retrofit star base?

[malisle]

I always use custom research star bases and armed mining stations. With new techology researched,
they become inefficient and the only way to upgrade them is to scrap them and build another one, or cheat using editor.

Is it now possible (after all those patches) to retrofit a custom design Starbase/Mining station that is placed over some planet or in deep space? In older versions there was a retrofit button but it never worked. Is it now fixed? If it is, are there any special condtions that need to be fulfilled in order for that to work? Retrofit using Constructor maybe?

[Dracus]

Nope, you still have to scrap and rebuild

[w1p]

I concur - still have to scrap and rebuild. Would be nice if you could upgrade, your minin bases with maxos blaster's end up a little outdated once you have titan beams

[malisle]

Do the devs know about this?
I remember this problem existed long ago. Since it wasn't fixed in the series of patches that dealt with design and upgrading,they either don't know about it (which I kinda doubt), or it is to complicated for them to solve (which I doubt even more)...

[Fishers of Men]

If the mining stations, etc. could be set on auto retrofit in the Design screen, that would be very helpful. But remember, once the government builds these stations and incurs the cost, they are turned over to the civilians and they have to pay the maintenance costs. So I guess they are not in our control at that point.

[feelotraveller]

ORIGINAL: malisle

Do the devs know about this?
I remember this problem existed long ago. Since it wasn't fixed in the series of patches that dealt with design and upgrading,they either don't know about it (which I kinda doubt), or it is to complicated for them to solve (which I doubt even more)...

...or it was a design decision about how they intended the game to be played.

I say this because I can assure you that they know about 'this' and don't consider it a problem in need of fixing.

[onomastikon]

ORIGINAL: feelotraveller

ORIGINAL: malisle

Do the devs know about this?
I remember this problem existed long ago. Since it wasn't fixed in the series of patches that dealt with design and upgrading,they either don't know about it (which I kinda doubt), or it is to complicated for them to solve (which I doubt even more)...

...or it was a design decision about how they intended the game to be played.

I say this because I can assure you that they know about 'this' and don't consider it a problem in need of fixing.

There is, however, still one issue: These bases still have an active "retrofit" button you can push, which is not only ineffectual but misleading. If "this" is WAI, then the button has to go. (That's been in my list of issues for a while.)

[malisle]

ORIGINAL: onomastikon

ORIGINAL: feelotraveller

ORIGINAL: malisle

Do the devs know about this?
I remember this problem existed long ago. Since it wasn't fixed in the series of patches that dealt with design and upgrading,they either don't know about it (which I kinda doubt), or it is to complicated for them to solve (which I doubt even more)...

...or it was a design decision about how they intended the game to be played.

I say this because I can assure you that they know about 'this' and don't consider it a problem in need of fixing.

There is, however, still one issue: These bases still have an active "retrofit" button you can push, which is not only ineffectual but misleading. If "this" is WAI, then the button has to go. (That's been in my list of issues for a while.)

Exactly. If I knew that the retrofiting was as it was intended, I would never made a post about it. Retrofit button that changes from black&white to colour when the new design is available led me to believe that something should happen when pressed.

[feelotraveller]

Yes it's true that the button can mislead.  It happens also with private sector ships.
 
I never actually suffered from the impression that bases not at colonies could retrofit.  Maybe something was said in the galactopedia?

[jpwrunyan]

Point remains, you should be able to retrofit non-planetary bases. Either using constructor ships or, if the base has construction docks, using the retrofit button.

One game, i made my resort bases have construction yards and component fabricators thinking i would then be able to retrofit them. Nope.

[Kayoz]

ORIGINAL: jpwrunyan

Point remains, you should be able to retrofit non-planetary bases. Either using constructor ships or, if the base has construction docks, using the retrofit button.

One game, i made my resort bases have construction yards and component fabricators thinking i would then be able to retrofit them. Nope.

iirc, the argument is that refitting bases "in the field" (not orbiting a colony) is too complex a task for a constructor ship. While I disagree with that premise - since replacing a few systems is far less complex than manufacturing the entire facility from raw materials - I accept that it's a design decision that isn't entirely unreasonable.

[feelotraveller]

What point?
 
I see no 'should' here.  If all you mean is 'i want to be able to' that's fine but it does not form any imperative.

