Simple Balancer Fantasy (SBF) Mod

[Shark7]

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

Question for anyone out there who can answer this.

I need a naming scheme for some ficticious British auxiliaries. Basically I'm creating a class of auxiliaries which can be converted into each other or CVLs. I have a similar series of US ships I'm calling the "Bay" class, named after bays in the US. I need a naming convention for the British auxiliaries which isn't used by any other ships and which I could derive a good 50-100 names from. Basically the series would consist of AO, AS, AD, AV, AR and CVL versions. Here's a pic of what I'm talking about:

Currently UK auxiliaries carry a 'Fort' name, a "***leaf", or "Wave' name

Here's the list from Haze Grey and Underway: http://hazegray.org/

Fort Victoria, Fort George, Fort Rosalie, Fort Austin, Oakleaf, Brambleleaf, Bayleaf, Orangeleaf, Wave Knight, Wave Ruler, Grey Rover, Gold Rover, and Black Rover

The naming convention is probably the same as it was during WWII (I know I've seen a 'Fort' named UK ship in the game).

[DuckofTindalos]

Most of those were used IRL, but if Gary is standardizing anyway, they would work.

[JWE]

ORIGINAL: Terminus
That's sound. But where in the ************* is the RN getting the resources to build that many auxiliaries?

A good point T. There was nobody, nowhere, building a high seas fleet train except the USN. And even the USN didn't push it to the hard. There was onesey-twoseys in the RN but gimme a break; fully fleshed out auxiliaries is somebody's fever dream. They never would have happened. So forget them.

Ciao. J

[DuckofTindalos]

Well, Gary DOES call this a "fantasy" mod, so...[:D]

[GaryChildress]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Well, Gary DOES call this a "fantasy" mod, so...[:D]

I have no pretenses about the fantasy part. About the only thing true to RL here will be that it's played on Earth and not Planet Neptune. Although, now that I think of it, what if Humanity had arisen on Neptune and there were no naval treaties? [:D]

Seriously, though, I know my mod is fantasy but at least it doesn't feature space lizards or the carrier Nimitz teleporting back into time. Basically it's going to take into account that there is virtually no depression and no isolationism and navies can get a bit more of what they would like to have. If Britain could field some 35 1st rate dreadnaughts back in the 10 year period 1906 - 1916 then I would think the latent ability must exist somewhere to have built more in the 20 year period between the wars. This mod is a no holds barred world in the period between WW1 and WW2. Nobody is holding back anything.

[GaryChildress]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

That's sound. But where in the ************* is the RN getting the resources to build that many auxiliaries?

OK. maybe not 50 to 100 ships, more like maybe 20-30. My Royal Navy might be short a few cruisers as a result.

[DuckofTindalos]

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

ORIGINAL: Terminus

That's sound. But where in the ************* is the RN getting the resources to build that many auxiliaries?

OK. maybe not 50 to 100 ships, more like maybe 20-30. My Royal Navy might be short a few cruisers as a result.

And cruisers are what the navy of a world-spanning colonial power needs more than anything.

[DuckofTindalos]

Remember than pre-WWI navies consisted of fewer different types of ships than WWII navies. You can't equate operating that many ships in 1914 with doing the same in 1941.

Also, crew requirements for capital ships went up as capabilities were added. The Iron Duke had a crew of less than 1,000 whilst the WWII King George V needed 1,500-1,600. It all has to fit together.

[GaryChildress]

OK. Maybe the RN can do without a large fleet train. I'll leave their auxiliary force to its historical size. Between you and JWE I'll heed to your advice.

ORIGINAL: Terminus

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

ORIGINAL: Terminus

That's sound. But where in the ************* is the RN getting the resources to build that many auxiliaries?

OK. maybe not 50 to 100 ships, more like maybe 20-30. My Royal Navy might be short a few cruisers as a result.

And cruisers are what the navy of a world-spanning colonial power needs more than anything.

[DuckofTindalos]

At least a large pre-war one... Once the British colonies start getting under new management, however...

[GaryChildress]

OK. So the british will basically keep what they have om auxiliaries, however, the US and Japan are going to produce more.

[mike scholl 1]

If you really want to "balance" things Gary, go through and give the Allied units decent CO's and training levels. Then you won't have to give them a bunch of extra units..., the ones they have will actually be able to fight.

[DuckofTindalos]

How do you get 10 more knots out of the CVL variant? Also, what sort of tonnage are we talking, and when does production of them begin?

[GaryChildress]

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1

If you really want to "balance" things Gary, go through and give the Allied units decent CO's and training levels. Then you won't have to give them a bunch of extra units..., the ones they have will actually be able to fight.

As stated several posts back, I'm doing away with the "balance" part. BAsically the chips will fall wherever they will. But the Japanese will still have a bit more experience to start because of the war in China and the Allies will still have the superior numbers.

[GaryChildress]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

How do you get 10 more knots out of the CVL variant? Also, what sort of tonnage are we talking, and when does production of them begin?

1. Improved machinery.

2. talking about relatively the same tonnage as Neosho.

3. building starts in the mid thirties on through the war. The Japanese will have all their auxiliaries listed above already in place for the war.

[dwg]

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress
I need a naming convention for the British auxiliaries which isn't used by any other ships and which I could derive a good 50-100 names from.

There are a few good suggestions already, but another with historical precedent would be the Knights of the Round Table, wiki lists around 40 and I'm not sure that's exhaustive, add in other Arthurian figures and you can definitely get well north of 50 names (though I'm not personally convinced RFA Sir Ywain the Bastard would have made it past the Admiralty Ships Names Committee )

[dwg]

ORIGINAL: Terminus
Once the British colonies start getting under new management, however...

That's a point worth bearing in mind; without the Naval Treaties the threat levels to the Dominions go up, and need to be responded to. The Dominions, which are under 'new managament' by this time and have been recognised as such since 1907, need to respond to any arms races in their backyards. A good basis for this might be Jellicoe's post-WWI assessment of Dominion Naval defences. His full plan, if put into play, would have seen major base development across the Dominions, not to mention a full-blown Pacific Fleet based out of Singapore. Even without the full fleet, a complete set of naval bases adds considerable to the Commonwealth's ability to support a British Pacific Fleet deploying from Europe. See here

[DuckofTindalos]

Actually, "new management" for me meant "the Japs take them once war kicks off"...

[dwg]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Actually, "new management" for me meant "the Japs take them once war kicks off"...

Ah, not quite the same thing

[DuckofTindalos]

Nope, but your point is very valid as well. The Brits were late to the point of criminality in expanding Singapore as a base.