.
Dr. Peter Venkman: What?
Dr. Egon Spengler: Don't cross the streams.
Dr. Peter Venkman: Why?
Dr. Egon Spengler: It would be bad.
Dr. Peter Venkman: I'm fuzzy on the whole good/bad thing. What do you mean, "bad"?
Dr. Egon Spengler: Try to imagine all life as you know it stopping instantaneously and every molecule in your body exploding at the speed of light.
Dr Ray Stantz: Total protonic reversal.
Dr. Peter Venkman: Right. That's bad. Okay. All right. Important safety tip. Thanks, Egon.