Are Uber Bombs a Historical Reality?

[vettim89]

Been wondering this for some time. There are certain weapons included in the game that have devasting effects. I would include:

* 800 kg AP bombs dropped by IJN TB
* 1600 lb GP bombs dropped by TBM/TBF
* 2000 lb GP bombs dropped by USAAF level bombers

I know the 800 kg bomb was used at PH to spectacular effect. My question is there any other time in the war when they were used? Were they something in the average IJN carrier's magazine after PH. I know a point could be made that they need to be included to allow the Japan player to undertake similar port attacks later in the war. I was just wondering if this may have actaully been a one time use item

Likewise with the Avengers and the 1600 lb bomb. Just because it was technically possible to put the bomb on the plane, was it something that was done? Wasa it even practical to launch a TBF/TBM with one on board? What would the range be? I know that they were used in glide bombing attacks extensively later in the war but my reading suggest they were armed with 500 lb bombs.

The USAAF 2000 lb bomb is yet another issue. The game allows the use through a set of pre-combat checks hinged on EXP. I know they are a lot of fun for AFB when they appear, but is there any basis for this in reality?

I guess my question is, "Is the game better off including every possible load on a/c even if they were rarely if ever used?" Obviously the 800 kg AP bomb has a big bearig on the PH attack. Perhaps a 8 December start scenario would exclude them. Just wondering

[JuanG]

The 800kg in the game represents the Type 99 No.80 Mk5 800kg bomb, which was essentially a converted 41cm shell. Later it represents the Type 2 No.80 Mk5 which was adopted in '42 to as a purpose built weapon, but saw limited use. There was also a development for a 1500kg bomb, the Type 3 No.150 Mk5, which did not see operational use.

No idea how many were actually carried on CVs, but its reasonable to assume the capability was there if needed.

[vettim89]

ORIGINAL: JuanG

The 800kg in the game represents the Type 99 No.80 Mk5 800kg bomb, which was essentially a converted 41cm shell. Later it represents the Type 2 No.80 Mk5 which was adopted in '42 to as a purpose built weapon, but saw limited use. There was also a development for a 1500kg bomb, the Type 3 No.150 Mk5, which did not see operational use.

No idea how many were actually carried on CVs, but its reasonable to assume the capability was there if needed.

SO certainly a case for keeping the 800 kg. What about the Allied bombs?

[chesmart]

IIRC the US 1600lb was retired in late 43

[witpqs]

In WITP I saw large Allied bombs used. In AE I have never seen them used. Maybe those who have could pipe up?

There is also the issue of planes that come with them as standard equipment (as opposed to the in-code upgrades due to group experience levels). Should those squadrons be re-equipped to give them 500 to 1,000 pounders?

[spence]

I know the 800 kg bomb was used at PH to spectacular effect.

One particular bomb produced spectacular results (the one that detonated Arizona's forward magazines) but the dud rate/low order of detonation rate for those bombs that actually hit a BB was 60% and the damage inflicted by the others was pretty negligible. LCDR Fuchida over-reported the success achieved by "his" level bombers claiming hits when he did not see an obvious splash from a complete miss. His personal specialty was level bombing so he had a proprietary interest in the success of that type of attack. His reliability as a witness to history at several critical points (Midway, the surrender ceremony in 1945 and at Pearl Harbor) has recently been called into question by several English speaking writers and apparently has long been suspect or even discounted in Japan.

I don't believe the modified 41 cm shell bomb was used after PH.

[spence]

I know the 800 kg bomb was used at PH to spectacular effect.

One particular bomb produced spectacular results (the one that detonated Arizona's forward magazines) but the dud rate/low order of detonation rate for those bombs that actually hit a BB was 60% and the damage inflicted by the others was pretty negligible. LCDR Fuchida over-reported the success achieved by "his" level bombers claiming hits when he did not see an obvious splash from a complete miss. His personal specialty was level bombing so he had a proprietary interest in the success of that type of attack. His reliability as a witness to history at several critical points (Midway, the surrender ceremony in 1945 and at Pearl Harbor) has recently been called into question by several English speaking writers and apparently has long been suspect or even discounted in Japan.

I don't believe the modified 41 cm shell bomb was used after PH.

[erstad]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

In WITP I saw large Allied bombs used. In AE I have never seen them used. Maybe those who have could pipe up?

I searched the combat reports for two games, one went to late 44 and the other is in early 45. The latter started on the original AE release, the former was maybe a major patch back?

No 1600lb in either game.

I see four uses of 2000lb bombs, all in the more recently started game. First one was October 43, others were in 44. PB4Y-1, B-24D1, and B-24J on naval attack. A few of the planes in the strike carried the 2000 lbers while the rest carried other ordnance.

So they do get used, but apparently not very often.

[Reg]

ORIGINAL: vettim89

The USAAF 2000 lb bomb is yet another issue. The game allows the use through a set of pre-combat checks hinged on EXP. I know they are a lot of fun for AFB when they appear, but is there any basis for this in reality?

VIVIGANI, GOODENOUGH ISLAND, PAPUA. 1943-11-17. GROUND STAFF OF NO. 8 (BEAUFORT) SQUADRON RAAF COMMANDED BY WING COMMANDER G. D. NICOLL CHALK THEIR VISITING CARD ON A 2000LB DAISY-CUTTER BEING LOADED UP FOR A HEAVY ALL-AUSTRALIAN PRE-DAWN RAID ON LAKUNAI AERODROME, RABAUL. THESE BOMBS ARE BELIEVED TO BE THE MOST DEVASTATING YET USED IN THE SOUTH-WEST PACIFIC. THE MESSAGE READS: 2000LB FROM NIC & HIS 300 THIEVES.