Discontinued?

[Telumar]

And where shall that end? Hacked .exes passed from player to player? How many versions of hacked exes will there be ater some time..?

I would be careful with that. And after all, we're in the Matrix forums here. Maybe no good place to trade (their) hacked executables of a product that is officially still supported.

[Oberst_Klink]

ORIGINAL: Telumar

And where shall that end? Hacked .exes passed from player to player? How many versions of hacked exes will there be ater some time..?

I would be careful with that. And after all, we're in the Matrix forums here. Maybe no good place to trade (their) hacked executables of a product that is officially still supported.

Simply testing to make scenarios playable again.

Klink, Oberst

[Shazman]

Once kmitahj gets it working properly (no I-16 SAM) we can simply pass around that version. I don't see a problem with it. And since Matrix seemingly refused to fix a bug that was obviously easily fixed I don't have a problem with using it I guess. Unless, for some unfathomable reason, Matrix puts the nix to someone fixing their product in a way that will increase sales. This only affects people who have already bought it. It in no way hurts sales.
 
Still can't understand why this couldn't have been done in house. [&:]

[larryfulkerson]

ORIGINAL: Shazman
Once kmitahj gets it working properly (no I-16 SAM) we can simply pass around that version. I don't see a problem with it.

The problem would be if somebody who hasn't purchased TOAW yet was to get a copy of it somehow.

ORIGINAL: Shazman
And since Matrix seemingly refused to fix a bug that was obviously easily fixed I don't have a problem with using it I guess.
Unless, for some unfathomable reason, Matrix puts the nix to someone fixing their product in a way that will increase sales.
This only affects people who have already bought it. It in no way hurts sales.

Um.....MG might get worked up about it because of the reason stipulated in the answer for the first quote. Somebody who hasn't yet
purchased TOAW getting a copy of this executable probably wouldn't get somebody a playable executable because of all the
registry entries and supporting files that are needed by the running executable for instance. So even if a pirate got a copy he
probably couldn't play it. Still, MG will probably get worked up over this.

ORIGINAL: Shazman
Still can't understand why this couldn't have been done in house.

Um.......usually in-house changes are done to the source code and it's recompiled. What kmitahj did was probably working w/ an
assembler or a debugger or a hex editor stepping through the raw machine code. I've done this and it's NOT easy and he was
probably working on this fix for several days if not a week. Well, at least several hours. I've tried to do this kind of thing to other
programs and even though I'm an experienced programmer I wouldn't want to fix a program this way. Again.

[Zaratoughda]

ORIGINAL: Shazman

ORIGINAL: Zaratoughda

kmitahj....

If you want to make a hack that would make a big difference with TOAW... hack the code so that the part that reduces the movement points (action points? I haven't played TOAW in so long I can't remember) of all your units across the board after you make an attack... is just not executed.

In other words, give TOAW *FREE MOVEMENT*!

Yeah, would be a bit less historical but... a huge improvement in player friendliness and would make all the large number of scenarios developed for TOAW.... worth playing.

Z

Yeah, make it an arcade game so even a brainless moron can play it. Who wants to have to think when playing a game, right? [8|]

Worst idea ever.

Glad you have an opinion Shazman. The fact that it is worthless is just a minor matter. But, you should indeed know what it means to be a 'brainless moron'.

[Shazman]

ORIGINAL: Zaratoughda
Glad you have an opinion Shazman. The fact that it is worthless is just a minor matter. But, you should indeed know what it means to be a 'brainless moron'.

[:D][:D][:D][:D]

Good one.

It's bad enough with turn based games as it is. But if you throw all time/space considerations out the window you end up with the Germans running all the way to the Black Sea in one week. Impossible but you can do it in WiTE that has no time and space rules.

Example: The Germans blast a hole in the Soviet lines, something they couldn't do with the inadequate forces in the south, and then units that have not been moved yet move through the hole unopposed. Problem is, the units that move through the hole are doing so the exact same time the other German units are battling the Soviet units that are in the way. Somehow they magically move right through those Soviet units. It's science fiction.

You have to have some way to account for the amount of time any single unit has taken to do something. You can't have one unit move and attack and then have another unit receive it's entire movement allowance as though no time has passed at all during the first unit's movement and combat. To do so makes any game doing that more of an arcade game than a realistic game of a battle.

Personally if that's how someone want's to play their games fine. WiTE is like that. I don't play it. John Tiller started out his Panzer Campaigns that way but found out many didn't want to play his wargames as arcade games so now there's an option to play in a more realistic manner. Maybe you can convince Matrix to give an arcade play option that ignores time and space so there's less thought involved in what is done to play the game. Good luck with that.

[josant]

I try the patch and... Fantastic, It works

ORIGINAL: kmitahj
Speaking of patch deficiences here is one discovered in latest tests. As I said above it is rather dumb patch: it is allowing literally all units in range to participate in AAA fire. All units in this case means that also AIR units within fixed range (50km) may contribute to AAA fire as if they were equipped with long-range SAM missiles. BAD!!!
I'm going to find a way to exclude AIR units (and only AIR units) from participating in AAA procedure. However such bit smarter version won't be ready before weekend when I should have some time to work at it.

when kmitahj can solve this, the patch will be perfect.

[Curtis Lemay]

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

The problem would be if somebody who hasn't purchased TOAW yet was to get a copy of it somehow.

