Maybe a New AAR
Moderators: Joel Billings, Sabre21
RE: Maybe a New AAR
It looks a bit droopy to me
Mind you, a drive on Moscow will certainly perk it up (and the picture!)
Mind you, a drive on Moscow will certainly perk it up (and the picture!)
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Don't worry. No matter where he points it, I'll be all over it, like a leaky condom. Hmmn...that doesn't sound as intimidating as it was supposed to...[;)]ORIGINAL: Encircled
It looks a bit droopy to me
Mind you, a drive on Moscow will certainly perk it up (and the picture!)
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Turn 8 - Decisions
The turn dawns without the mud I expected. For the record, I also expect blizzard in November and no snow turns December-February.
In the north I am faced with choices. I can cut off the westernmost Soviet units (baggine perhaps 8 divisions), or fight to clear Leningrad. Really, it is no choice, while 60k surrenders are nice, I would be no closer to Leningrad and another turn behind. Instead I do the "cut across" move. Resistance is strong, 4th Panzer gets little help, and in the end while I have done some advancing it is not as much as hoped.
The question might arise as to why I did this and why I left units exposed. The reason is aggression, hopefully focused. While I was not expecting the reaction this turn and the next to be so severe, the goal is to unhinge the defenses. If this means retreats and routes of my units, I face this. It is not great tank terrain, but as long as the hexes are not converted, the 18th Army will lag behind.
Added to this is the sense of urgency I have for lost time - I am willing to trade losses to make the situation more favorable. As will be seen, I gained some and I lost some.
Here is the Leningrad region on turn 8

The turn dawns without the mud I expected. For the record, I also expect blizzard in November and no snow turns December-February.
In the north I am faced with choices. I can cut off the westernmost Soviet units (baggine perhaps 8 divisions), or fight to clear Leningrad. Really, it is no choice, while 60k surrenders are nice, I would be no closer to Leningrad and another turn behind. Instead I do the "cut across" move. Resistance is strong, 4th Panzer gets little help, and in the end while I have done some advancing it is not as much as hoped.
The question might arise as to why I did this and why I left units exposed. The reason is aggression, hopefully focused. While I was not expecting the reaction this turn and the next to be so severe, the goal is to unhinge the defenses. If this means retreats and routes of my units, I face this. It is not great tank terrain, but as long as the hexes are not converted, the 18th Army will lag behind.
Added to this is the sense of urgency I have for lost time - I am willing to trade losses to make the situation more favorable. As will be seen, I gained some and I lost some.
Here is the Leningrad region on turn 8

- Attachments
-
- NorthernA..ession8.gif (461.91 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
The Center 8
Not much happening, the realization that my "deep drive" by 2nd and 3rd Panzer Groups was stalled by JAMs defending meant last turn was mostly rest, and turn 8 was rest as well. This means several things - 1) The armor is replenished somewhat (they are not June 22nd level but far more solid than 2 weeks before), 2) They armor has gas, and 4) My plans are more wide open and I am not locked into any one plan.
(note - option 3 involved pretending the game didn't exist and that I never started this game, it was left off due to reality)
The infanty has used this spell to move up, and they are quite smartly spanking the defenders when they get a chance. This is good for my ego, but really the front has been rather quiet.
Center armor, turn 8

Not much happening, the realization that my "deep drive" by 2nd and 3rd Panzer Groups was stalled by JAMs defending meant last turn was mostly rest, and turn 8 was rest as well. This means several things - 1) The armor is replenished somewhat (they are not June 22nd level but far more solid than 2 weeks before), 2) They armor has gas, and 4) My plans are more wide open and I am not locked into any one plan.
(note - option 3 involved pretending the game didn't exist and that I never started this game, it was left off due to reality)
The infanty has used this spell to move up, and they are quite smartly spanking the defenders when they get a chance. This is good for my ego, but really the front has been rather quiet.
Center armor, turn 8

- Attachments
-
- RestintheCenter8.gif (284.13 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Smolensk Squeeze
The one area of happenings with a purpose on turn 8 was around Smolensk. JAM is not the type to give up good defensive terrain, and so the change to squeeze the Smolensk region did happen. From the north the 9th Army took down the defenders to a thin strip - the 4th army pinned them from the south. This means the front units cannot easily get out, and the cance to surround the city appears.
Given the response of JAM, this could be a nice pocket or just a fairly painless way to grab Smolensk. It does have to be taken soon, so the railhead keeps up.

