Razing the Reich

Post descriptions of your brilliant victories and unfortunate defeats here.

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Michael T
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Michael T »

End T47 (7 May 1942) Clear

The first spring turn saw some limited action and a tentative advance by Pelton in the far south. He seems to have either achieved his aim in his Chernigov advance or baulked at the defences. Either way the attack has stopped.

In the north the Panzer forces attacked (Green arrows) en masse and advanced 1 hex.

In the south there appear to be two Panzer concentrations. The first group conducted a limited drive (Yellow arrows) and stopped, a probe for a weak spot perhaps?

In the far south, just to the north of the Crimea I detected a concentration of Mech units during the last 2 mud turns. I was not very strong in that area and at the end of my supply lines so I withdraw to a more defensible line with a covering screen left behind. Pelton, as telegraphed, attacked here and scattered the screen with hasties and upon reaching the MLR withdrew several hexes back again. I pursued him with a Cav screen and have reinforced the area with some reserves. I am not sure as to his intention here, perhaps he is after the Crimea or trying to unhinge my line and gain D and Z town thru a forced withdrawal. I don't see that happening though.

Otherwise there were localised attacks from both German and Russian along the front. This turn I merged quite a few brigades in to divisions and withdraw some of the quality brigades to the rear for either Corp creation or division merges depending on the requirements at the front. Tank corp construction has begun.

I now have T48 (mud). It appears Pelton did not move a single unit nor did he conduct any recon or even blast my screen in the south? Is this a sign of disinterest? I at least expected my Cav screen to be despatched? My OOB is almost 8.5 million now.

Will report again at the end of spring unless something significant develops.

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randallw
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by randallw »

Perhaps he is pondering surrender....?
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Michael T
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Michael T »

It would be the smartest thing, but I doubt it. He seems intent on playing it out. For what reason I do not know.
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Michael T
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Michael T »

End Soviet T49 (21 May 1942) Clear

A quick update. Well it appears that Pelton is going to turn turtle along the whole front. His spring attacks have been sporadic and seemingly aimless. He has started to spread his Mech units across the front. He has withdrawn from his Crimean adventure. I think he has realized that offensive action is futile against such a mass and he is going over to the defensive. So observers hoping for a 42 summer of exciting Pelton manoeuvres will be disappointed. In private correspondence he has indicated as much to me as well. He still thinks he can hang on for a at least a draw. I can't see how he can.

I cannot relax though. I must maintain a solid defence as he still has a potent Mech force. I will now steadily build a massive hammer of INF Corp and support units and chip away until I get some Art XX. I expect my full blown grind towards Berlin to start sometime late 42 early 43. Hopefully Pelton will come to the realization that resistance is futile at some stage around then and concede.

I expect to have a 9 million plus OOB by July 42. I will post updates and maps regularly, probably on a per month basis, unless something interesting happens. I will roll out more regular stuff once the steamroller gets going in about 30 turns.
carlkay58
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by carlkay58 »

Good luck. It will be interesting to see if Pelton's strategy can pull out the draw or better. Definitely a conservative Axis approach to the war.
Scook_99
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Scook_99 »

Lol, Stalin dreamt of this. The Russian offensive will end on the western shores of France! As soon as I thought about it, I remembered trucks would be the limiting factor on mech corps. But wow, over 9 millions men mid 1942, just how many infantry corps can the Soviet Army support? Makes me wonder if even stupid attacks, as long as attrition happens, would be worthwhile. How many men get to march in the victory parade through Berlin? Inquiring minds want to know!
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TulliusDetritus
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by TulliusDetritus »

ORIGINAL: carlkay58

Good luck. It will be interesting to see if Pelton's strategy can pull out the draw or better. Definitely a conservative Axis approach to the war.

