Hairy Asian Experiences - GreyJoy (J) vs. Q-Ball (A)

[GreyJoy]

ORIGINAL: kjnoel

I seem to remember you earlier saying you were going to limit R&D advance to 4 months?

If so, you might be putting too much into this. The IIc is due 44/3 so, if you want to limit your advance to 43/11, you only need 400 R&D points; at the current rate of 4 per day that will only take you.....well, 100 days.

You might not be limiting yourself anymore, but if you are you might want to consider whether it's worth maintaining 500 engines in the pool?

Hi mate,

6 months is my personal HR. I understand the Tojo IIc will come earlier with these settings, but i'll stop and invest in other things as soon as everything is up and running (meaning as soon as the Tojo IIa is building regularly at 120 x month).
The idea is to have 120 R&D Tojo IIc factory working and 120 Tojo IIa producing factories.
The 6 months goal will be, on the other hand, very very difficult for the George and Frank, because you also have to accelerate the Ha-45 engine and you cannot have the benefit of being able to research a previous model in the pipeline...

[kjnoel]

I'm still finding my way with keeping the brakes on the chained airframes and getting a nice advance on the later ones, it seems to be an art!

[ny59giants]

Hi Micheal, are u sure a 1x60 R&D factory produces 2 R&D points per day and not one?
It seems so to me...looking at the results i mean

Off course I'm sure. [;)]

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

ORIGINAL: kjnoel

I seem to remember you earlier saying you were going to limit R&D advance to 4 months?

If so, you might be putting too much into this. The IIc is due 44/3 so, if you want to limit your advance to 43/11, you only need 400 R&D points; at the current rate of 4 per day that will only take you.....well, 100 days.

You might not be limiting yourself anymore, but if you are you might want to consider whether it's worth maintaining 500 engines in the pool?

Hi mate,

6 months is my personal HR. I understand the Tojo IIc will come earlier with these settings, but i'll stop and invest in other things as soon as everything is up and running (meaning as soon as the Tojo IIa is building regularly at 120 x month).
The idea is to have 120 R&D Tojo IIc factory working and 120 Tojo IIa producing factories.
The 6 months goal will be, on the other hand, very very difficult for the George and Frank, because you also have to accelerate the Ha-45 engine and you cannot have the benefit of being able to research a previous model in the pipeline...

I would research the Tojo IIb model just so you get it before going to the IIc if you have a 6 month limit. You will most likely not use the IIb, but I'm actually trying it out in my game as I haven't used it and want to see what it does. The one good thing about it is that the 12.7mm guns move to the centerline, so they are more accurate. The bad thing is that the 40mm canons will most likely not hit anything at all. I'm only making a small amount of them.

I'm in 4/43 and I've already moved the Tojo IIc up 2 months. I could have it up to 8-9 months ahead of its date if I use the engine bonus, and that is after researching through the IIb model. I believe in only researching the next plane in line with factories that can upgrade without damage (one plane family). That's my rule, but we each figure out what works for our own sense of what is right. I think of it like the IJAAF telling the researchers and manufacturers that the plane doesn't meet their specs, so they're not going to use it until it's improved, and then the next model in line is researched with the improvements. Since this is my first time this deep in a game I'm also just curious how the different models will function in various roles. You know most of this from the other side in your last game.

[kmitahj]

You get 3 'developmental points' daily from the factories and 1 for having over 500 engines in your pool. Don't let these two factories go into production and move them to the "B" model for one day before moving them to the "C" model for R&D.

In Classic WitP times researching factories of size 29-270 once repaired were always delivering exactly 1 r/d point a day. It worked the same in early versions of Witp-AE. Then a bug in one of beta patches elicited a lot of confusion. In fact some players took it as a new feature and enjoyed immensely new insane aircraft research speeds [:)]
However in the following discussion MichaelM - active developer - confirmed the bug existence and disclosed basic algorithm for aircraft research - basically identical to the one used in Classic WitP. And then some time later n01487477 brought the discovery of of engine bonus feature.
So of course it is possible that there were more silent changes (besides engine bonus) lately to the code and now basic assumption of research factory cap at size 30 no longer holds. But it is also possible that factory bonus is simply awarded per factory. Using Tracker-provided history it shouldn't be difficult to find out which possibility is true (or to conclude that none is true 'cause things are working in more complicated way).

