Tojo IIc v Frank

[SuluSea]

Thanks guys for taking time to answer. It only takes a couple times for an airbase to get pummeled with high maintenance planes to realize they belong on a railine. [;)]  The CNG tip is noted and appreaciated.
 
 
 
I grabbed a snapshot of the Tony 1d and Tojo that  arrive near the same time frame for comparison if anyone wants to comment on Chickenboys question as I'm interested in hearing thoughts as well.
 
 

 

[Cuttlefish]

I've used both the Tojo IIc and the Frank late war against Allied bombers. It's a tough call. The Japanese player needs to keep planes in the air over several turns to defeat a determined attempt to close an airfield, so the Tojo is the better choice because of its service rating. But the Frank is one of the few Japanese fighters that can really shred a formation of B-24s. So I think that, ideally, using both types in tandem is the way to go.

A cunning Allied player won't send unescorted bombers against the Japanese late war, though. Instead he'll sweep for several turns ahead of the bombers with P-51s, P-47s, and so on. Only superior numbers will save Japan then, and that is very hard to achieve by late '44.

[PresterJohn001]

Hopefully will get to try out the Tony Id soon, like the look of the 2x CL 20mm cannons. My provisional plan if for Tony Id's and Franks when they arrive. If Tony's don't work out i'll try the Tojo IIc.

Tony's Base defense, Franks offensive and supporting bases.

[Miller]

As I stated over a year ago in this thread, Tojo IIc all the way. The Frank is better but its service rating cripples it, especially in the CAP role vs 4E bombers. By all means build some Franks, but limit them to sweep and escort missions unless they are flying from a base with plenty of engineers and aviation support........

[KenchiSulla]

It is pretty hard to stop a allied determinded offensive against airfields. A mix of Tojo's and Franks with a good pool of reserve pilots and a network of airfields and aviation support to redeploy should be enough to give the allies a bloody nose.

I have noticed that pilot quality is a huge factor too so I wouldnt worry about small differences in speed and stuff like that.. You do not have influence on it. You do have influence on preparing your pilots!

[Zeta16]

I would say the Frank, the Tojo are Ok but they get damaged by the bombers and sit on field as well. Ask Freeboy about my franks in the PI's. It's all about rotation and rest. Never let a groups moral fall below 99 and if it does get them out of combat. Ypu will see a big difference when the moral starts to fall, sent them out to train with some new pilots for a few weeks then send them back in. This has worked well for me(I am flying about 2/3 Franks and then Tony's and Tojo's in late 44). Also don't be scard about service rating get better aircraft and change out airgroup often and you will see results (do the same thing with the Jack and George, they are worth having as they are pretty good).

[Rainer79]

As long as you have sufficient AV support at a base I do prefer the Frank. If there is a shortage in that area (and there WILL be at some bases) that increased service rating will start to hurt. There the late war service rating 1 fighters will start to shine. So my advice would be to build both in sufficient numbers. I am also starting to like the Oscar IV with its twin 20 mm cannons BTW.

One additional detail is that the Tojo is the inferior Kamikaze plane due to a worse bomb load.

[EUBanana]

ORIGINAL: FatR

Early Lightnings have service rating 4, though. 4 is cripping, and 2 is practically unnoticeable, so I don't know how bad is 3.

The big problem with Tojo I see right now, is Hurricane IIc already kicking its ass in the summer of 1942. Not a good sign of things to come. And later models of Tojo don't improve its flight characteristics.

3 is pretty bad. 2 is pretty bad as well, really, but the Allies don't notice it simply because 2 is the standard for them.

You notice it when you get P47s though. You can be brazen about sending them to airfields exposed to Japanese bombers. You can be brazen about night bombing. If all you got is service rating 2-3 aircraft it's possibly to heavily reduce their combat strength just by constantly night bombing.

The P38 is OK regardless as its an offensive fighter, almost never used for CAP. The Corsair, however, is a different story. The first Corsair with service rating 3 really is not that effective. Usually what I want is a squadron of desperadoes able to be dropped into a small jsut captured airfield and provide CAP for convoys bringing up engineers and reinforcements and supply. You need one squadron that really punches above their weight, so when the Japs come and start bombing the tar out of your new airfield they are seen off. Corsairs simply can't do this. Was a major problem for me until the P47 showed up, one squadron of those will make the Japanese pause.

[crsutton]

With the latest beta patch you can now (for a PP price) swap out some marine corsairs for hellcats-of which there are plenty of. The hellcat is an excellent forward fighter due to its service rating of 1. Also, you will get better corsairs in late 43 that have a 2 service rating.

[Numdydar]

Here are some other threads that might help
 
http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/aviation/best-japanese-army-fighter-22529.html
 
http://www.ww2incolor.com/forum/showthread.php?3475-Imperial-Japanese-Army-Fighter-Aircraft
 
Also according to Wikapedia, "the Ki-84 was considered to be the best Japanese fighter to see large scale operations during World War"  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakajima_Ki-84
 
Of course this is all dependent if the airframes are modelled according to the historical record which may have an impact on which plane is 'better' in the game [:)]
 

[FatR]

ORIGINAL: SuluSea

I grabbed a snapshot of the Tony 1d and Tojo that  arrive near the same time frame for comparison if anyone wants to comment on Chickenboys question as I'm interested in hearing thoughts as well.

Ki-61-Id is a flying coffin in 1944 and is sorely lacking speed, MVR and ceiling in late 1943 as well. I say it is fit for bomber interception duty only. Ki-44-IIc is honestly far for great as well, but can be obtained several months earlier through dedicated research and can at least match Hellcat if deployed in sufficient numbers to absorb the initial dive.

[Numdydar]

I agree. I do not plan on producing a single Tony of any kind in my game. Too many other planes that are better imho.

[Shark7]

I've always had really good luck with the Ki-61. Experiences will vary I guess.

[Numdydar]

That is one reason to play the game at least once with PDU Off (which I am doing now). As every squadron has a unique upgrade path, you get to see how each airframe fares throughout the game. Of course you actually have to complete the game too [:)] in order to see which later stage airframes suits your playstyle the best.
 
I must admit it is very interesting to start the game having to rely on actually using Nates as frontline AC as there are not enough Zeros and Oscars to go around.

[Sun Tempest]

ORIGINAL: FatR

ORIGINAL: SuluSea

I grabbed a snapshot of the Tony 1d and Tojo that  arrive near the same time frame for comparison if anyone wants to comment on Chickenboys question as I'm interested in hearing thoughts as well.

Ki-61-Id is a flying coffin in 1944 and is sorely lacking speed, MVR and ceiling in late 1943 as well. I say it is fit for bomber interception duty only. Ki-44-IIc is honestly far for great as well, but can be obtained several months earlier through dedicated research and can at least match Hellcat if deployed in sufficient numbers to absorb the initial dive.

On the other hand, KI-100 I Tony seems to be a better replacement for Tojo line, to bad that it arrives in early '45