Scar attacks the Soviet Union (Scar v IdahoNYer)

[Scarz]

Turn 22
More bad news with the weather as a blizzard hits the eastern most units all along the front and mud in the Crimea. This couldn’t come at a worse time, as the Crimea operation is slowed to a crawl, thus allowing the Russians plenty of time to withdraw and the blizzard costs me a turn in the center.
As the Russians began a pullback south of Kharkov, I went ahead and launched the 1 Pz Group attack prematurely, with only one panzer korps ready to participate. But, the objective to shorten the lines, and and hopefully have a turn or two to prepare before the Russians can launch their winter offensive, so I need to hurry the Russians along.

[Scarz]

Turn 23
Around Leningrad all is quiet. The Russians pulled off the line and back east about 40-50km, but I suspect that’s just to lure my guys out of their prepared positions. AGN will stay put through the winter and dig in as deep as possible.

The blizzard continues in the Soviet eastern weather zone, which is eating up my MPs to the point where attacking from AGC in the hopes of getting an encirclement of any sizable Russian group is out of the question. I ended up wasting two buildups; I hope the units retain some of the supplies for next turn. So AGC repositions a 3 Pz Group and waits for better weather.

To the south, 1 Pz Group continues its attack. Although with much reduced movement due to the weather and isolates 5-6 Soviet divisions. The Russians seem to be delaying rather than truly running, so I may be able to isolated another larger force if the Soviets continue to try and tar baby 1 Pz Grp. As in the north, the Russian pull back will cost me many prepared positions, but I needed the shortened lines. Further, I will be happy to trade space for time in the south once the Russian blizzard offensive begins.

[janh]

I think you are right you need to shorten your lines down south. I did do this coupled with a 2 hex/turn retreat starting the first December turn.

You might want to be careful with your Panzergruppe on the Crimea. I had it once that with the first true blizzard turn, all supply was cut and I had Panzers sticking their head out suddenly being in the red. And left with to little MP to retreat to safety while being overtaken by Soviet Cavalry. A bad experience. I'll never get overextended and charge right into blizzard like the Germans did back then at Moscow.

[Peltonx]

The old strategy of 2x or 3x of german units in a stack retreating 1 or 2 hexes a turn is a very horrible idea now that many SHC players now how to use and exploit cav. They will simply get surrounded in a single turn or 2 at best if you counter attack and win. By January the GHC will be missing 20+ divisions and the snowball effect of the screwed up replasement rule set will make sure that German CV's remain at or lower then December's levels until March because front line units will receive next to nothing in replasements. Which in turn will mean GHC forses will lose divisions in January an February.

Right now the Blizzard effects are way way over powered and totally unhistorical. There is no way SHC forses should be able to easly destory 20+ german divisions and drive back lines 150 to 200 miles. Thats just totally unrealistic and totally unhistorical.

2by3 finally fixed German logistics making for a much more historical 1941, now they really need to fix the complete joke of a 1941 blizzard. Which can be done by simply leaving ZOC at summer levels and nerfing the joke of the cav movement.

The old questions of do cav units have equipment or not?

The standard answer should not be yes and no as in past threads.

Cav units are completely and magiclly over powered during blizzard.

The flying Pig exploit was nerfed long ago. Its now high time to nerf the Flying horse( or is it lt tanks?) exploit.

Its a joke and we all know it.

[Seminole]

nerfing the joke of the cav movement

Why is the ability for a cavalry unit to move 10 miles a day a 'joke'?

[Klydon]

As with anything, there is a lot of learning going on the first time around.

The move into the Crimea should have probably been considered a raid to rip up the rail lines down there and then withdraw. Trying to defend down there is crazy as it is well off the beaten path of the supply lines and the necks are a lot easier to defend. Romanian troops (outside of the mountain troops) are bad normally. Add lots of snow and they are really terrible and should never be exposed to Russian units who will use them as speed bags for easy moral building victories.

Good notes by others on withdrawing panzer and infantry formations. One other thing I didn't see mentioned is make sure to pull units that don't withdraw, or withdraw way later in the game. For example, saving 10 panzer division (starts the game as a elite moral unit) is nice, but it leaves for Tunisa at some point. While you don't want to "trash" the panzer formations leaving, you can use them in Russia to put in reserve and counter attack as needed while trying to keep them under cover as much as possible.

Planning for the blizzard must be in the German game plan from the start. One of the things the Germans should look to do is a short front line for that first winter. Fewer Germans in the line, the better. That means you have that many more units you can keep under cover or spending winter in Poland. An over extended line just invites disaster with a lot of units in the open under the pressure of retreat and will result in a bigger weakening of the overall German army in terms of moral and unit losses due to the blizzard.

[Scarz]

Hey Klydon:
Yes, I had thought to hold the choke point in the Crimea long enough to make it unattractive for the Russians, but I never got there, and its been bad down in the Crimea.

