Major gameplay change - reducing speed of gaining experience

[doomtrader]

I'm still waiting for a confirmation from Numdydar, but I'm under impression of this thread:
tm.asp?m=2997449

Obviously such strong unit moves the game balance into wrong side, so I'm wondering, didn't the units gain experience too fast.
Currently unit gains 3 exp points for each battle it is participating, so wise commanding of some units and a little bit of luck, can create a monster with 100 exp within 15-20 turns.
What I'm thinking about is to reduce the exp income to 1 exp for combat, but this will mostly affect the Germans and change the gamebalance a lot, so that's why I'm asking all of you to share your opinions in this matter.

Of course this can be easily modded, but I would like to adjust the game to be adequate even for novice players.

[Razz1]

Did he Mod the files?

I have only seen Level 3 at 36 strength with 100% experience Corps size unit.

Also which scenario? That makes a big difference.

[stone10]

German lv.3 tank corps - 13.5 strength
-----
lv.5 land warfare doctrine = +125%
Guderian with 20 exp = 8*3 + 20 = +44%
100 unit exp = +100%
-----
+269% in total.

13.5 * (1+269%) = 49.815 round down to 49. It is impossible to get to 50 strength without mod the setting files.

[Razz1]

He is at level 3

[Numdydar]

ORIGINAL: Razz

Did he Mod the files?

I have only seen Level 3 at 36 strength with 100% experience Corps size unit.

Also which scenario? That makes a big difference.

GC starting in 1939, no mods. I actually have 5 like this [:)]

lv.4 land warfare doctrine.

[Razz1]

Plus the temporary increase in effectivity for Capturing Moscow.

[freeboy]

I think it should be a percentage.. 100 - current = X ... that  figure, lower exp results in larger .. multiplied by .1 thus   50 experience unit would gain
100 - 50= 50 multiplied by .1 = 5 gained.. but a 90 would only get 1     100-90=10 multiplied by .1 = 1

[Numdydar]

ORIGINAL: Razz

Plus the temporary increase in effectivity for Capturing Moscow.

As I said before Moscow was captured in '41 and this shot was in July '42 long after Moscow fell.

[doomtrader]

Some things might depend on his choices when advancing on another levels.

[oldspec4]

I'm into turn 141 (1 Aug '42) of the grand campaign as the Russians, normal, no mods.

The Germans have one 50 strength panzer and three or four 40 strength monsters overrunning everything close to Stalingrad. This is totally unhistorical and is ruining the immersion and fun factor in the game.

IMO, something ( e.g., battle experience impacts) should be done to adjust/reduce the probability of such large strength gains.

[willgamer]

Grand Campaign, turn 148, normal, no mods, England occupied, Iraq occupied, Russia surrendered, Yugo surrendered.

There are four level 3 panzer corps at 49-8 or better.

The best is 55-8: exp 100; eff 411%; war doc 116; commander 44; exp 100; commander 8/20; (everything else=0).

No problems! [:D]

[doomtrader]

This makes me almost completely sure that effectiveness is the key here. I think we should start from slowing down gathering of experience and see how does the balance will be kept.
I would prefer to avoid touching war doctrine influence, as with the different difficulty levels the impact is different.

[RandomAttack]

Would it be reasonable/possible to put a simple cap on effectiveness?

[freeboy]

did you not like my change suggestion? changes linear progress into something aliitle more resembling reality no?
 

[RandomAttack]

My fundamental concern is that there should be some kind of hard limit on experience/effectiveness impacts. If you have a "20" strength Corps suddenly worth "50" because you added a "super leader" to it, and maybe more exp, etc., I just don't buy it at all. I know your suggestion would tone it down some, but I still feel a hard cap is needed. I'm ok with up to a total of 200% effectiveness (from all factors), after that it just seems unreal. My 100% effective Corps should not be able to triple or quadruple combat power just from leadership, exp, etc. If so, "100%" is essentially meaningless. Plus, in the real world, there is a fine line between "experience" and "combat fatigue"-- it simply is not an ever-increasing curve, nor does it keep increasing your combat power after a certain point. So I see this discussion as trying to determine what that finite point is, which implies a cap.

For experimental purposes at least, I think a hard cap is better.

[doomtrader]

Freeboy, the idea is fine, but again, the unit can gain max exp in 30 battles, also this will require changes in the code.

[Razz1]

We never had an impact like this.
I suggest rechecking the files as the Russian increase in effectiveness may have a typing error in it and the file is actually increasing the Germans.

[Numdydar]

The Germans get stronger when the Russians attck instaed of the Russians getting the exp? This is a great idea [:)] No need to change this at all [:D]

We could even have a contest to see who could have the most powerful Pz Corp [X(]

Sarcasm aside, this definately needs to be changed. I had three of these running around togeather at one point and nothing could surive. Great fun, but not very realistic sad to say [:(]

[doomtrader]

@RandomAttack,
From the experience you are gaining only 100% and another and I personally think most important factor is the warfare doctrine level. This is 25% each level basic bonus for Germans.
So the current experience setting is causing that the unit is getting stronger too fast and is not gaining any casualties, so the experience is not reduced and is able to continue fights and gaining more experience.

[doomtrader]

Numdydar, both sides are gaining experience, but the losses for both sides are not equal.