Unless Michael gets drunk, and I mean really really drunk, the Red Army will get to Berlin yes or yes [8D] Possibly before 1945: he is just too close to the Reich and he will be allowed to have the Horde v2.0 much sooner (as he will possibly be unmolested by Herr Pelton) [;)]
"Hitler is a horrible sexual degenerate, a dangerous fool" - Mussolini, circa 1934
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Michael T
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Michael T »

Makes me wonder if even stupid attacks, as long as attrition happens, would be worthwhile

This has begun and will continue. My losses in men and material are irrelevant, I have taken on the persona of uncle Joe [:D]

janh
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by janh »

ORIGINAL: Michael T
He still thinks he can hang on for a at least a draw. I can't see how he can.

He should never be able to achieve a draw if you don't commit to any large blunders on the way to Berlin. Never ever, as Tullius said. You'll have a much larger Red Army, much earlier and less affected by disastrous losses in the early years. Although Wehrmacht may look better as well, this should lead to one clear result. Especially with logistics not limiting offensives as much as they probably ought to. Pelton may only hope for good dice goods, anything else...

So much for the "withdrawal to Poland" strategy. Seems to be a one way, comparably to withdrawing as a Soviet too fast and, importantly, too far. Although you are certainly right to stay on your toes -- Terje showed that even under worse circumstances, the Wehrmacht Panzerarmies can exploit favorable situations and cause huge trouble...
carlkay58
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by carlkay58 »

The problem for MT is not the size of the Soviet Army - but rather the size and quality of the Axis forces. Pelton has maximized the morale levels and force size. The front is shorter and he has more troops and tanks than normal. I think MT has the edge, but it will be a very bloody slugfest for quite a while. If Pelton tries some of the Manstein ideas he may be able to pull off a draw or even better. I don't think that there is any other game that we could look at for experience on this one. Definitely new territory.
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Michael T
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Michael T »

Gazing in to my crystal ball here is what I think will happen assuming Pelton does not surrender before hand.

I will conduct a continuous series of attacks simply to keep the German OOB to less than or around 4 million during the course of 1942. I won't care how many guys I loose as long as my OOB remains at around 7.5 million or more. I should be able to do this as I have plenty of guys to rotate in and out of the line to maintain morale of around 50. I have basically got 1941 levels of manpower and stacks of ARM. During this period I will be building a pile of INF Corp as I will have nothing else to spend AP on as Pelton has gone turtle. Late 42 I will build a pile of Art XX.

In 1943 I will then launch in to a serious grind that will slowly edge towards Berlin but its main aim will be to cut the German OOB down to around than 3 million or less and drive his average morale down to less than 70.

In the first half of 1944 I will shatter the German front and pour through his lines and charge on to Berlin by December. With the first half of 1945 as a buffer if anything should go wrong.

There is nothing he can do to stop this. He has no more territory to play with. He wasted it all in his retreat to Poland, not mention the massive manpower boost he has given me in recaptured manpower centres. He thought he would regain it all back again in summer 42. But I am too strong for him to push back.

I will be able to launch wave after wave of attackers to crack his fort lines and Panzer reserves. As the war goes on his Army will get weaker and mine stronger. A snowball will develop and he will be mercilessly crushed.

His attitude reminds me of the steamroller scene from 'A Fish called Wanda', with Pelton as Otto and myself at the helm of the steamroller as KKKK..KK..K..Ken

I have foreseen it…. we shall have a great victory…..[:D]
horza66
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by horza66 »

I don't disagree with anything said here about Pelton's prospects, but I think an opportunity is being missed here to discuss how best to deal with his likely defensive strategy. As per various posts, he'll work a two infantry corps, one panzer corps army setup, using high initiative leaders to ensure plenty of reserve activations. This is an ideal situation for a Soviet player to build the right force mix and tactics to respond to that defence.

Is it best to use wave after wave of brigade formations to build up fatigue, and use up activations? Or to strike with maximum numbers of artillery divisions, and with soviet mech forces on reserve status also?

