Yes. I wasn't happy that the lead ship of the TF seemed to be the CV and it got pounded. Coup de grace came next turn when Jap CVs attacked and sank it because it couldn't get its CAP up due to damage from the surface engagement.
Bummer, and knowing the true events of "Taffy six", we know that would not have happened IRL....
I wouldn't jump to that conclusion, Bob. The way it happened in one real life circumstance is not the way it had to happen, and weren't two CVE sunk by gunfire that day? Kurita could have turned into the torpedo wakes instead of away and many more battleship guns would have been relevant.
I don't mean that the CV should be the lead ship, the game engine doesn't model that or show us, I mean that the vulnerable prizes were in range.
There is code to screen carriers (and transports) from combat under certain circumstances. Also a random factor. You can see the screening near the end of the engagement, but that is on the way out. It looks like the carrier TF should have been strong enough to screen, so the random may be getting in the way. The surface combat TF did (properly) select the most valuable ship in the carrier TF as a target.
This routine might need a tweak or two. I'll at least give it a read.
Yes. I wasn't happy that the lead ship of the TF seemed to be the CV and it got pounded. Coup de grace came next turn when Jap CVs attacked and sank it because it couldn't get its CAP up due to damage from the surface engagement.
Bummer, and knowing the true events of "Taffy six", we know that would not have happened IRL....
I wouldn't jump to that conclusion, Bob. The way it happened in one real life circumstance is not the way it had to happen, and weren't two CVE sunk by gunfire that day? Kurita could have turned into the torpedo wakes instead of away and many more battleship guns would have been relevant.
I don't mean that the CV should be the lead ship, the game engine doesn't model that or show us, I mean that the vulnerable prizes were in range.
My friend, you are of course correct..My worse error here was in using the word "never"..
There is code to screen carriers (and transports) from combat under certain circumstances. Also a random factor. You can see the screening near the end of the engagement, but that is on the way out. It looks like the carrier TF should have been strong enough to screen, so the random may be getting in the way. The surface combat TF did (properly) select the most valuable ship in the carrier TF as a target.
This routine might need a tweak or two. I'll at least give it a read.
Best thing about AE was that all the contributors were owners of WITP, all of whom had vast eperience actually playing it, (and not just a bunch of "theorists"..
Too, they have shwon a vast winningness to keep an open mind, and not fall to the temptation of trying to appease every nipicker without really looking hard at an idea......[8D]
Bummer, and knowing the true events of "Taffy six", we know that would not have happened IRL....
I wouldn't jump to that conclusion, Bob. The way it happened in one real life circumstance is not the way it had to happen, and weren't two CVE sunk by gunfire that day? Kurita could have turned into the torpedo wakes instead of away and many more battleship guns would have been relevant.
I don't mean that the CV should be the lead ship, the game engine doesn't model that or show us, I mean that the vulnerable prizes were in range.
My friend, you are of course correct..My worse error here was in using the word "never"..
If using latest beta, then the unit 'appears' to be moving.
1. Check the unit and see if it has a move destination. If so cancel the move. Else ..
2. Change from Strat mode to Combat mode, and then back to Strat. This might clear the 'moving' indicator.
The next build removes one of the moving indicators as it does not appear to be cleared all the time.
Can send/attach the save so I can verify that this is the case?
If using latest beta, then the unit 'appears' to be moving.
1. Check the unit and see if it has a move destination. If so cancel the move. Else ..
2. Change from Strat mode to Combat mode, and then back to Strat. This might clear the 'moving' indicator.
The next build removes one of the moving indicators as it does not appear to be cleared all the time.
Can send/attach the save so I can verify that this is the case?
Thanks
Thanks, michaelm. Your number 2 worked. I'll PM the turn to you.
This may or may not be related to the patch but something screwy is going on in the last turn of my PBEM. Running 1108p3
The combat replay results don't match the turn. When I first run the combat replay CL Sumatra getting torpedoed east of Noumea and there's no air action north of Tenant creek. The turn I received shows aircraft damaged from a large air battle north of Tenant creek (bomber types match) but no damage to CL Sumatra.
If I run the combat replay a second time- CL Sumatra doesn’t get torpedoed but the big air battle happens north of Tenant creek (which matches the aircraft losses showing in the turn intel screen).
