Barbarossa as Germans on hard level in 1.01

[doomtrader]

If you think that you are experienced player, please play Barbarossa campaign as Germans on hard level. You can keep the Soviets on normal.
It would be great to get some feedback after 30-50 turns from couple of people.
I think this setting can provide a lot of information concerning Powerful Panzers and experience.

Thanks in advance.

[rodney727]

+1 to this Doom.
I guess for me I have always played on hard, while others on here play on normal to easy and then say oh this game is to easy, look at my powerful panzers aren't I the best general ever! This game must be flawed! Just A heads up folks if you do play on hard and set the allies to easy to normal....you will fight for every PP. You can have a powerful air force or U-boat fleet but not both, just like the real WW2. Sealion? no way. I just don't have fun when I play on easy to normal and every turn I can buy a Panzer Corps...just isn't real.

[freeboy]

I hear you..
I was thinking the issue is in head to head fights with a human, against hte ai I agree that playing normal as German is silly easy

[LiquidSky]

Well...have made it to February 1942 so far with the Germans on hard.

I managed to be adjacent to Moscow by September. Took it by December (except for one city hex).

Leningrad was harder to reach....but took it in January 1942.

In the South, easily took Kiev, but was unable to reach Kharkov-Kursk-Dneprproptrovsk etc. In fact, I still havent taken Odessa, and Tallinnin.

I transferred most of the air to the desert, and took Egypt with the Italians/Rommel.

The Panzers are still fairly lethal, however, I dont have the PP's to waste on them, as every turn I would spend them on upgrading, and rebuilding my infantry into corps.

When I got the Moscow windfall, I spent it to rebuild the shattered Luftwaffe to turn it into a devestating wpn (which allowed me to take leningrad)

As it stands now, I am slowly being ground back from Bryansk, and the Russians are trying to encircle my army at Moscow. None of my panzer corps are at full strength. Only two of them have been upgraded to level 3 tech. I am railing spent infantry corps back to poland to rebuild to rail back to the front.

All in all, it feels right for the PP's to be 25% less for the Germans. I should have done the same for the Italians as well, since they have no trouble keeping their infantry at full level as corps, with a couple more Armour corps built as well (and a full airforce)

The Russians also have a 3 layer deep front of level 2 infantry corps, and a handful of tank armies. The UK seem to be totally spent as an army, and I havnt heard boo from the US yet.

I shall continue on to see if I can still push into Russia or not for Case Blue.

[LiquidSky]

Okay...Turn 36, and I think I will throw in the towel. Russians have gained level 3 infantry and are chewing me up, and making large holes in my lines. Going to restart, only this time put the axis on hard, and the Russians as well, to lessen the pp's. The british seem to be okay, so leaving them on normal.

Things I have noticed: The Russians inflict large casualties in an 2-1 or 3-1 assault, usually turning a 7 point infantry into a 3 or 4. Since I can only increase it by 10%, they can then destroy it the next turn.

Naval battles do occur, but are very tiny. The russian Baltic fleet and the Kriegsmarine have spent the time together in the baltic sea. I bombard his coastal infantry, he bombards mine...we dont fight.

(EDIT) Looked at the reports, and noticed that not a single ship was sunk from naval combat...all of them were from some sort of air bombardment.

Russian units are repaired to full so it makes it impossible to take a hex without killing it. Perhaps being able to repair only 50% in your home territory might be better. It is because of this that I cannot take out tallin, and odessa took until March 1942. Although with air, you can take any hex in this game by dropping the efficiency down to nothing.

There are some areas in Russia that are too remote for decent supply, since supply is based on distance from a city. For example, between Moscow and Novgorod along the rail line (loosely) as you approach Bezeck. Or as you get close to Sevastopol.

The Germans are too slow moving into russia. It is hard to hold to a historical timeline. I didnt even bother moving my infantry, as it was lagging too far back, instead, I would have my armour running along the rail lines, and on the next turn, when they were repaired, rail up my infantry. Even so, I never made it past Bryansk or to Kursk or even Kryvyl Rih/Meiltopol.

Anyways, as I said before, the German PP's feel about right on hard. I could not keep my armour at full strength. Or my airforce. I had to spend the points on keeping my infantry army at full corp strength.

Oh yes, infantry divisions are useless in Russia. They will die.

The experience level on my tanks is all at or very near to 100. However, this is very misleading as my strongest panzer corp is at 76%. Most are below 50% so they would lose the exp if I repair them.

[Greyshaft]

ORIGINAL: LiquidSky
...
Oh yes, infantry divisions are useless in Russia. They will die ...

They are useful for scouting if you play with Fog of War

[gwgardner]

I echo Liquidsky's observations, across the board. He said it all succinctly and thoroughly.

[Razz1]

So are you inferring that supply is too constrained now?

Or do you need more time and experience in a couple of games to determine supply is too constrained?

[gwgardner]

I think he's saying that in some parts of the Eastern front map, distances between cities is too far, for sustained offensives.

[doomtrader]

IIUC, the conclusion is that there are no uber panzers and the Germans are experiencing lot of problems supplying their units?

[LiquidSky]

The panzers are still uber....or rather, can be uber. I dont think it is in the best interests of the German player to keep throwing PP's at them to keep them that way, though. But there will be some people who may and lose when they find they dont have the infantry to cover the flanks. I find that three panzer corps hitting a major city wont take it without sustaining a fair bit of losses, so it is not a sustainable strategy. I would say leave them be for now.

As for the supply....the areas of russia it seems to occur in are probably natural areas for the Germans to have some difficulty in, so I am not too concerned about it...except for taking sevastapol.....if the Russians put real units in the city and two forts, the Germans will have great difficulty fighting there way in at the limited supply level.
Hmm..if you up the supply levels globaly, would that also increase the number of AP's the Germans have across the front? That would help too. Or make a supply depot unit that can be plopped down somewhere on the map and act like a city for supply. Restricted by expense or event to limit the number.

I would not like to see the Germans able to isolate a city and continue on with full supply though...

On another note, instead of starting a new Barbarossa scenario last night, I started playing around with the consts.ini file to try and make naval combat more deadly.....

I upped the NavalEngagement value from 30 to 90, and changed the CV damage from 5 to 10 and the BB from 4 to 5 to see what happened.
Put the whole Kriegsmarine and subs in the English Channel with transports.....all sunk. But then they had the Engage button ticked, and decided to fight round 2 against the British.

Okay..maybe a bit too harsh. So I toned it down to 50 and raised the Retreat percentage from 25 to 50. Kriegsmarine lasts about a month or longer if engage button is not ticked.

Now it takes about 4 weeks to destroy the navy, and you do an awful lot of damage (without sinking) the first time you fight. Occasionally the CVs or BB's will outright sink something. So it feels better. Against the Italians, the British will eventually sink them all, but do take a fair bit of damage in the process.

And air power is rather deadly to larger fleets (the larger the fleet, the more damage the aircraft do) so it is possible for the Italian/Germans to make an effort to control the Med. (at some cost to the Italian fleet).