Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

World in Flames is the computer version of Australian Design Group classic board game. World In Flames is a highly detailed game covering the both Europe and Pacific Theaters of Operations during World War II. If you want grand strategy this game is for you.

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Ur_Vile_WEdge
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by Ur_Vile_WEdge »

ORIGINAL: bo

Great point I am very inexperience game wise against an opponet, my question to you U4_Vile if the Germans put some of their naval assests into the North sea first they could possibly intercept those transports, probably a bad move because of the strength of the CW fleet that could be in Scapa Flow. How about interdiction with German airpower in the North sea if they try to flee to England, does not mean the German searches will find the Nordes..

Finally, this is what I was looking for, ideas, strategy, comments any comments negative or positive. Thank you. Remember I am not trying [&:] to win, I am trying to show new players all kind of possibilities, like to invade or not to invade. [That caveat protects me from bad decisions I might make from here on[:D]] What do you think of using the Paras.

Bo




You'd need to cover more than the North Sea. The Norwegians can put up to 8 naval units in Narvik and Trondheim, and those guys can escape via the Norweigan sea, Denmark strait, and on down through the Faeroes Gap, dodging your stuff in the North Sea. If you want to interdict them, you'll need to extend your net farther north.


Furthermore, the British and French likely have their own warboats in high boxes of the North Sea to intercept your stuff, so getting out into the Norwegian sea is not a zero risk endeavor. I suppose you could send your submarines, but that lacks a bit of punch, your subs can't really hit all that hard, and the British are likely to send in more guys to escort the fleeing transport.



I would try to align Norway with diplomacy rather than force. If by some chance you are able to take Leningrad, Moscow, and Stalingrad then I might invade just to interdict anymore supplies from going to Murmansk.

Unless you're playing with PoliF (most people don't, in my experience) you cannot align Norway.
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

ORIGINAL: shaddock

Bo, for demonstration purposes only, I would show the invasion of Norway. Especially with the paras. In the game I would be unlikely to invade since I would need too many units to garrison properly. And those will be desperately needed on the Atlantic wall or the Eastern Front. I would try to align Norway with diplomacy rather than force. If by some chance you are able to take Leningrad, Moscow, and Stalingrad then I might invade just to interdict anymore supplies from going to Murmansk.


Ok Shad, tonight I got to rest up to take on Steve tommorrow in Paoli Pa. Maybe he has a hidden cheat code handy like they have in Cod2 and other games. Damn I have a cheat code it's called a beta tester. It's like being God I can change the weather, part the seas and---- oh thats Moses sorry.

Bo
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Snydly
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by Snydly »

Thanks for this bo !!

Yes the Norway decision is a tough one for sure. Anyways good points are being made by others.

I am piping up here now because the M/J offensive into France is the paramount task ahead of you, I have seen friends try to do to many attacks at lower odds to break into Sedan and FAIL!!! (thus giving a long grueling campaign well into S/O) Keep your wits about you and hope for a long 6 impulse + M/J in France. This will help get you past one of the biggest new player hurdles in the game.

Good Luck [8D]
Looking forward to playing my favorite board game WIF on the computer.
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

At a suggestion from Klydon I decided to change the wording from an AAR to a demo.
This is a demo of an Invasion of Norway and the Netherlands.

The flyout depicts 4 units in Frederikshaven, a 4/4 infantry corp to keep the Baltice sea a German sea. A Ju 88A1 level bomber if needed. the 2nd Para and it's transport plus other German assets in the norther part of Denmark




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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

This screen depicts the invasion fleet in the Baltic sea, German battleships for bombardment if necessary, I used the fly out instead of the naval summary chart, because that chart takes up so much of the screen, the only problem with the flyout when I take a snaphot, I can only show the first 9 units, there is another 6/4 in the invasion group. That comes to an attack land unit factor of 12, because they are not Marines their attack value will drop to 6 [attack at half power]

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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

The weather chart is for the first axis phase in the May/June turn. This the first decent weather since Jan/Feb,and perfect for invasion of Norway and the Netherlands.

