Pelton vs 8421 1.06 1943

[Peltonx]

Turn 48 The Great retreat continues east?

German armament Pts in pool: 120,000
German manpower in pool: 80,000
Manpower points over run during 1942:40
SHC units destroyed after November 1st 1941: 72
Enemy KIA this turn: ,000 Enemy KIA:4,250,000
SHC OOB: 6,907,000
SHC net OOB change: +
GHC OOB: 3,439,000
GHC net OOB change:


8421 Has been retreating every turn 1 to 2 hexes in the south starting with snow until now.

After huge losses during 1941 3.5 million and a limp blizzard 8421 has rebuilt the Red Machine to almost 7 million men. I have not wasted any panzers on thrusts and now have probably my strongest army of any game to date for the summer of 1942.

It appears 8421 has desided to stand his ground with several counter attacks along the front. I as with most games hold my strongest forces in the center of the map.

This is probably my most boring game todate. Allot of dancing around and not much fighting.

Mybee next turn the struggle will begin?

[Peltonx]

AGC

[Peltonx]

AGS

[Farfarer61]

Please post your losses and his losses at the end of the Blizzard if you dont mind. I have tried ( with varied success) German Blizzard strategies across the board near complete von Robinstein to hard hold and fight, but still lose 500,00 to 1,000,000.

[Peltonx]

ORIGINAL: Farfarer

Please post your losses and his losses at the end of the Blizzard if you dont mind. I have tried ( with varied success) German Blizzard strategies across the board near complete von Robinstein to hard hold and fight, but still lose 500,00 to 1,000,000.

Your going to loss 500,000 even if the russian player does basicly nothing.

The blizzard is more about morale then losses. Anything under 750,000 I would consider a good winter, plus keeping him to min attacks. Lossing less then 6 units to pockets. 1 million is probably average.

Slow steady retreat is best tactic, pull 12 to 15 high morale infantry units off line and 20 or so panzer units.


Pelton

[Farfarer61]

Thanks. Just curious at what point one doesn't say frack it and head back to Poland ? 1M men saved, you build your 1944 fort lines as a winter hobby, then restart in june 42?

[Peltonx]

Turn 49

German armament Pts in pool: 127,000
German manpower in pool: 85,000
SHC units destroyed after November 1st 1941: 72
SHC units in a pocket:27
Enemy KIA this turn: 100,000 Enemy KIA:4,344,000
SHC OOB: 6,899,000
SHC net OOB change: -6000
GHC OOB: 3,421,000
GHC net OOB change: -18,000

8421 tries running again, but its clear weather and you cant out run tanks.

For the loss of only 204 tanks and 40,000 men 24 divisions and 3 corps are cut off. More then

I figured this be and easy pocket during spring before kicking off the summer O. I have to get in position to use my infantry to attack. 8421 is still retreating several hexes a turn.

I could have easly punched a hole through the lines and broke out, but with mud around the corner I figured it be a waste and instead took a bite out the bear heheh.

[Peltonx]

Turn 50

German armament Pts in pool: 105,000
German manpower in pool: 92,000
SHC units destroyed after November 1st 1941: 72
SHC units in a pocket:27
Enemy KIA this turn: 33,000 Enemy KIA:4,377,000
SHC OOB: 6,995,000
SHC net OOB change:
GHC OOB: 3,393,000
GHC net OOB change:

Recon reports 5 tank corp. and 1 Calvary corp. in the Russian breakthrough!
There are another 2 Calvary in the pocket along with 25 infantry divisions. There are also 5 Calvary corp. spread along the southern front all within 2 hexes of front lines.

I am thinking he had no idea the next 2 turns were mud or why would he expose he best units like that? Maybe the thought he was cutting a railhead? It did but I have almost every rail hex converted which means there are 2 other rail heads in that part of front so it did nothing. I wish this turn was clear I could have easily bagged 6 more corp. plus other units here Not sure what has thinking at this point other then I am very happy the fighting has started finally and end to the boredom.

My thrust was 3 wide so I could extract units as needed. I have pulled out 12 tank units and all of 18th army is on the east side of the thrust. He picked a great spot to attack, for me!

[Peltonx]

Turn 52

German armament Pts in pool: 104,000
German manpower in pool: 82,000
SHC units destroyed after November 1st 1941: 99
SHC units in a pocket: 23
Enemy KIA this turn: 340,000 Enemy KIA:4,691,000
SHC OOB: 6,853,000
SHC net OOB change: - 223,000
GHC OOB: 3,486,000
GHC net OOB change: - 8,000


The 2nd Spring pocket has 5 tanks corp, 1 cav corp and 17 Rifle divisions of which 2 are guards. The 2nd pocket was formed for the loss of only 101 tanks. The 1st pocket was formed for the loss of only 204 tanks. So for the loss of only 305 tanks, I have formed 2 pockets close to 500,000 men , plus afvs and guns. These 2 pockets = over 700 AP pts which is 11+ turns to make up and the morale of these units will be trashed for another 6 weeks after that.

[krupp_88mm]

ORIGINAL: Pelton
The 2nd Spring pocket has 5 tanks corp, 1 cav corp and 17 Rifle divisions of which 2 are guards. The 2nd pocket was formed for the loss of only 101 tanks. The 1st pocket was formed for the loss of only 204 tanks. So for the loss of only 305 tanks, I have formed 2 pockets close to 500,000 men , plus afvs and guns.

all this talk about loss ratios has rarity impressed

[Peltonx]

Turn 53

German armament Pts in pool: 81,000
German manpower in pool: 94,000
SHC units destroyed after November 1st 1941: 99
SHC units in a pocket: 23
Enemy KIA this turn: 22,000 Enemy KIA:4,713,000
SHC OOB: 6,978,000
SHC net OOB change: + 125,000
GHC OOB: 3,502,000
GHC net OOB change: +16,000

Pocket holds and units are ready for next pocket. 8421 has finally pulled the rest of his corp units of the front lines after the painful loss of 9 corp.