GreyJoy - thanks for the entertaining AAR. Your (and Q-Ball counterpart) are the only AE AARs I'm currently watching day by day. Good read!
As for the engine research I suspect you won't have much problems. Researching engines in AE used to be quick and easy process (in Classic WitP it wasn't possible to research them at all) so unless it was retrofitted to match the difficulties of airframe research you should be able to achieve your goals with no much sweet.

[GreyJoy]

ORIGINAL: kmitahj

You get 3 'developmental points' daily from the factories and 1 for having over 500 engines in your pool. Don't let these two factories go into production and move them to the "B" model for one day before moving them to the "C" model for R&D.

In Classic WitP times researching factories of size 29-270 once repaired were always delivering exactly 1 r/d point a day. It worked the same in early versions of Witp-AE. Then a bug in one of beta patches elicited a lot of confusion. In fact some players took it as a new feature and enjoyed immensely new insane aircraft research speeds [:)]
However in the following discussion MichaelM - active developer - confirmed the bug existence and disclosed basic algorithm for aircraft research - basically identical to the one used in Classic WitP. And then some time later n01487477 brought the discovery of of engine bonus feature.
So of course it is possible that there were more silent changes (besides engine bonus) lately to the code and now basic assumption of research factory cap at size 30 no longer holds. But it is also possible that factory bonus is simply awarded per factory. Using Tracker-provided history it shouldn't be difficult to find out which possibility is true (or to conclude that none is true 'cause things are working in more complicated way).

GreyJoy - thanks for the entertaining AAR. Your (and Q-Ball counterpart) are the only AE AARs I'm currently watching day by day. Good read!
As for the engine research I suspect you won't have much problems. Researching engines in AE used to be quick and easy process (in Classic WitP it wasn't possible to research them at all) so unless it was retrofitted to match the difficulties of airframe research you should be able to achieve your goals with no much sweet.

Thank you kmitahj! I'm happy you're enjoyin it!

Sincerly, i'm not an experten and the whole thing seems to be beyond my capabilities... however i do see the results and try to extract a personal "rule of thumb"...

But first, i can say that the operation "Hawk" has finally begun.
Good weather over Chungking and from Hankow (the other AF at Tsuyun keeps on non operating for unknown reasons) 70 crack zeros took off for a sweep mission.
After several battles, we came back with a great result. We encountered nearly 80 enemies (P-40s, P-39s and chinese garbage) and achieved a good 42-12 in A2A in our favor...
Tomorrow two new fresh Sentais will take off (hopefully), followed in the afternoon by 170 bombers escorted by 30 Oscars. If the weather holds, we hope to clear the skies of china in 1 or 2 weeks.
Lost 7 great pilots today...too bad, i know...but you need to break some eggs for a good meal[:D]

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Apr 11, 42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Chungking , at 76,45

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid spotted at 28 NM, estimated altitude 21,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 40



Allied aircraft
I-16-III x 4
I-15-III x 10
H81-A3 x 12
Hawk 75M x 3
P-39D Airacobra x 24
P-40E Warhawk x 25


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 2 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
I-15-III: 2 destroyed
H81-A3: 1 destroyed
Hawk 75M: 1 destroyed
P-39D Airacobra: 5 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 5 destroyed



Aircraft Attacking:
10 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet

CAP engaged:
5th FG/17th FS CAF with H81-A3 (1 airborne, 3 on standby, 8 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters to 20000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 14 minutes
5th FG/27th FS CAF with I-15-III (0 airborne, 2 on standby, 7 scrambling)
2 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 1 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters to 10000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 9 minutes
11th FG/41st FS CAF with I-16-III (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 3 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters to 10000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 12 minutes
11th FG/44th FS CAF with Hawk 75M (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 2 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 1 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters to 10000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 6 minutes
AVG/2nd Sqn with P-40E Warhawk (0 airborne, 5 on standby, 18 scrambling)
5 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 2 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters to 15000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 41 minutes
35th PG/40th PS with P-39D Airacobra (0 airborne, 5 on standby, 17 scrambling)
5 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 2 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters to 10000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 43 minutes