I'm sure you need more than just the .exe to run the game. Otherwise, the free updates available would short-circuit the need to buy the game. (In fact, that's one of the common troubleshooting issues on the help board: somebody has downloaded the update and thinks the game will work with just that alone).

[Silvanski]

OK I've been lurking this thread and wanna throw my 50 cents in..., IF indeed there is a patched EXE (or is it rather OPART3?) which at least fixes the AA issue, it should be issued viua the regular MG updates, as Telumar mentioned to avoid any confusion with different versions of patched EXE's ...

Also then at least I can come out of the shadow and roll out some updated scenarios...

Now there's still this thing with the "ignore losses" which may be more troublesome to fix

[BigDuke66]

I really would like to know what Matrix says to that unofficial EXE.
If AA is really done and the ignore losses" problem could be killed too it would at least put the game in a playable state again, I guess they aren't happy with the way it goes but I'm sure they see the benefit of it.

[Silvanski]

The question indeed is, would Matrix endorse an unofficial patch?

[Oberst_Klink]

ORIGINAL: Silvanski

The question indeed is, would Matrix endorse an unofficial patch?

They seem to have done so with WitP AE, no? The only 'old'game that has a dedicated support by this Aussie bloke who provides constant 'un-official' updates and uses the feedback of the community.

Klink, Oberst

[Silvanski]

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink

They seem to have done so with WitP AE, no? The only 'old'game that has a dedicated support by this Aussie bloke who provides constant 'un-official' updates and uses the feedback of the community.

Klink, Oberst

It seems the only way to go, provided there's order and structure, and no wild grow of updates and bugfixes to be accessed at various locations

[BigDuke66]

Not sure how "unofficial" his work is, the last line of "unofficial" beta patches turned into a official patch and I guess this line will end the same way.
Also I think it was Matrix that started this way and not michaelm showing up to present a modified EXE.

[governato]

ORIGINAL: BigDuke66

I really would like to know what Matrix says to that unofficial EXE.

Hopefully nothing, or given that there is a precedent with WitP, follow that. The key is that one cannot play the game without all the other files. Then it's just good PR for the game for sure. Also, I honestly 'd not worry too much about having too many versions etc etc. There is one guy who is improving the code, after years of stagnation. Cheers to that!

Or we could just sit and wait for v3.5. Ummm.


Silvansky: do not be so skeptical! Some tests have already been posted on this forum by various people who have the updated executable. It works very well.

[Silvanski]

ORIGINAL: governato


Silvansky: do not be so skeptical! Some tests have already been posted on this forum by various people who have the updated executable. It works very well.

I'm not sceptical, only cautious [;)]

[Catch21]

ORIGINAL: Shazman

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

You've got to understand that businesses are not there to do what you want them to. They're there to make a profit and I would not ask them to do anything out of the goodness of their hearts. It's not fair to them.

TOAW is "dead" because it is an extreme fringe game.

The sheep have spoken. And with that attitude you are sure to get what you desire. Nothing.

What these men say. Shazman, you have my vote for ALL your thoughts in this thread and thanks.

This lamb also says, try World of Tanks (review here), as some other long-time TOAWers have done, until someone girds their loins to sort TOAW. Free to play, pay to win if you really want too. The future. Lighter fare sure, but great fun. PM me if you want some help in a training room or to platoon, glad to help any TOAWers here (I can probably save you a lot of $s/heartache starting out).

[BigDuke66]

Oh please fuck World of Tanks, no one needs this frustrating, Ivan biased, boring game!
GO FOR WARTHUNDER.

[Catch21]

Oh please fuck World of Tanks, no one needs this frustrating, Ivan biased, boring game!
GO FOR WARTHUNDER.

Thanks, I'll look. Only half tongue in cheek, good to see the TOAW forum handy for some useful (hopefully positive) news for a change...

[Sensei.Tokugawa]

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

ORIGINAL: burroughs

That's great, I have almost laughed my arse off, it's so typical of any institiution and company to justify their avoiding doing what they're suppossed to be doing.Neoliberal crap. The next in line is the postman saying that I should not be expecting his services and my mail to be delivered as it is not fair to expect that of him since he's being very busy and after other things.

This analogy doesn't hold up. You paid Matrix for a copy of TOAW. Did they refuse to send it to you after you'd paid for it?

I don't think there was any point where Matrix signed an agreement with you, personally, to further develop the game. Moreover, they have in fact made several major advances in doing so, none of which you were charged for.

If you want to vent, go vent at Take-Two Interactive, who were so utterly obtuse as to demand a totally outrageous sum for the core rights to TOAW. If they had been more reasonable a) they would probably have got more money for their IP and b) Norm Koger would have gotten back the rights to his game and taken it from there years ago.

... but seriously. I was addressing the neoliberal crap about business and not the particular situation regarding TOAW III. If You didn't see the analogy, why did You use this as a context? Perhaps it was intended and there is no logical mistake there then. However, there is the analogy, it only depends which way one wants to juggle the words. It's the same as with the law - the law and the business with their discourses want to make others think their existence is an ultimate universal phenomenon whereas it is only possible through social agreement and the society are the people.The people have the voice and the right to have their say. Everybody's got a discourse of his own.The rest is willingness or unwillingness to bridge the gaps which are natural and unavoidable. Here we don't see the will to hence ranting and raving. People are trying to communicate and it's falling on deaf ears whereas You're trying to pacify that with slick apologies. Serial killers are also the way they are.It's not an argument, it's a circumstance.