[Peltonx]

Turn 54

German armament Pts in pool: 91,000
German manpower in pool: 87,000
SHC units destroyed after November 1st 1941: 122
SHC units in a pocket:0
Enemy KIA this turn: 224,000 Enemy KIA:4,937,000
SHC OOB: 6,785,000
SHC net OOB change: - 193,000
GHC KIA this turn: 00,000 GHC KIA:1,862,000
GHC OOB: 3,481,000
GHC net OOB change: -21,000

One of my best games ever as far as killing men almost 5 million, but 8421 still has a massive army 6.8 million. Bigger then any SHC army pre 1.05.
8421 is building the right units also, mech corp and cav. No rifle corps and he has massive amounts of rifle divisions.
The army Flaviusx keeps telling poeple to build. 8421 has solid lines every wheres and allot of depth where ever I have panzers.

I had no snow pockets so this game is 100% 1.06. I did the clear weather pockets only.

8421 knows the game mechanics/logistic, but his tactics seem a litte weak. 8421 is milking allot more men from
the current system then anyone I have every played.

The one up side so far it will cost 8421 about 660+ AP pts to replase his lost units or 11+ turns. 1942 is mainly about the AP crunch. If as the GHC you can drop the SHC unit count that thins out the lines. This will cause pocketing to be easyer over time one can weaken the Red Machine and hopefully you can gain space and roll up manpower centers, with Moscow being the end game of summer.

AGN: I am tring to push things towards Moscow, but there are no weak spots in his lines. 3 deep everywheres. Probably going to have to pull back to fort line and wait to see if AGS can open up something.

[Peltonx]

AGC: I finish off pocket and make a push towards Tomboy. I manage to break through but have nothing left to exploit.
8421 lines seem to have no weak spots.

My forses are in good shape, only 1/2 my mech units made the push and only 2 infantry corp.

Looks like this will be a very hard nut to crack.

[Peltonx]

AGS: Basicly holding the line.

[Flaviusx]

This is more the way to do it. But he could improve even on this. Since your panzers are all committed to one spot, the entire rest of the front can act like a reserve and he could easily strip units from elsewhere to flood your potential breakthrough zone. He doesn't actually need to be 3 deep everywhere. Although he may want to keep some forts in the rear even in the quiet spots.

In the absence of mobile forces a single line can stop the Axis or at least keep it contained. The guys in the rear can dig in and prevent fort decay, but that's not strictly speaking necessary. Actually I'd be putting some mobile forces in those quiet spots and get them blooded with easy attacks.

He's keeping his mobile corps away from the front line, and that's the way to do it. (Even if you're doing hit and runs with them.)

[Peltonx]

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

This is more the way to do it. But he could improve even on this. Since your panzers are all committed to one spot, the entire rest of the front can act like a reserve and he could easily strip units from elsewhere to flood your potential breakthrough zone. He doesn't actually need to be 3 deep everywhere. Although he may want to keep some forts in the rear even in the quiet spots.

In the absence of mobile forces a single line can stop the Axis or at least keep it contained. The guys in the rear can dig in and prevent fort decay, but that's not strictly speaking necessary. Actually I'd be putting some mobile forces in those quiet spots and get them blooded with easy attacks.

He's keeping his mobile corps away from the front line, and that's the way to do it. (Even if you're doing hit and runs with them.)

He is doing all of what you preach Pastor Flaviusx.

I am a few turns behind.

8421 is a convert of yours.

I write what I think the same day as turn. So even my thought are a few days lagging.

The random server games yield some gold from time to time.

Pelton

[Seminole]

The one up side so far it will cost 8421 about 660+ AP pts to replase his lost units or 11+ turns.

You know that at various times the Soviets get bonus wads of AP, right?

Can Flavius or someone else indicate when those times are?

[Flaviusx]

There's Voronezh Front and SW Front in 1942. 250 APs. A couple more fronts after that (Steppe in 43 and I believe another one in 44) but that's about it. The big AP dumps come in 41.

[Peltonx]

Turn 55

German armament Pts in pool: 44,000
German manpower in pool: 83,000
SHC units destroyed after November 1st 1941: 122
SHC units in a pocket:1
Enemy KIA this turn: 32,000 Enemy KIA:4,969,000
SHC OOB: 6,907,000
SHC net OOB change: +121,000
GHC KIA this turn: 41,000 GHC KIA:1,903,000
GHC OOB: 3,461,000
GHC net OOB change: -20,000

Despite 600,000 in loses over the last 4 turn 8421 has mounted 2 small breakthroughs.

Other then his foolish tactical attacks during the clear turns, his army would be over 7.5 million men. Which would be larger then any army I have faced to date on July 1st 1942 including the 12 GC 41-45 1.04. The 7 million was larger then Hooopers and that was under 1.04. It would appear 8421 has found a way around the lower manpower numbers?

Clearly 8421 knows the ins and outs of the game mechanics better then both Kamil, Hoooper and anyone else for that matter I have played or seen in any AAR's post 1.04.

I have pulled out of the thrust I made last turn and moved 1 panzer and 1 infantry corp to the northern breakthrough.

I also left 1 panzer an infantry corp near Lipetsk. The rest of the panzers and infantry moved between the river bends to start clearing that out as I can defend the flanks and this will shorten my lines. Plus pick off manpower centers.

Most of the infantry morale now is over 70, but i have a 12 units still in low 50's.

Pelton

[Peltonx]

Southern breakthrough.