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Chungking , at 76,45

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid spotted at 32 NM, estimated altitude 22,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 32



Allied aircraft
I-16-III x 1
I-15-III x 3
H81-A3 x 10
Hawk 75M x 1
P-39D Airacobra x 16
P-40E Warhawk x 13


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 3 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
I-15-III: 1 destroyed
H81-A3: 1 destroyed
Hawk 75M: 1 destroyed
P-39D Airacobra: 3 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 3 destroyed



Aircraft Attacking:
9 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet

CAP engaged:
5th FG/17th FS CAF with H81-A3 (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
9 plane(s) not yet engaged, 1 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 7000 and 18000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 39 minutes
AVG/2nd Sqn with P-40E Warhawk (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
5 plane(s) not yet engaged, 8 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 12000 and 15000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 85 minutes
35th PG/40th PS with P-39D Airacobra (3 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
11 plane(s) not yet engaged, 2 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 6000 and 23140.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 29 minutes
5th FG/27th FS CAF with I-15-III (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 9000 and 14000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 21 minutes
11th FG/41st FS CAF with I-16-III (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters to 22140.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 24 minutes
11th FG/44th FS CAF with Hawk 75M (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000
Raid is overhead



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Chungking , at 76,45

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid spotted at 37 NM, estimated altitude 20,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 12 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 7



Allied aircraft
I-15-III x 1
H81-A3 x 2
P-39D Airacobra x 5
P-40E Warhawk x 6


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
H81-A3: 1 destroyed
P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 3 destroyed



Aircraft Attacking:
1 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet

CAP engaged:
5th FG/17th FS CAF with H81-A3 (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 1 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters to 2000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 30 minutes
5th FG/27th FS CAF with I-15-III (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters to 8000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 11 minutes
AVG/2nd Sqn with P-40E Warhawk (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
2 plane(s) not yet engaged, 4 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 2000 and 21000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 52 minutes
35th PG/40th PS with P-39D Airacobra (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
5 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 2000 and 21000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 55 minutes




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at 82,39 (near Sian)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 53568 troops, 510 guns, 335 vehicles, Assault Value = 1376

Defending force 8106 troops, 16 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 159

Japanese adjusted assault: 992

Allied adjusted defense: 61

Japanese assault odds: 16 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), leaders(-), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
339 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 33 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled


Allied ground losses:
2511 casualties reported
Squads: 116 destroyed, 51 disabled
Non Combat: 107 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 2 disabled
Guns lost 5 (1 destroyed, 4 disabled)
Units retreated 1


Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
23rd Tank Regiment
13th Ind.Mixed Brigade
37th Division
41st Division
53rd Infantry Brigade
35th Division
13th Tank Regiment
32nd Division
8th Recon Regiment
1st Army
6th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
Botanko Hvy Gun Regiment
11th Field Artillery Regiment

Defending units:
9th Chinese Corps



This was the last chinese corp in the contested hex north of Sian...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at 76,130 (near Daly Waters)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 22449 troops, 239 guns, 44 vehicles, Assault Value = 603

Defending force 5449 troops, 77 guns, 13 vehicles, Assault Value = 58

Japanese adjusted assault: 410

Allied adjusted defense: 20

Japanese assault odds: 20 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: op mode(-), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
174 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 23 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled


Allied ground losses:
2260 casualties reported
Squads: 8 destroyed, 16 disabled
Non Combat: 55 destroyed, 17 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 15 (8 destroyed, 7 disabled)
Vehicles lost 6 (5 destroyed, 1 disabled)
Units retreated 10


Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
21st Division
33rd Division
3rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
16th Army
1st RF Gun Battalion
21st Medium Field Artillery Battalion

Defending units:
3rd Australian Brigade
19th Australian Battalion
1st RAAF Supt Wing
108th Anti Tank Regiment
Katherine RAAF Base Force
Darwin RAAF Base Force
6th Aus Cav Brigade
Northern Territory
NW Australia Base Force
11th RAAF Supt Wing


We keep on pushing back the Australian towards Daily Waters....