Bo




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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

The invasion of Norway has begun.

2 German corps landed unopposed except for a notional unit on the sea side hex southwest of Oslo. I added the notional unit into the mix but it did not matter. I sent the Paras onto the port city of Kristiansand and I did not add the notional unit so I could capture the city unopposed, if I had too I could have used fleet bombardment and air ground attacks to assist the paras.

I felt that the port city was important in case I have a problem taking Oslo with my two 6/4 corps. I could then transport in additional assests if they were needed through the captured port.
Was there any way I could have stopped Norwegian vessels from reaching England? I could not attack Oslo directly because the program would not allow that so I am assuming it is not an invadable hex, I believe it has to be an all sea hex.

Bo





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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

Now you know I had to show them [;)]

Bo




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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by shaddock »

I'm not certain if I read the rules properly or if they could have reached, but if you landed the paras in Stavanger, you might have had a chance of capturing or destroying the naval units there.
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by Shannon V. OKeets »

ORIGINAL: shaddock

I'm not certain if I read the rules properly or if they could have reached, but if you landed the paras in Stavanger, you might have had a chance of capturing or destroying the naval units there.
Yes. During the surprise impulse following a declaration of war, there are probabilities for naval units: escaping, being destroyed, and being captured.
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by composer99 »

bo:

You are correct about Oslo and invading hexes from the sea in general. In order for a hex to be invadeable it must have at least one full hexside as an all-sea hexside. So, in the screenshot shown, Oslo is not invadeable, but Copenhagen and most of the other hexes on the Norwegian coast are.

With respect to keeping the Norwegian fleet from escaping to the UK, what you would want to do as the Germans is send ships out to block every escape route their ships might have. For best results, invade their fleet bases during the surprise impulse then intercept the fleeing ships that escape the overrun.

This isn't easy to do in a combined impulse, or with the Royal Navy breathing down your neck if you sail to the North Sea or Norwegian Coast, so I suspect you would usually send submarines out to perform this task.

(Finally, I should note that any Norwegian naval units setting up in Oslo are doomed if the Germans have control of Denmark and seize Kristiansand, since they won't be able to escape the Baltic Sea.)
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by Klydon »

I think it shows a second unit with the Paras with them in Norway. Is that the transport plane that took them or something else?

Also, I was wondering what the blue circle was on the HE-115? Denotes a float plane?

Appreciate the work on this stuff Bo. Thanks!
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

ORIGINAL: composer99

bo:

You are correct about Oslo and invading hexes from the sea in general. In order for a hex to be invadeable it must have at least one full hexside as an all-sea hexside. So, in the screenshot shown, Oslo is not invadeable, but Copenhagen and most of the other hexes on the Norwegian coast are.

With respect to keeping the Norwegian fleet from escaping to the UK, what you would want to do as the Germans is send ships out to block every escape route their ships might have. For best results, invade their fleet bases during the surprise impulse then intercept the fleeing ships that escape the overrun.

This isn't easy to do in a combined impulse, or with the Royal Navy breathing down your neck if you sail to the North Sea or Norwegian Coast, so I suspect you would usually send submarines out to perform this task.

(Finally, I should note that any Norwegian naval units setting up in Oslo are doomed if the Germans have control of Denmark and seize Kristiansand, since they won't be able to escape the Baltic Sea.)


Damn composser I should have set all those ships up in Oslo [:D] Oh well dumb me.

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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

ORIGINAL: Klydon

I think it shows a second unit with the Paras with them in Norway. Is that the transport plane that took them or something else?

Also, I was wondering what the blue circle was on the HE-115? Denotes a float plane?

Appreciate the work on this stuff Bo. Thanks!


Thank you for that comment, ego is still a little bruised [:(]

The other unit is a Hs 123 single engine bi-wing bomber capable of delivering 995 lbs of ordanance. I am not a very modern Air wing commander [&:] I only used it because it had a range of 4 but it does have a medium ground attack factor of 2.