The results are 100% repeatable. If I save the combat replay from the email my opponent sent to my AE directory, the first time I run the replay I get CL Sumatra torpedoed and no air battle north of Tenant creek. Run it the second time and the air battle happens but CL Sumatra doesn't feature.
Is this a possible bug or could it be a result of the combat replay being a different "run" (resolution of turn) from the actual saved turn.
And whats with the combat replay changing depending on how many times you view it- it's like there's a "counter" in there (or in the program) which influences the results.
@ michaelm & Don : I have seen it too but vice versa i.e. engageing the Jap CV TF with a good SF TF. In the above combat report I see that both TFs made contact at 20k yards distance. Rage cloes to 15k yards wich is no surprise to me as a big huge CV cant stop and turn away within seconds. A ship like the Big E would take 5k yards stopping from 20 knots or more and I think of the size of the circle if its turn around for 180 degrees. If these TFs were running bow front to the other TFs bow front range closes up very fast for big ships. A big huge ship cant stop immeadiatly and turn away/run away.[;)] Therefore I dont see any really big problems in the game as I rarly hit any CVs with a SF TF - mostly, the CVs got away unharmed or just 1-3 5" guns hit.
This may or may not be related to the patch but something screwy is going on in the last turn of my PBEM. Running 1108p3
The combat replay results don't match the turn. When I first run the combat replay CL Sumatra getting torpedoed east of Noumea and there's no air action north of Tenant creek. The turn I received shows aircraft damaged from a large air battle north of Tenant creek (bomber types match) but no damage to CL Sumatra.
If I run the combat replay a second time- CL Sumatra doesn’t get torpedoed but the big air battle happens north of Tenant creek (which matches the aircraft losses showing in the turn intel screen).
The results are 100% repeatable. If I save the combat replay from the email my opponent sent to my AE directory, the first time I run the replay I get CL Sumatra torpedoed and no air battle north of Tenant creek. Run it the second time and the air battle happens but CL Sumatra doesn't feature.
Is this a possible bug or could it be a result of the combat replay being a different "run" (resolution of turn) from the actual saved turn.
And whats with the combat replay changing depending on how many times you view it- it's like there's a "counter" in there (or in the program) which influences the results.
Cheers,
Daniel
Do you get any warning messages when loading the combat replay file?
There is no counter and the results should be the same no matter how many times it gets run.
However, it does sometimes happen that the result from the actual turn will differ from the replay after an upgrade for one or two turns.
I ran a combat save after starting the game and then again and compared the report files. They were the same.
No warning messages when loading. Just tried it again- this time without putting the Player 2 password in. Made no difference- CL Sumatra ate a torp on the first replay and didn't feature the second time I ran it.
Here's the combat replay file (note I've only renamed it to .zip, it's still a .pws file)
Start of combat reports from first and second time the replay is run
First Time
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Jun 13, 42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Submarine attack near Esperance at 55,155
Japanese Ships
SS I-164, hits 3, heavy damage
Allied Ships
DD Grayson
SS I-164 is sighted by escort
I-164 diving deep ....
DD Grayson fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Grayson attacking submerged sub ....
SS I-164 forced to surface!
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
Contact with submarine is lost
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Langsa at 46,72
Japanese Ships
APD Numakaze
APD Nadakaze
Allied Ships
SS Haddock
SS Haddock launches 2 torpedoes at APD Numakaze
Haddock diving deep ....
APD Nadakaze attacking submerged sub ....
SS Haddock eludes ASW attack from APD Nadakaze
SS Haddock eludes APD Nadakaze by diving deep
APD Nadakaze cannot establish contact with SS Haddock
APD Nadakaze fails to find sub, continues to search...
APD Nadakaze fails to find sub, continues to search...
APD Nadakaze fails to find sub, continues to search...