[GreyJoy]

ORIGINAL: obvert

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

ORIGINAL: kjnoel

I seem to remember you earlier saying you were going to limit R&D advance to 4 months?

If so, you might be putting too much into this. The IIc is due 44/3 so, if you want to limit your advance to 43/11, you only need 400 R&D points; at the current rate of 4 per day that will only take you.....well, 100 days.

You might not be limiting yourself anymore, but if you are you might want to consider whether it's worth maintaining 500 engines in the pool?

Hi mate,

6 months is my personal HR. I understand the Tojo IIc will come earlier with these settings, but i'll stop and invest in other things as soon as everything is up and running (meaning as soon as the Tojo IIa is building regularly at 120 x month).
The idea is to have 120 R&D Tojo IIc factory working and 120 Tojo IIa producing factories.
The 6 months goal will be, on the other hand, very very difficult for the George and Frank, because you also have to accelerate the Ha-45 engine and you cannot have the benefit of being able to research a previous model in the pipeline...

I would research the Tojo IIb model just so you get it before going to the IIc if you have a 6 month limit. You will most likely not use the IIb, but I'm actually trying it out in my game as I haven't used it and want to see what it does. The one good thing about it is that the 12.7mm guns move to the centerline, so they are more accurate. The bad thing is that the 40mm canons will most likely not hit anything at all. I'm only making a small amount of them.

I'm in 4/43 and I've already moved the Tojo IIc up 2 months. I could have it up to 8-9 months ahead of its date if I use the engine bonus, and that is after researching through the IIb model. I believe in only researching the next plane in line with factories that can upgrade without damage (one plane family). That's my rule, but we each figure out what works for our own sense of what is right. I think of it like the IJAAF telling the researchers and manufacturers that the plane doesn't meet their specs, so they're not going to use it until it's improved, and then the next model in line is researched with the improvements. Since this is my first time this deep in a game I'm also just curious how the different models will function in various roles. You know most of this from the other side in your last game.

Hi Obvert,

from the tests i've seen, made by ZoluSea, the "b" variant is really not worth the efforts. The "a" variant performs slightly better, so there's really no point in producing it. Simply skip it and go for the "c" model.
My only doubt is about the "Jack"...seems a good plane reading the stats...good climb rate, decent firepower....not worse than the george...not much at least...and it uses the Ha-32 which is a very common engine and could be easily stockpiled....mmmm...what do u think?

[obvert]

As I said, my goal is not necessarily to maximize and make the best plane all of the time. I want to see what they can do for my style of play. The Sulu Sea tests were really very good. They were done against 4Es though. The situation could be very different against fighters or 2Es, or with sweeps added in. according to those tests, the Tojo IIb wasn't wonderful, but it was only slightly less useful than the IIa. It is building now and my curiosity must be satisfied. The factories are there, and it costs nothing to upgrade them.

As for the Jack, I am researching it (2 x 30) and plan to use the later versions. I'll skip the first unless I really need firepower in mid 43 and the George is not yet online. I'm aiming for the later Jacks to use in a similar role to the Tony; point defense. Yes, the engines make it attractive and also easier to research. From what I've seen in my games, diversity of models can be used to the advantage if each performs the role it's best suited for. The J2M3 looks especially strong, as it has 4 x 20mm plus only a 2 service rating, and still climbs better than the George. From what everyone says the George is better, but I'd like to use both. It's just more fun. [:)]

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: obvert

From what everyone says the George is better, but I'd like to use both. It's just more fun. [:)]

Better in the sense that the N1K1-J scheduled arrival is 9/43 and the J2M3 4/44. 7 months is lot of time in game. Until George arrives you have nothing to fight the 4E's. Rather than the J2M3, the A7M2 is the next critical fighter for the IJN. Yes, when it arrives Jack is better than George, but you dilute your research and production efforts. Until you get the SAM your KB is severely compromised against the allies. With it, things are more even. But with scheduled arrival of 9/45 .... A6M3a -> N1K1-J -> A7M2 is your critical path for IJN fighters.