[w1p]

I want to be able to, and I should be able to, surely? I can retrofit everything else and also build these things from scratch but can't retrofit them?

[jpwrunyan]

Jeezus fellowtraveller, semantic argue much? At least try to be funny next time.
W1p, thank you for clarifying what *should* have been obvious. I appreciate someone like yourself whose brain is set to understand a person's implicit meaning by default.

Oh! Wait... Oh noes!!! i did it again!!!!
Bad imperative! BAD!

Hey, lets all nitpick eachother in the most boring way possible instead of talking about the game!!! Because that's not soul-witheringly depressing at all.
If you are about to reply to this post seriously, let me inform you now that YHBT YHL HAND

[feelotraveller]

ORIGINAL: w1p

I want to be able to, and I should be able to, surely? I can retrofit everything else and also build these things from scratch but can't retrofit them?

Try reftrofitting a private ship, or make changes to a found high tech ship (while preserving the high tech components). So you can't retrofit everything else.

With the current game design you are forced to make some choices. Do I want maximum mining extraction now for extra overheads later? Do I put enough weapons on my non-retrofittable bases so that they can defend themselves late game, or just enough for immediate pirate tech levels? Etc.

I think it a good game design. And part of game design is building in limitations to make it interesting. That's largely what tech trees are all about. You may as well argue that you surely should have the highest tech right from the start of the game. [:D]

[feelotraveller]

ORIGINAL: jpwrunyan

Jeezus fellowtraveller, semantic argue much? At least try to be funny next time.
W1p, thank you for clarifying what *should* have been obvious. I appreciate someone like yourself whose brain is set to understand a person's implicit meaning by default.

Oh! Wait... Oh noes!!! i did it again!!!!
Bad imperative! BAD!

Hey, lets all nitpick eachother in the most boring way possible instead of talking about the game!!! Because that's not soul-witheringly depressing at all.
If you are about to reply to this post seriously, let me inform you now that YHBT YHL HAND

I am talking about the game.

Just because you want something doesn't make it obvious, or even sorely needed.

If there is a reason for your 'should' state it. If there isn't don't pretend your preference is the word of god.

[Mright]

Wait... Why can't private ships and bases be retrofitted by the private sector? It would be in their direct interest to do so and would increase their profit margins long term while costing in the short term. The cost would be indirectly passed on to the gov as they would see a reduced income from taxing and production as the base was upgrading but in the long run it would increase revenue.

@feelotraveller I have to say that I think it SHOULD be in the game, but I don't know that it should be done by the government. However some of the more controlling governments certainly should be able to do this. I am of cores speaking from a logical perspective, I have no way of knowing how this would effect game play unless it was attempted.

[Lex Talionias]

huh, i always assumed the private sector would retrofit its own stuff. kinds dumb for them not to after all.

further more i really feel that retrofiting star bases of every variety (cept maybe private and discovered/captured ones) should be part of the game. it just seems buggy that its not!

if you REALLY need realism that badly then have it be very expensive to do, take ages and reduce/stop entirely the stations function.

simply put all this feature is gonna do it make me build a new one next to the old one then blow up the old one, that is micro management, not good rp and not strategic in any way shape or form.

its more annoying then anything else in my opinion and by the sounds of it many others as well.

[Lex Talionias]

this game is great in that you can get larger and larger scale as you go without being held back by the little details.

manually duplicating then removing every single star-base atleast 3 times in one game is gonna hold you back.

[feelotraveller]

Actually I think it's great for gameplay that most bases can't be retrofitted.  Makes me think when building a base, not just about what I want on it for now but also what will happen in the long term.  A few maxos blasters on a mining base will hold off early pirates but late game they'll just be laughing at me.  So how much should I arm the base?  Should I even bother?  Should I stack it with mining engines to maximise immediate yields or put less so I don't end up paying later for redundant components?  If I could retrofit it would take much of the interesting choices out of the picture for me.
 
As for realism I think about houses in our world.  Now maybe it's different elsewhere but out in the boondocks where I live they don't retrofit houses.  They build them and let them be; at least until they destroy them to build new ones.  It means there's some new housing here and there, and then older, and older still, and then there's the really decrepit (you know the ones pirates laugh at).  I'm sure there may be other analogies but this is enough to suggest that the mechanism is not unrealistic - given that we don't have mining bases in space 'realism' is very strange.  [:D]