APD Nadakaze fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Air attack on Horn Island , at 91,128
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
Raid spotted at 21 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes
Allied aircraft
Hudson III (LR) x 4
No Allied losses
Runway hits 2
Aircraft Attacking:
4 x Hudson III (LR) bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Air attack on Horn Island , at 91,128
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
Raid spotted at 2 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 0 minutes
Allied aircraft
Hudson III (LR) x 9
No Allied losses
Aircraft Attacking:
9 x Hudson III (LR) bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Air attack on Allahabad , at 51,26
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
Raid spotted at 49 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 16 minutes
Allied aircraft
Blenheim IV x 14
Hudson IIIa x 6
Wellington Ic x 6
B-25C Mitchell x 6
Allied aircraft losses
Hudson IIIa: 1 damaged
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 1
Aircraft Attacking:
6 x Blenheim IV bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
8 x Blenheim IV bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
6 x Hudson IIIa bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
6 x Wellington Ic bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
6 x B-25C Mitchell bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 6 x 500 lb GP Bomb
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Noumea at 115,159
Japanese Ships
SS RO-66
Allied Ships
CL Sumatra, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
DD Preston
SS RO-66 launches 6 torpedoes at CL Sumatra
DD Preston fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Preston attacking submerged sub ....
DD Preston fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Preston fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Preston fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Hakodate at 121,54
SS Trigger launches 2 torpedoes at PB Saishu Maru
PB Mikitade Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Taijin Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Mikitade Maru fails to find sub and abandons search
PB Taijin Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Taijin Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Taijin Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
PB Taijin Maru fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Kienko , at 78,41
Weather in hex: Clear sky
Second Time
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Jun 13, 42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Submarine attack near Esperance at 55,155
Japanese Ships
SS I-164, hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
Allied Ships
DD Grayson
SS I-164 is sighted by escort
I-164 diving deep ....
DD Grayson fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Grayson attacking submerged sub ....
SS I-164 forced to surface!
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Grayson firing on surfaced sub ....
Sub slips beneath the waves
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack near Iwaki at 117,63
Japanese Ships
DD Shirayuki
Allied Ships
SS Grampus
SS Grampus launches 4 torpedoes at DD Shirayuki
DD Shirayuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Shirayuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Shirayuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Shirayuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Shirayuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Air attack on Horn Island , at 91,128
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
Raid spotted at 64 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 21 minutes
Allied aircraft
Hudson III (LR) x 16
No Allied losses
Aircraft Attacking:
4 x Hudson III (LR) bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
12 x Hudson III (LR) bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Air attack on Allahabad , at 51,26
Weather in hex: Thunderstorms
Raid spotted at 35 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 12 minutes
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Allied aircraft
Blenheim IV x 23
Hudson IIIa x 9
Wellington Ic x 16
B-25C Mitchell x 6
Aircraft Attacking:
8 x Blenheim IV bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
15 x Blenheim IV bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
9 x Hudson IIIa bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
16 x Wellington Ic bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
6 x B-25C Mitchell bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 6 x 500 lb GP Bomb
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Iwaki at 117,63
Japanese Ships
DD Shirakumo
DD Shirayuki
Allied Ships
SS Grampus, hits 1
SS Grampus launches 4 torpedoes at DD Shirakumo
Grampus diving deep ....
DD Shirayuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Shirayuki attacking submerged sub ....
DD Shirayuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Shirayuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Shirayuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Kienko , at 78,41
Notice that it's not just the torpedoing of Sumatra that changes, the night air raid coordination on Horn Island changes, the description of the sub sinking by DD Grayson changes (sub slips beneath waves vs contact lost).
I fixed an issue a long time ago where a variable was not set on the first game loaded, but was set (carried over from earlier turn) properly on later turns. The second and subsequent results were the same.
This sounds much like what you are experiencing. I'll try to trackdown where the difference happens.
I have noticed a problem with minelaying missions that has recently developed. If you try to load mines onto a sub or mine capable ship it says that the vessel is already loaded with mines and does not load them. Mine ammo shows zero. I am playing Japan in a PBEM and found thes because I wanted to do defensive mining of my harbors. After the minelayers laid their initial load of mines the problem developed and I could not reload even though I had ample stocks of the mine devices needed. then tried with the minelaying subs (I-121-124) and found same problem.
Using 1108M so the problem was existing in that variant.
I have noticed a problem with minelaying missions that has recently developed. If you try to load mines onto a sub or mine capable ship it says that the vessel is already loaded with mines and does not load them. Mine ammo shows zero. I am playing Japan in a PBEM and found thes because I wanted to do defensive mining of my harbors. After the minelayers laid their initial load of mines the problem developed and I could not reload even though I had ample stocks of the mine devices needed. then tried with the minelaying subs (I-121-124) and found same problem.
Using 1108M so the problem was existing in that variant.