[Scarz]

Turn 24
All offensive operations were halted, and the Germans are preparing for the Soviet offensive and blizzard. I was able to get most of the panzer units into major cities, but did not rail any back to Germany as suggested in other parts of the forum.

Turn 25
The Russian blizzards have begun, and very little happens. I was disappointed in that the Russians are able to slip units into the gaps between my lines, and being unable to counter attack them, I am forced to leave my level three fortifications east of Smolensk. I will slowly withdraw for the time being and see where that puts things.

Turn 26
Blizzard continues, with the Russians starting to make somewhat effective attacks each turn. More concerning is the strategy of slipping Russian units between my lines, and thus causing me to leave my good entrenchments so as not to be easily cut off. I am slowly giving ground everywhere the Russians are trying to slip between my units, and so far not disasters.

Turn 27
Well I am still barely staying one step ahead of the Russians, as they continue to press forward during the blizzard. Two near catastrophes in the 11 korps sector find two infantry divisions isolated. Luckily, I was able to extract both divisions with a counter attack by panzers from 1 Pz Grp and a mountain division. Being unable to cover the entire map, the Russians are merely slipping units between my lines which are really causing me problems. I may have to start running rather than a slow retreat, as I am staying just one misstep away from disaster.

Turn 28
I am still slowly pulling back almost everywhere, just one step ahead of disaster. I did notice a bit of an increase in Soviet losses this turn, which may mean he’s hitting high fatigue or the Germans are getting adjusted to the cold.

Turn 29
More of the same, as the Germans continue a slow retreat west. I have been forced to give up large swathes of territory with little or no fight, but without fortifications, it is impossible to stand up to the Russians.
Of note the turn, the Russians have recaptured the Crimea. My late winter offensive to capture the Crimea may have surprised the Russians, but the lack of time to get the units dug in, made it virtually impossible to hold. I even left a panzer korps to help, but to no avail.

[Klydon]

You don't crack Sevastopal or otherwise clean out the Crimea, the Russians can lay a good hurt down there. For the most part, you almost have to either take it, or plug the choke points really well with units AND get them fortifed up or the Russians are going to be a major pain.

[Peltonx]

Good job so far Scar. Land in 41/42 winter means very little. Its all about morale from here on out for GHC. To win its about the AP crunch or manpower crunch.

As long as you keep up the good retreat retaking the land in 42 will not be to hard.

[janh]

Indeed, you seem to be doing very fine. No major disasters, no dozen divisions lost in pockets to SHC yet. I was a bit worried about your Panzerkorps on the Crimea; had idahonyer expected your incursion, and placed some cavalry there, your Panzers might have gotten in trouble.

How are your ToE% doing, how many frostbites and casualties do you loose each turn? How is the morale of the exposed divisions changing?

[Scarz]

And the Germans have surrendered. There was a coup or some such and the Russians are now running things in Berlin.

I really enjoyed the game, however short, but my inexperiance playing German really cost me.

Just to catch everyone up, all was going well with the blizzard, I was being pushed steadily back, but no real disasters, then all of a sudden a small breach, and then the next turn it was a major breach in three areas. My opponent and I thought it seemed over and pointless to continue.

If anyone has any other pointers, always glad to hear them, and I will now prepare to go at it again, but as the Russian commander.

Scar

[Klydon]

Tough to play the Germans the first time around as there is an experience curve that has to be met, but at least you have an idea from the German side of the hill now, which is a good thing.

From the start of the campaign, the German must always have an eye on where his winter lines are going to be. Such lines should be kept as short as possible. Pushing into the Crimea late in the summer campaign is usually not a good idea. More than the Russians, the Germans must be able to plan out how things are going to go several turns in advance. Playing the Germans can be stressful and fun or not fun (depends on how much you like pain. ) and it can also be rewarding as well.

Good luck in your next game.

[janh]

Too bad, I enjoyed the match as well. It seemed like you had things well under control in your last posts, no more ZOC locked division and such. How did it happen? In the area where you used Panzer to bail out those ID?

[Scarz]

Hi Klydon and Janh,

Yeah there is a steep learning curve it seems for the Gemans. I played the computer a couple times to mid 42, but it was clearly not even close to the same experiance. But, we are going to give it a go with me as Soviet, and after completing a whole campaign earlier as Russian, I feel a little better.

As for what happened, as things did feel like they were going ok. I was getting steadily pushed back, but in areas that I thought were safe. I got chased out of my lvl 3 forts, due to units slipping between my units, and then when the damn broke, it was like a wave. I got a whole army isolated in one spot, then two panzer units in another, and my other units were showing unready, it was a disaster....

Scar

[Scook_99]

The 1st 17 turns of offense followed by the 12 turns of Blizzard will affect the outcome of most games. You have to handle those 31 turns as German with aplomb or experience what you have. Even go with non-random weather until you can threaten the existence of the Soviet Union. Once you get the game down till March of 1942, then you can have a game of it.