The one area of happenings with a purpose on turn 8 was around Smolensk. JAM is not the type to give up good defensive terrain, and so the change to squeeze the Smolensk region did happen. From the north the 9th Army took down the defenders to a thin strip - the 4th army pinned them from the south. This means the front units cannot easily get out, and the cance to surround the city appears.
Given the response of JAM, this could be a nice pocket or just a fairly painless way to grab Smolensk. It does have to be taken soon, so the railhead keeps up.

- Attachments
-
- smolensksqueeze8.gif (306.05 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
In the south
Here my plan continues. Hexes along the Dnepr are converted so infanty can try to swoop to whatever crossing point seems the best. I expect JAM knows now the region I will try this, but I will have strength. The important bit to crossing here, if you do not get an early coup de main, is stacks of infantry and gassed tanks. The bridgehead must be exploited or the German player will face a single corps surrounded by a massed (and mostly dug in) wall of defenders.
Of course, I could just surrender now too. It is getting close to the "Axis give up" point.

Here my plan continues. Hexes along the Dnepr are converted so infanty can try to swoop to whatever crossing point seems the best. I expect JAM knows now the region I will try this, but I will have strength. The important bit to crossing here, if you do not get an early coup de main, is stacks of infantry and gassed tanks. The bridgehead must be exploited or the German player will face a single corps surrounded by a massed (and mostly dug in) wall of defenders.
Of course, I could just surrender now too. It is getting close to the "Axis give up" point.

- Attachments
-
- AlongtheDnepr8.gif (277.47 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
11th Army, Turn 8
Back on track after mud more dense than a PhD thesis in Sociology, the 11th Army slams over the Bug.
The goal here is to cross in force and to not give up my ultimate goal of this army. I don't want JAM to know yet if they are aiming for the Bend or for the Crimea.
Ultimately, if you are going to cross a major river, cross it in force and get clear of the water. Cross, exploit the flanks of the bridgehead and make the region yours. Even small forces can mess up a crossing if the Germans are not concentrated and ready to use enough force.

Back on track after mud more dense than a PhD thesis in Sociology, the 11th Army slams over the Bug.
The goal here is to cross in force and to not give up my ultimate goal of this army. I don't want JAM to know yet if they are aiming for the Bend or for the Crimea.
Ultimately, if you are going to cross a major river, cross it in force and get clear of the water. Cross, exploit the flanks of the bridgehead and make the region yours. Even small forces can mess up a crossing if the Germans are not concentrated and ready to use enough force.

- Attachments
-
- Ifyoureg..iver...8.gif (145.49 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Decisions in the Center
I wrote above how the rest was needed, but it could also be an advantage. This wider shot with magical arrows shows what I mean.
The original advance could be started back up, now that the railhead is closer and the armor is gassed up, or a whole new axis of advance for the axis to advance on could be undertaken. I do not reveal any secrets here as the next couple of turns have been played, but expect from me the aggressive tack.

I wrote above how the rest was needed, but it could also be an advantage. This wider shot with magical arrows shows what I mean.
The original advance could be started back up, now that the railhead is closer and the armor is gassed up, or a whole new axis of advance for the axis to advance on could be undertaken. I do not reveal any secrets here as the next couple of turns have been played, but expect from me the aggressive tack.

- Attachments
-
- Decisions8.gif (236.8 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Here is the screenshot of the action around Leningrad. PDH left me a couple of exposed mobile units to pick on, so I counterattacked in force to drive them back. As mentioned before, each loss to them means a chance at reducing their morale, in addition to the casualties I can cause. In this case, over a 100 panzers were destroyed in one battle, and two of his mobile units were dropped down to CV levels usually reserved for my units.
The 27th Army is pretty much withdrawn to safety, around Leningrad. It will likely be needed to defend the city proper, but if I can get the chance, I still want to try and evacuate it across Lake Ladoga in order to join up with the rest of the Reserve Front that is stationed around Lake Ilmen. The progress that PDH makes, emergencies created, or opportunities presented, will determine whether or not Berzarin gets freed up to make mischief along the Volkhov, or becomes the Hero of Leningrad.

The 27th Army is pretty much withdrawn to safety, around Leningrad. It will likely be needed to defend the city proper, but if I can get the chance, I still want to try and evacuate it across Lake Ladoga in order to join up with the rest of the Reserve Front that is stationed around Lake Ilmen. The progress that PDH makes, emergencies created, or opportunities presented, will determine whether or not Berzarin gets freed up to make mischief along the Volkhov, or becomes the Hero of Leningrad.