[Cribtop]

GJ, the win in China is big. You destroyed over 750 Chinese squads in that battle. Two months worth! Well done.

[Cribtop]

@Michael: How 'bout them Cowboys?![:D]

Ok, before you point it out, we have a lot of issues in the O line, and if I still played fantasy football I'd sell Ogeltree high right now as he was going against 90th string corners. I know, I know. Still, I had to celebrate a rare quality win in the Jerry Jones era.

[FatR]

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

from the tests i've seen, made by ZoluSea, the "b" variant is really not worth the efforts. The "a" variant performs slightly better, so there's really no point in producing it. Simply skip it and go for the "c" model.
My only doubt is about the "Jack"...seems a good plane reading the stats...good climb rate, decent firepower....not worse than the george...not much at least...and it uses the Ha-32 which is a very common engine and could be easily stockpiled....mmmm...what do u think

Jack is not terrible, but its only advantage over George is earlier arrival dates. I'm playing one of my games with the same 6-month limitation on accelerating planes and I'm only finding it useful as a stopgap measure until the next N1K-J model arrives. J2M3 is probably the most useful Jack model in this setup because it can be used 7 months earlier than N1K2-J. Even then, unless you have altitude-related HRs, N1K1-J still might be the superior option.

[FatR]

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

Fighters R&D program

Pretty anemic. I advise you to use factories for worthless Shuseis to expand Ki-84 research, and expand research factories in general. In general, take note that Japan needs to greatly expand its fighter production by late 1943-44 (I'm currently producing 435 Army fighters and 490 Navy figters per month on 2/44 in my longest-running game, not counting factories that are temporarily off due to waiting for better models, and still have dangerously low pools for the most useful models), so expanding factories is an investment you'll need to make anyway, but doing now it can bring you additional benefits of acceleration.

[FatR]

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo
Better in the sense that the N1K1-J scheduled arrival is 9/43 and the J2M3 4/44. 7 months is lot of time in game. Until George arrives you have nothing to fight the 4E's. Rather than the J2M3, the A7M2 is the next critical fighter for the IJN. Yes, when it arrives Jack is better than George, but you dilute your research and production efforts. Until you get the SAM your KB is severely compromised against the allies. With it, things are more even. But with scheduled arrival of 9/45 .... A6M3a -> N1K1-J -> A7M2 is your critical path for IJN fighters.

In a no-HR stock game I would now put about 10x30 factories to the task of researching A7M2 right on December 8th. But this game has a houserule that limits acceleration by 6 months... By 3/45 it probably doesn't really matter what fighter you have on decks. It is better to invest in Zero research - A6M5b is not ideal, but has passable armament for CAPping one's carrier fleet.

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: FatR

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo
Better in the sense that the N1K1-J scheduled arrival is 9/43 and the J2M3 4/44. 7 months is lot of time in game. Until George arrives you have nothing to fight the 4E's. Rather than the J2M3, the A7M2 is the next critical fighter for the IJN. Yes, when it arrives Jack is better than George, but you dilute your research and production efforts. Until you get the SAM your KB is severely compromised against the allies. With it, things are more even. But with scheduled arrival of 9/45 .... A6M3a -> N1K1-J -> A7M2 is your critical path for IJN fighters.

In a no-HR stock game I would now put about 10x30 factories to the task of researching A7M2 right on December 8th. But this game has a houserule that limits acceleration by 6 months... By 3/45 it probably doesn't really matter what fighter you have on decks. It is better to invest in Zero research - A6M5b is not ideal, but has passable armament for CAPping one's carrier fleet.

Ahh, I don't follow this AAR and didn't know about the HR. I only joined in the discussion regarding George/Jack. Without the A7M2 in '44 .... I'd have to think a lot about that. Very difficult.

A6M series is just too slow after about 6/43 (350 knt). I haven't seen anyone have any battle success with them after mid 43 ... maybe PzB? I'll have to go back and check. I know I can't unless I have 2:1 odds against Corsairs and those odds after 6/43 are very difficult to obtain.