He 115c is a float plane the blue circle denotes that, and the 2 is it's air to sea factor [bombing capablites of ships for new readers] Also it can only base on a land hex next to a sea hex I believe.

After the transport plane delivers the Paras it must return to its base or another base close by which I had done already.

Ask any question you want because I now have a Guru backing me up who shall remain nameless and faceless [8D]

Bo



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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by paulderynck »

ORIGINAL: Klydon

Also, I was wondering what the blue circle was on the HE-115? Denotes a float plane?
Indicates a flying boat (WiF term). aka float plane, seaplane

They can operate from any coastal hex or lake hex. However, bad things can happen if the lake freezes.
Paul
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

ORIGINAL: paulderynck
ORIGINAL: Klydon

Also, I was wondering what the blue circle was on the HE-115? Denotes a float plane?
Indicates a flying boat (WiF term). aka float plane, seaplane

They can operate from any coastal hex or lake hex. However, bad things can happen if the lake freezes.


Thanks paul, beat you to it and thats a first after 400 tries. [:D] I always forget the word coastal hex.

Bo
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

Zoomed out to show both Norway with German troops just outside of Oslo and the German units in Amsterdam which means The Netherlands have fallen to the Germans. The ships in port will flee to England when I move German troops into the port of Rotterdam.

Bo




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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

In testing I tried different setups for Belgium forces, in the long run it wont matter anyway. I tried using the 2 rivers the Maas and the Dyle as barriers against a German invasion. For new readers attacking units crossing a river have their attack factors halved unless there is a engineer unit near by, I could use help on that one. [Engineers or combat engineers, helping out]

Question I notice the Belgian counters are black and their indicators are white, which signifies elite units but I doubt that these units are elite, I guess Steve would not put black lettering on black counters [;)] [MAYBE] Dont know the answer to that one elite or not elite. In testing I have never attacked Belgium this late, the May/June turn but I wanted to wait for the Paras to show them in action.

Oh well Barbarossa in 1944 wont be too bad I guess.[:(]

Bo





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Ur_Vile_WEdge
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by Ur_Vile_WEdge »

If I may be so bold, I'd suggest putting the cavalry in Lille, and the 2 infantry in separate stacks by the French border.

That way, the ability of the Germans to groundstrike is limited, and next impulse, the Brits and the French can move up, forming a coherent line along the Dyle.

The way you've got it setup, the Germans can ooze up, putting guys on the resource hex and on the one that's on the Dutch-Belgian border, and attack Brussels on the surprise impulse, so no river bonus and no chance of sending support.



The main reason to attack the Netherlands is to start the invasion with guys in Rotterdam, so that way, the Belgians have to try to hold in Amsterdam, which you can attack from two hexes.
"When beset by danger,
When in deadly doubt,
Run in little circles,
Wave your arms and shout."
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RE: Preface for Belgian, Netherlands, and France 1940

Post by bo »

ORIGINAL: Ur_Vile_WEdge

If I may be so bold, I'd suggest putting the cavalry in Lille, and the 2 infantry in separate stacks by the French border.

That way, the ability of the Germans to groundstrike is limited, and next impulse, the Brits and the French can move up, forming a coherent line along the Dyle.

The way you've got it setup, the Germans can ooze up, putting guys on the resource hex and on the one that's on the Dutch-Belgian border, and attack Brussels on the surprise impulse, so no river bonus and no chance of sending support.





The main reason to attack the Netherlands is to start the invasion with guys in Rotterdam, so that way, the Belgians have to try to hold in Amsterdam, which you can attack from two hexes.

I want you to be bold. Hmm "ooze up" first time I ever heard that military tactic. [;)] Sounds good, hey Im not out to lose to no Belgians thats for sure. Remember I can call on one of the greatest tacticle move ever tried in computer war game, turn off the computer if I'm in trouble.

See you may never get a game Ur_Vile, nobody will want to play you, but me, they are all ready lining up. [:(]

Bo
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