- Attachments
-
- 008-North.jpg (603.87 KiB) Viewed 320 times
RE: Maybe a New AAR
The big, zoomed out view of the Center. Here, I am stuck trying to guess where PDH is going to head with his Pz Groups, after they are rested, fueled and supported by the German infantry.


- Attachments
-
- 008-CenterBig.jpg (673.29 KiB) Viewed 320 times
RE: Maybe a New AAR
The big view of the South, along the Dnepr River and its basin.


- Attachments
-
- 008-SouthBig.jpg (630.72 KiB) Viewed 320 times
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Here is the OOB/Losses collage. Mostly presented to keep an eye on the German AFV numbers. This turn sees him still below 1500 active AFVs. Even though he has almost the same number active as last turn, his total (which includes damaged components) is about 100 less. His resting Pz Groups have sucked up a fair number of repaired tanks, but the overall losses remain high. I intend on driving them higher at every opportunity.


- Attachments
-
- 008-Losses.jpg (211.81 KiB) Viewed 320 times
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Just back from vacation (Sunny California? The Bay Area got more rain last weekend than my first 7 turns!)
Will update this soon.
Will update this soon.
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
RE: Maybe a New AAR
LoL...being here over the last week, and knowing you were local, I figured you would gain something of a (grudging) appreciation for the random weather setting in our game.ORIGINAL: PeeDeeAitch
Just back from vacation (Sunny California? The Bay Area got more rain last weekend than my first 7 turns!)
Will update this soon.
That, or you'd think that I do, in reality, have the weather gods firmly in my back pocket...[:D]
Of course, if that was true, then turn 12 was the turn that I really could have used some mud in the, as yet, dry Northern Soviet Zone...[;)]
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
First - An explanation of turn 9
Well, I lost my save at the end of turn 9. By lost I mean that I can't find it. All for the best...in the north 4th Panzer drove to cut the rails to Leningrad and were punished (20th Panzer was retreat-routed - others were hurt), but I did shake things up there. My motto is that the Germans did have at least one Panzer Division routed in real life, why worry about that and instead grab initiative and drive.
In the Center the rested tanks of 2nd and 3rd Panzer Groups drove toward Kaluga - in a way the "north arrow" of my ideas. The goal was again to shake things up, but more importantly threaten Moscow which would result in massed shifts of reserves to that region.
In the South, the Dnepr was crossed as I planned, the cleared out river hexes allowed units that JAM might have thought out of range to have that critical 9MP left to deliberate attack and get the bridgeheads.
All in all, not a great turn (the north hurt), but I did do some things. As I have felt I am playing from behind from turn 4, it is good to keep initiative.
Well, I lost my save at the end of turn 9. By lost I mean that I can't find it. All for the best...in the north 4th Panzer drove to cut the rails to Leningrad and were punished (20th Panzer was retreat-routed - others were hurt), but I did shake things up there. My motto is that the Germans did have at least one Panzer Division routed in real life, why worry about that and instead grab initiative and drive.
In the Center the rested tanks of 2nd and 3rd Panzer Groups drove toward Kaluga - in a way the "north arrow" of my ideas. The goal was again to shake things up, but more importantly threaten Moscow which would result in massed shifts of reserves to that region.
In the South, the Dnepr was crossed as I planned, the cleared out river hexes allowed units that JAM might have thought out of range to have that critical 9MP left to deliberate attack and get the bridgeheads.
All in all, not a great turn (the north hurt), but I did do some things. As I have felt I am playing from behind from turn 4, it is good to keep initiative.
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Turn 10
In the north the shock of the beaten Panzers was tough, but not killing. The 18th Army is there in force and makes itself felt. JAM had to move a fair bit to hit the tanks like he did, and perhaps he was not expecting a drive to Kolpino by L Corps. Any sort of action when I am behind by a turn is needed, and the widening of the region here for maneuver is key.
56th Panzer rests, licking their wounds. I expect them to be ready for combat my June of 1942.

In the north the shock of the beaten Panzers was tough, but not killing. The 18th Army is there in force and makes itself felt. JAM had to move a fair bit to hit the tanks like he did, and perhaps he was not expecting a drive to Kolpino by L Corps. Any sort of action when I am behind by a turn is needed, and the widening of the region here for maneuver is key.
56th Panzer rests, licking their wounds. I expect them to be ready for combat my June of 1942.