[Lcp Purcell]

My 2 cents: I would stress the A6M5c, under the logic it's the almost top of the upgrade path, and the first Zero to get a point of armor (which I find greatly enhances survivability) You will have a ton of factories which upgrade to that, so it helps the production you already have.

But I am still playing my first game so as to see the later models in action I will be getting the A6M5c in about a month.

[Lcp Purcell]

Oh and a very nice start to the air war over Chungking, not only are you chewing up the flying Tigers, but more important his supply. I bet they high tail it to India soon. But the longer they fly over China the better. More starvation for the Chinese army.

[GreyJoy]

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Apr 12-16, 42


Sorry for the delay guys.... busy days.

So, in these four days we managed to inflict more losses to the american fighter squadrons defending the skies of China. I've counted more 20 enemies downed for only 3 of my own. Not bad. The bombings over Chungking continue at a good rate, even if the lack of aviation support (i underline that in DBB mod Japan is very very short of aviation support, with the typical base force having only 24 AVs!) is giving me a lot of problems.

On the chinese grounds, tough, things aren't so brilliant. North of Sian we recieved 2 bloody noses (1-2) in two different hexes. His defences are strenghtening and now it's a bloody and long march...we fight for every single inch of ground. I'm still confident anyway, cause the lack of air-ground support has been decisive in the latter battles (bad weather prevented my bombers to fly for several days in a row). Our units are still in decent shape and i hope to resume the attacks as soon as the weather improves.

In Burma he sweeps and bombs almost everywhere from Akyab to Mandalay. We tried to ambush his unescorted 4Es... 9 B-17Es popped up over Akyab on the 15th...we sent 20 Nicks, 20 zeros and some 15 oscars to intercept... results? 2 B17s lost (1 A2A and 1 Ops) and 6 of my guys downed...[:-]...i clearly need more air units in this theatre.
We're stuck in Burma however... he has massed 7 units in the jungle west of Katha and we are struggling the break the enemy's front but we don't controll the skies and the enemy is strong and well dug in...
The supply situation is improving a bit in Burma after the arrival of a TF with 20k supplies...but akyab is dry and he's sending his troops there from Cox's Bazar... i need the Tojos! God knows how badly i need them now!

In Sumatra we're marching towards Padang, the last enemy redoubt in the island.
Cocos island is being reinforced again....[:@]

At Java we cleared the south and now we can focus our attention on Batavia...finally.

In southern DEI, Koepang is being reinforced with 3 base forces, 3 AA units and 1 Air HQ (21st Flottilla)... my lazyiness is now paying its bloody dividends... I haven0't conquered Makassar and Balikapan yet so he was able to base 20 Vindicators at Balikapan, move them to Makassar and ambush my transports near Kendari... 4 xAKs full of troops sunk[:@]

In northern Oz we pushed the enemy back and conquered Daily Waters. We'll stop here now. We'll wait for some Naval guards units to arrive and then we'll move the two divisions and the 16th Army HQ out of this theatre to recover and to be ready for future operations. In the meanwhile, the ground gained in Oz, will be used to gain time for building up my defensive positions in Southern DEI (ambon-Koepang arc).

In the Solomons, Ndeni reached AF lvl 1 and he immediately sent a re-supply TF there... we swept the empty skies of Ndeni with our zeros and then we sent the Betties... with no oppositions the crack Betties were able to sink 4 enemy xAKLs before they could deliver their cargos.
We're building up strong defences in the whole SOPAC area. Wanna be sure that he won't have any easy approach here.

Lots of DDs and a couple of CAs are upgrading while we speak.

At Luzon, he's using subs to resupply Manila from Cebu. I was very stupid not to have conquered Cebu during the amphib bonus...it's gonna be a PITA now...i know[:-]

For what concerns the R&D program, i have made several changes so far.

Here's a picture of my R&D program lately... i'm still undecided weather i want to keep a little Jack and Shindens factory or not...

