Options_88 - Planning Phase

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n01487477
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Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by n01487477 »

The "Option_88" mod is a PBEM only scenario.(The AI can't deal with the numerous conversions, on both sides.)

The premise of the Mod is to allow both sides more options and flexibility in ship & plane building under new economic and ground warfare constraints. This has been done in what we think is a sensible manner by not adding ships unless it is balanced by breaking up other tonnage/durability. The plane list has been somewhat simplified and the new economic multipliers and cargo modifications make for a more challenging game economically. The Allies will also have more control over production. The extended map Stacking limits and other static LCU modifiers have been applied, which will slow land combat down and hopefully give a more historical feel to China and Burma.
The Japanese have a slightly better mid-end war position with the rejection of the BB Yamato ,Musashi and CV Shinano blue prints allowing other classes of ship to be built in their place. The new ship build allows the production of "empty hulls", which upon arrival can be converted to a class of ship within the constraints of tonnage/durability stats we've allowed. There are trade off's to the system and careful analysis is needed. We've also added a couple of different ship classes.

The IJN/A plane list has been modified, simplified and in some cases expanded to deal with the realities of "AE"-the game in hindsight, rather than "AE"-the simulator. R&D has also been made harder (my thoughts - 1. later dates 2.Single step) I haven't decided fully about this yet, but R&D is too easy as it stands and I wanted to try something new. There are also minimal "free" planes.

The Allies gain more CV's in the 'dry period' between the Wasp & Essex class CV's, through a removal of some CL class ships. On map production of supplies particularly from North America has been staged in a way to simulate going from a peace footing to a war stance. Early war production is limited and some logistical decisions will need to be made. On map aircraft production has been expanded to give the Allied player a better ability to challenge the Japanese earlier. And some convoys will add additional planes at certain times.
Some Crucial land bases have also had their VP's and raw materials increased to stimulate the player into more defensive actions.

Econ Multipliers have changed. Some Oil and Resource Centres have been relocated (not always historical to produce some other interesting theatres). Also, Cargo size reduction for most of the merchant fleet and (maybe tonnage reduction too) mean that more ships and fuel is needed to transport vital raw materials. With this additional fuel requirement, we're trying to balance the economy for that.

Other errata:
[*]Allied 4e's bombs have been rendered less accurate or powerful. Using Nemo's stick principle.
[*]Devices have proper upgrade paths.
[*]Secret blueprints from the Nazi's have been smuggled into Japan for 2 additional LB and Okha rocketry.
[*]CV aircraft loadout's have been decreased ?? I have the feeling that this is overpowered as it is ... Well we're thinking about this, but maybe with the new air combat rounds being trialled by MichaelM this might not be needed.
[*]Some Lcu's have been altered giving the Japanese a better Amphib position later into the war.
[*]Cargo ships are in line with DaBabes_C (30% reduction) but also tonnage has been reduced for more docking ability.

(Designer's notes: Based on Big_Babes_B and C with a twist of The Reluctant Admiral and AltMod thrown in. Some ideas have also been borrowed from Nemo121. Production is 'on' for this scenario)

Scenario Designers: Michael (NY59Giants), Damian (n01487477)& Eddie (sulusea) for some Art.
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I'm posting this now even though we are some time away for us to collaborate and get feedback from the forum. I'll also need some playtesters for small map economic modification when ready.
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JeffroK
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by JeffroK »

Should be good Damian  et al, especially to see how allie air production pans out.
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sanderz
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by sanderz »

This sounds really interesting - shame there won't be ai for it :(

If you don't mind a total noob asking lots of dumb questions i'd be happy to help with the economic testing
Mac Linehan
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by Mac Linehan »

Damien -

I missed this post.

You have some seriously experienced Gents on your Team. I am very interested in following development, especially as it has elements of Babes, RA, AltMod and Nemo121 added to the mix.

Are you considering using the DBB map or extended map?

Look forward to more updates!

Keep at it, Gents!

Mac
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John 3rd
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by John 3rd »

I would gladly volunteer my services to help with this.

With RA 4.0 out and there being little chance of another version, I am between Mods. Perfect war is slowly developing but I have the time if you need.
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by n01487477 »

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

I would gladly volunteer my services to help with this.

With RA 4.0 out and there being little chance of another version, I am between Mods. Perfect war is slowly developing but I have the time if you need.
Thanks John -

Problem is getting enough time for Michael and I to really jump forward at present as he's waiting for my economic changes which are quite radical for the Allied side. Then they have to be tested on the Japanese side too.

I wonder if you'd be more interested in my second mod which I've termed "ThePacific". It will follow the action from the first invasion of Rabaul, Guadal, Aleutians, Midway, Darwin, End of Guadal and the walk up the Solomons into the Marianna's. I see that the DBabes guys are also doing something similar but I think I've got some gas to give it something interesting with points and variance. The map will basically include Tokyo across to Kodiak down to French Cal across to Darwin... And I want to delve into some scripting for our AI players. My big problem here is either to go semi/full-hist OOB or just a balanced approach for fun gameplay.

Anyway, maybe we can have a bit of a PM session or round table with Michael(NY) to see how I can regain focus on these two mod idea's.
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n01487477
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by n01487477 »

ORIGINAL: Mac Linehan

Damien -

I missed this post.

You have some seriously experienced Gents on your Team. I am very interested in following development, especially as it has elements of Babes, RA, AltMod and Nemo121 added to the mix.