- Attachments
-
- North10.gif (401.13 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Center 10
Rested tanks can do wonders, even against well prepared foes. Turn 9 saw the 2nd and 3rd Panzer Groups break through (slightly) toward Vyazma and Kaluga, and with Moscow in peril it was time for my ace in the hole. The Railheads were close, the infantry of 4th and 9th Armies was in the area to get to the front lines, and 4 mobile corps could build up for a turn 11 attack. At the least, JAM would be forced to defend Moscow well, and that would mean either a north or south movement for these units. This front would become fluid again.
Note for all would be Guderians out there - resting and fuel can make a weak effort into a much stronger one. Not telegraphing where one will go can make a strike far stronger. Keep in mind that large encirclements can still happen, even later in 1941, just use the tools you have to try for it. My use of the HQ buildup here was purely to try for a later summer equalizer.

Rested tanks can do wonders, even against well prepared foes. Turn 9 saw the 2nd and 3rd Panzer Groups break through (slightly) toward Vyazma and Kaluga, and with Moscow in peril it was time for my ace in the hole. The Railheads were close, the infantry of 4th and 9th Armies was in the area to get to the front lines, and 4 mobile corps could build up for a turn 11 attack. At the least, JAM would be forced to defend Moscow well, and that would mean either a north or south movement for these units. This front would become fluid again.
Note for all would be Guderians out there - resting and fuel can make a weak effort into a much stronger one. Not telegraphing where one will go can make a strike far stronger. Keep in mind that large encirclements can still happen, even later in 1941, just use the tools you have to try for it. My use of the HQ buildup here was purely to try for a later summer equalizer.

- Attachments
-
- Centerthrust10.gif (353.68 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
Dnepr 10
Turn 9 saw the bridgehead, turn 10 saw that bridgehead expand. I needed to make sure infantry got across not to secure the crossing (that was done) but instead to ensure I could have a chance of breaking out. JAM I knew would fight tooth and nail, but the threat of 1st panzer driving north to meet gassed panzers of 2nd and 3rd would shake things up.
Just between you and me, the mud and attrition has weakened the 1st panzer, but don't tell JAM.

Turn 9 saw the bridgehead, turn 10 saw that bridgehead expand. I needed to make sure infantry got across not to secure the crossing (that was done) but instead to ensure I could have a chance of breaking out. JAM I knew would fight tooth and nail, but the threat of 1st panzer driving north to meet gassed panzers of 2nd and 3rd would shake things up.
Just between you and me, the mud and attrition has weakened the 1st panzer, but don't tell JAM.

- Attachments
-
- Dneprthrust10.gif (152.96 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- PeeDeeAitch
- Posts: 1276
- Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:31 am
- Location: Laramie, Wyoming
RE: Maybe a New AAR
11th Army - turn 10
Here the hammer of the 11th army crosses the lower Dnepr on turn 10. I still have not made it clear if they are driving to Stalino or the Crimea, and indeed making him think one or the other will keep things lively. I can actually decide at the last moment, but I do not want the threat of the long Dnepr flank facing me. The 11th does what it can do, deliberate attack by several divisions to cross.
Really, don't underestimate what the German infantry can do in 1941, a stack of 3 close to full strength divisions can smash many things.

Here the hammer of the 11th army crosses the lower Dnepr on turn 10. I still have not made it clear if they are driving to Stalino or the Crimea, and indeed making him think one or the other will keep things lively. I can actually decide at the last moment, but I do not want the threat of the long Dnepr flank facing me. The 11th does what it can do, deliberate attack by several divisions to cross.
Really, don't underestimate what the German infantry can do in 1941, a stack of 3 close to full strength divisions can smash many things.

- Attachments
-
- 11thArmy10.gif (156.21 KiB) Viewed 320 times
"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
- Call me PDH
- WitE noob tester
RE: Maybe a New AAR
The "quiet" part of the front. PDH has encircled Smolensk and is driving on Vyazma. As much as I'd like to put up more of a fight in this area, I am still not sure where he intends on going with PG 2 and 3. Besides, there are some major events occurring in the north and south that are diverting my reserves and attentions.


- Attachments
-
- 009-CenterBig.jpg (653.23 KiB) Viewed 320 times

