Passive Sensor Classification

[bsq]

Is there some way of telling the system what particular type of intercept is currently being looked at.

For example in Shamal, I see an ESM hit as a Gundish, but it tells me that it is possibly a gundish from Russia, Poland, Iraq, Egypt and so on - well I know it is an Iraqi gundish, no ambiguity in my mind, but I cannot seem to tell the system this. It would be useful if I could to take away the ambiguity. I am not sure what purpose this ambiguity serves (IRL if it is a Gundish, then its a Gundish Period ... if it is ambiguous then it is ambiguous with a similar emission of a DIFFERENT system and country of use has nothing to do with it).

[mikmykWS]

Ok so we design a filter based on db country value vs. side list.

So what happens when somebody uses redfor or Orangeland?

Other than saving you a few items in a list what exactly is the game value of this? You just said you were able to determine the likely nationality in your head.

Mike

[CaptCarnage]

How can you know for sure its an Iraqi Gundish?

[ExMachina]

Other than saving you a few items in a list what exactly is the game value of this?

Viewing bsq's question from the perspective of an AI opponent, couldn't such ambiguity make the AI less aggressive (ie, add in unrealistic delays in designating units as hostile)?

[mikmykWS]

You can't be 100 percent certain although geographic location get you significantly closer to the answer. The Syrian and Iraqi set may have been made to the same specs etc. The only thing you can do is say syria, iraq, iran, poland etc. have them in the DB and display them to the player to make a decision which is for the most part we've done. If we create other linkages we break the ability for it to work with hypothetical opfors etc. which we don't want.

Mike

[mikmykWS]

ORIGINAL: ExMachina

Other than saving you a few items in a list what exactly is the game value of this?

Viewing bsq's question from the perspective of an AI opponent, couldn't such ambiguity make the AI less aggressive (ie, add in unrealistic delays in designating units as hostile)?

Yeah I'd agree with that. The AI can't really use the same tools the human AI can. So what's the solution.

Its not hard to point out what's wrong. How do we fix it? Has any game really overcome this one?

[bsq]

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

ORIGINAL: ExMachina

Other than saving you a few items in a list what exactly is the game value of this?

Viewing bsq's question from the perspective of an AI opponent, couldn't such ambiguity make the AI less aggressive (ie, add in unrealistic delays in designating units as hostile)?

Yeah I'd agree with that. The AI can't really use the same tools the human AI can. So what's the solution.

Its not hard to point out what's wrong. How do we fix it? Has any game really overcome this one?

Was thinking more from a human perspective. If I am presented with a list of options, whats the point if I cannot select one of them (or am I missing something). So I guess what I am asking for is a method to select the one I know it is.

[mikmykWS]

What do you mean select one of them.

The contact report does show what they could possibly be correct?

[bsq]

Yes, the ability to select one of them. Was trying to work out the point if you cannot.

[mikmykWS]

What do you want to happen when you select one of them?

Right now it pulls the entry from the db viewer.

[ExMachina]

ORIGINAL: bsq

Yes, the ability to select one of them. Was trying to work out the point if you cannot.

Agree that this would be very handy. When the list of possible units gets long, it would be helpful if the player-designated classification would at least pop to the top of the list upon subsequent reviewings of that unit.

ORIGINAL: mikmyk
Yeah I'd agree with that. The AI can't really use the same tools the human AI can. So what's the solution.

Its not hard to point out what's wrong. How do we fix it? Has any game really overcome this one?

Well, since you asked [:D]...a simple workaround (for the AI side to use) could be to allow a unit to be auto-classifiable once the number of possible DB matches falls below some threshold number. That threshold could be set to "1" (ie, you need an exact match) or to a higher number depending on the scenario.

[Dimitris]

The AI crew _already_ does the auto-classification routine if you allow it enough time. The time it needs will depend on the number of possible matches (the narrower the selection the less time it needs).

So the original question boils down to "I want my AI crew to immediately auto-classify the contact as an _Iraqi_ Gun Dish, because I, as the human player, know that I'm playing a scenario where the only other possible side is Iraq". Well, the AI doesn't "know" that. At least not yet.

[ExMachina]

Thanks for the insight Sunburn.

How about bsq's point of easing the player's task of having to repeatedly deal with long lists of potential contacts?--any way to allow the player to select the platform and then somehow have that selection "stick" for that contact?

[Dimitris]

A forced ID? We can look into it once we clear out our list of more important issues.

[CaptCarnage]

If you want it to be an Iraqi ship, just manually assign it to Hostile and bomb the living -beep- out of it. I really don't see a big issue here.
in one thread people don't want to aim weapons but be boss over AI weapon directors and here we want to take over the job of the guy who has to ID ships.

[bsq]

ORIGINAL: Sunburn

A forced ID? We can look into it once we clear out our list of more important issues.

Fair point.


To give a little more weight than 'a nice to have feature', if you looked under the dialog of Mike's screencap, what you would see is a ? - The point of this is that its not a question mark, its a Gundish. There is no electronic way of determining which Gundish ([;)]) but point of origin will tell you who.

Before anyone points out Syrian and Egyptian forces in Desert Storm/Saber, well why do you think they were kept well out of it, in the rear areas until it was all over bar the shouting.

Additionally, if you are throwing missiles where there is an indistinct front line based solely on passive measures, then I would hazard the ROE's are being ignored.

[bsq]

ORIGINAL: Skyhigh

If you want it to be an Iraqi ship, just manually assign it to Hostile and bomb the living -beep- out of it. I really don't see a big issue here.
in one thread people don't want to aim weapons but be boss over AI weapon directors and here we want to take over the job of the guy who has to ID ships.

Spoken like a true 'Navy' type... [:D] 71% of the world may be covered with water, but 99.9999% of the population live on land and the domain I work in covers it all [:D]

The issue may well become apparent when we dont want our SEAD to shoot the living beep out of everything that transmits and we want to be selective and have it shoot what we decide and ID is a very important part of that

[mikmykWS]

Alrighty then.

Moving forward[:)]

[bsq]

[;)]Sorry couldn't let that one past...

[smudge56]

I think sub command would let you designate what the target was I could be wrong though so don't shoot me lol.