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Ground combat at 82,38 (near Tienshui)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 38175 troops, 289 guns, 123 vehicles, Assault Value = 1101

Defending force 30022 troops, 139 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 490

Japanese adjusted assault: 692

Allied adjusted defense: 958

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1485 casualties reported
Squads: 4 destroyed, 131 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 25 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Guns lost 5 (1 destroyed, 4 disabled)
Vehicles lost 21 (1 destroyed, 20 disabled)


Allied ground losses:
1311 casualties reported
Squads: 14 destroyed, 79 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 34 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled


Assaulting units:
13th Tank Regiment
61st Infantry Brigade
35th Division
110th Division
53rd Infantry Brigade
1st Army
Botanko Hvy Gun Regiment

Defending units:
76th Chinese Corps
42nd Chinese Corps
38th Chinese Corps
85th Chinese Corps
92nd Chinese Corps
14th Group Army
36th Group Army
6th Group Army
4th Group Army
10th Chinese Base Force


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Ground combat at Daly Waters (76,131)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 22422 troops, 239 guns, 44 vehicles, Assault Value = 600

Defending force 4270 troops, 65 guns, 8 vehicles, Assault Value = 55

Japanese adjusted assault: 548

Allied adjusted defense: 19

Japanese assault odds: 28 to 1 (fort level 0)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Daly Waters !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: op mode(-), preparation(-), morale(-), experience(-)
supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
63 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 8 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled


Allied ground losses:
2080 casualties reported
Squads: 37 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 83 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 8 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 29 (28 destroyed, 1 disabled)
Vehicles lost 10 (10 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units retreated 10
Units destroyed 1


Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
21st Division
33rd Division
1st RF Gun Battalion
16th Army
3rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
21st Medium Field Artillery Battalion

Defending units:
17th MG Battalion
19th Australian Battalion
NW Australia Base Force
6th Aus Cav Brigade
1st RAAF Supt Wing
Northern Territory
3rd Australian Brigade
Darwin RAAF Base Force
108th Anti Tank Regiment
Katherine RAAF Base Force
11th RAAF Supt Wing


Think these units won't pose any real threat for a loooooong time[:'(]

[GreyJoy]

and these are the production figures...

[GreyJoy]

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

ORIGINAL: FatR

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo
Better in the sense that the N1K1-J scheduled arrival is 9/43 and the J2M3 4/44. 7 months is lot of time in game. Until George arrives you have nothing to fight the 4E's. Rather than the J2M3, the A7M2 is the next critical fighter for the IJN. Yes, when it arrives Jack is better than George, but you dilute your research and production efforts. Until you get the SAM your KB is severely compromised against the allies. With it, things are more even. But with scheduled arrival of 9/45 .... A6M3a -> N1K1-J -> A7M2 is your critical path for IJN fighters.

In a no-HR stock game I would now put about 10x30 factories to the task of researching A7M2 right on December 8th. But this game has a houserule that limits acceleration by 6 months... By 3/45 it probably doesn't really matter what fighter you have on decks. It is better to invest in Zero research - A6M5b is not ideal, but has passable armament for CAPping one's carrier fleet.

Ahh, I don't follow this AAR and didn't know about the HR. I only joined in the discussion regarding George/Jack. Without the A7M2 in '44 .... I'd have to think a lot about that. Very difficult.

A6M series is just too slow after about 6/43 (350 knt). I haven't seen anyone have any battle success with them after mid 43 ... maybe PzB? I'll have to go back and check. I know I can't unless I have 2:1 odds against Corsairs and those odds after 6/43 are very difficult to obtain.

It's not exactly an HR...it's a self imposed HR. Don't really like to see 1945/46 planes in late 43...so i'm keeping this personal HR to save this game from going lunacy again[:)]

However i do think that, past 1943, the KB must have the role of fleet in being. Any direct confrontation with the allied DS will end up very bad if you cannot rely on LBA... and, anyway, if a confrontation must be, i think it will be a one-shot match for the KB. There's really no point in CAPping your CVs when 600+ enemy bombers are gonna fall upon you. Better to leave all your zeros on escort role purely (so ablative armour) and hope to smash the enemy hard enough. And when you are an ablative armour, it doesn't really matter if you fly 40 mhp faster....[:'(]