Are you considering using the DBB map or extended map?

Look forward to more updates!

Keep at it, Gents!

Mac
Hi Mac -
Been a while and we should catchup sometime...

Extended Map definately [;)]

Cheers
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n01487477
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by n01487477 »

ORIGINAL: sanderz

This sounds really interesting - shame there won't be ai for it :(

If you don't mind a total noob asking lots of dumb questions i'd be happy to help with the economic testing
Thanks -
I'll be in touch pretty soon. Would like some of your idea's about the econ structure too.
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n01487477
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by n01487477 »

ORIGINAL: JeffK

Should be good Damian  et al, especially to see how allie air production pans out.
I'm thinking of reducing the number of models for the Allies (sort of closer to stock -witp but having variants that increase the overall on map production) ... just floating an idea plus Michael wants some convoys with aircraft too. Lastly the On-map production will have better upgrades so you can choose between what you want more of.
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by ny59giants »

I have very few changes left to implement. I "stole" some of the ground unit changes from RA and offered input on the "empty hull" concept which was mostly Damian's idea. I was always a big fan of the various RHS from WITP as it had some good ideas on Allied production. Most of the changes to ships have been done already. Damian has ideas on production and economics which I'm also waiting to see. I don't think we will be doing much in way of airframe changes like John and FatR did with RA.
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John 3rd
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by John 3rd »

It is always nice when somewhat who STOLE something ADMITS it! Michael: Have you sacrificed a cat yet for the game???

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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by John 3rd »

Damian: I might be interested in what you propose but it won't be easy to do...

Email me when you get the chance!
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RE: Options_88 - Planning Phase

Post by n01487477 »

After 8mths of sporadically making and a lot longer in the seminal stage; I'm getting pretty close to releasing this puppy. I originally played Empires Ablaze (a Nemo121 mod for witp) back in 2007 and was inspired with the options and pitfalls that Nemo introduced. At the time, being deeply involved in developing Tracker I put aside some thoughts I had on some economic changes and shipbuilding with empty hulls. Fast forward to 2011 and Michael (Ny59G) and I set about making a new mod which we've aptly named "Options_88". It is created in the spirit of developing economic changes for both sides and allowing the player to change the OOB of the units they're fighting with.

I thought I'd start writing about it to get some feedback. So, today I will talk about the Ship Build - followed by Planes&Airgrps later in the week, then Ground and finally the economic model (which is the lynch pin that holds it all together)...

At the outset I used Babes_C template, mixed in some RA and some of my own designs from the IJN drawing board.

So my premise was that the 2 Yamato's were not built (although there is the option for the CVShinano to become a Yamato(it was slated as the third anyway). With that extra 466 durability I allocated it into a variety of classes and allowed the concept of "Empty Hulls" to be built, from there the player chooses a type of ship to fit out with reasonable Tonne specs. Durability and Max sppeed changes affect the amount of float and engine damage accrued during the conversion and this is assessed when giving the conversion time. You can see this in the xls below.

A little more capacity was added - but I tried to keep basically within the confines of what might have been possible. I could have used the durability from the Shinano - but felt the player should have the ability to build it or a BB if they wanted.

Next I've changed the durability, cruise speed, range and fuel req. for most of the capital IJN and USN ships. I also changed some of the a/c load capacity to CV classes. Going a little off track here, but I've been thinking about the whole late war issue with the 200 pass rule...I was going to have all the CAG's and all the land based A/G reduce to half the size in '44 (this is still being rolled around as an idea to reduce the prob + other solutions I'll talk about in the Air review).

Anyway, I digress - It was surprising that I found the IJN must having been using very inefficient powerplants cf. the USN (or my research was faulty). The IJN CV's are a little faster than the USN, less range on the whole and higher fuel consumption.

CV's that can be converted to will have organic groups introduced earlier in most cases as land based at the port of arrival and the player will need to train these groups up before deployment. You can also have empty hulls that have planes assigned and once converted can be available - but it is a bit more tricky to implement. So, I went with what works easier.

I had also wanted to get more accurate data on Torpedo loads for CV's but there is little on the net; but I had thought of allowing the IJN the ability to reduce a/c load/range(?) and increase torps for in-class conversions that can be set instantly. So each class has 2 types - long range/lower torps & more a/c OR shorter/more T's and less a/c ... anyway just floating and idea.

On the Merchant side I went for a more conservative Babes_C approach of a 20% reduction in cargo rather than 30% (although I may reduce this to 15%) and I offset the IJN increased fuel consumption and the need for more shipping with a 10% reduction in fuel consumption. Which I will test before release. I also wanted the player to want to build more and actually have to build more merchants - which I think I've achieved through the economic model. I'm also thinking about some more TK/AO converts too.

Also, I wanted to allow more specialisation for DD's. So pathing of different platforms (ASW/Patrol/AA/FT's).

Lastly for the IJN, I've used Nemo's idea of Shinyo Kamikaze boats to protect the mainland - they might need to be tweaked a bit cause Nemo liked a big bang for the buck.

The Allies also get some more converts, although I haven't fleshed this out fully ... maybe a few suggestions here ??

As you can also see I need some names for CV's, DD's etc ... I can use forum member names or ???

Okay - that's it for me until later in the week where I reveal some of the changes to planes, engines & airgroups. And some new ideas that I hope you find exciting!


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