One factor is your lack of opportunity for Guard promotions so far. Human wave and echeloned attacks might give some wins for the right units if well timed, but my immediate thought is - how about you pick on the Finns?
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Michael T
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Michael T »

IMO this strategy employed by Pelton should be outlawed by a Auto Victory Level in March 42. This strategy is outside the scope of this game IMO. Hitler would have never gone for this. Its a fantasy scenario that should be optional for those wishing to try it out. I will not play another game as Soviet without some house rules for an auto victory level as above. It's a damn boring game and I NEVER EVER want to go thru it again. Once is enough. I have no problem with Axis players going defensive post mid 43 but this turn turtle attitude from Sept 41 is crap. It's not why I play this game. This game has devolved in to a mathematical exercise. Sure it one I will win but thats no substitue for FUN. This is not fun. I honestly do not know why someone playing German would wish to do this. To play out 200 plus turns hoping to merely survive.... its nuts.
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mmarquo
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by mmarquo »

I agree; life is short. Find an opponent willing to play.
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Michael T
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Michael T »

Yes Mark, I concur. But I am not letting him off the hook.
timmyab
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by timmyab »

It's clear to me you've won this game and Pelton should probably resign at this point, but in the absence of that I think I'd be tempted to offer a draw at this stage and put the whole thing down to experience.Games are meant to be fun.Just think, if he accepts the draw and wants to play the return match you could be planning Barbarossa this time tomorrow.Much more fun.
I think this game illustrates the need for some sort of VP system in the campaign game both to encourage players to act within an historic framework and also to allow one sided games to finish early, or at least to add some excitement and purpose to those games.
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Flaviusx
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Flaviusx »

I doubt many German players are going to wish to repeat what Pelton is doing here after seeing the results of this game.

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Michael T
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by Michael T »

I doubt many German players are going to wish to repeat what Pelton is doing here after seeing the results of this game.

I agree but what I don't get is why anyone would even want to do it?

janh
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by janh »

ORIGINAL: Michael T
I agree but what I don't get is why anyone would even want to do it?

The blizzard scare...

But worse than that was definitely the potential to regrow your Army with the manpower centers you regain. So one thought I take from here is that retreating to Poland is short-sighted if you have not cut down to Red Army so much that even with added manpower it cannot be overrun next spring again. And if you cut it down so much anyway, there is no reason not do the unusual slow fighting withdrawal. So there is actually no real case to do it at all...

If the Red Army stopped you in your tracks, like Pelton got stuck in the Valdai with his whole center of gravity, and is strong come winter, you are in a bad position, but retreating all the way immediately will not make it better... Better a slow and steady withdrawal where terrain or Mountain divs cannot help. Fortunately the Soviets in 42 are not as powerful and mobile with respect to the still veteran Wehrmacht as they inverse in summer 41.
horza66
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RE: Razing the Reich (No Pelton)

Post by horza66 »

I need to clarify: I'm not suggesting we consider the ideal force/operational mix for dealing with a Sept '41 defensve strategy by the germans. That requires no special strategy to counter - it's clearly disastrous for the Germans.
 
I'm suggesting getting the right balance of force and tactics to deal with Pelton's defensive strategy of relying on massed panzers on reserve duties to get hold results. With the Soviets under no pressure in '42 it should be possible to find the ideal counter to this reliance on reserve panzers.
 
With very low unit casualties I'd suggest that Soviet artillery strength will be at an all time high, and these guns would be best deployed in artillery divisions that can be concentrated in a portion of the front where a program of attrition can be started. It may be possible to start this process relatively early by foccussing on the Finnish front.
 
Alternately a "human wave" strategy of brigades attacking in echelon to raise fatigue levels and use up reserve activations could guarantee a hex-by-hex advance, when the Germans are very short of hexes.
 
I realise that Pelton's strategic mistake makes for a very boring game, and I honour MT for not letting him get an undeserved draw out of it. However there can still be points of strategic interest in a tactically boring game.
 
 
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