Problem in the low countries

[markb50k]

Hi doing global war sept/oct turn. 5th impulse (axis 3rd impulse)

Conquered Poland already. Germany has DoW Denmark Netherlands and captured Copenhagen and Amsterdam but Brits have landed in Rotterdam with HQ and mech corps during last impulse.

Fine weather again with 0% chance of end turn so I decided to DoW Belgium even with Brits locked up in Rotterdam

With only my engineers as a loss and all HQs still organized is this still a tenable position?

Should I just screen the Brits and ignore and go for kill on Belgium units or should I have not declared war at all?

Just looking for some general guidelines here thanks!

FYI only air available is 2 FTR. Mannstein only HQ on west front and is currently on outskirts of Rotterdam

[lomyrin]

Without control of Rotterdam Belgium can be tough to conquer quickly. Most likely you will find Brussels filled with Belgian units that were set up along the French border out of reach from the German bombers. Not having bombers to disorganize those Belgian units along the French border will let them enter Brussels in the next Allied impulse and French units are likely to fill the western Belgian hexes. This will most likely give an allied intervention US entry hit and make that front stand still until spring of 40.

[markb50k]

Thanks. Actually I just declared on Belgium and have yet to do land movement for Germany.

I set up 2 units in Brussels and 1 in Antwerp and am about to attack with German army on surprise impulse

If I can take Brussels and the factory in liege I guess I can accept that and hopefully get a unit across the river

[Ur_Vile_WEdge]

Seconding Lomyin's position, in theory, but not in tactics.


IMO, best Belgian setup would be: Cavalry in Liege, and the two inf by the French border, in sepearate hexes. This ZoC defense allows you to prevent the Germans from advancing into Antwerp or Brussels, and on the Allied impulse, the BEF retreats to Antwerp, the Belgians move into Brussels, and the French take up the supporting position in the south. It can be tough to crack.


I don't remember whether or not the Belgians get that fighter in 1939, but the British should also probably move up a spitfire or two to cover their boys.


Edited for clarity.

[Centuur]

Wrong set up for Belgium here.

Set up one unit in Liege for the Germans to kill and set the two other Belgians in the hex west of Brussels. No way the Germans can grab Brussels that way. Next allied impulse you move the French and Belgians into Brussels in force and together with the CW moving to Antwerp you are sitting behind a river in a couple of very nice cities...

Germany is going to have to get some pretty good die rolls to get you out of this position without having losses on their side too...

Seems I wasn't the first to give this answer... [:D]

[markb50k]

Thanks

So in summary by the Brits having Rotterdam it allows this defense as described above?

And in converse if the Germans have Rotterdam and attack from there they can get around this defense?

Sorry in business meeting lol so no access to map to do my research

Of course in a completely separate vein that setup smells of gamesmanship in that would a country really leave their capital empty? Separate issue granted and the screening cavalry of course makes sense. In a solitaire game I try to avoid gamey moves and when in doubt use historical precedence.

Overall really really appreciate the tips from the experienced players

[Ur_Vile_WEdge]

Precisely. If the Germans start in Rotterdam, they can attack with two guys from there, and two guys immediately to the south, and pile up on Antwerp on the surprise impulse. You get past the Dyle there, and Brussels can't hold.


I don't see it as particularly gamey; I'd leave the capital open too if I knew the enemy had no chance of getting to there before reinforcements arrive to defend it, which is in fact the case here. I mean, it throws your cav corps to the wolves, but sometimes you need to do nasty things like that to survive.

[Centuur]

Now, the Germans can avoid this by invading the Rotterdam hex with a DIV or use the para which is available if you wait until the historical date of the German attack...

[brian brian]

It looks gamey on its face to defend behind the capital, sure, but you are playing a game with an artificial I-Go-You-Go structure and Zones of Control rules as well. So with the CW in Rotterdam the best way for the Belgians to defend their capital is to use the gameyness of those two game structures to keep the Germans out of Brussels on the German move and then occupy it on the Allied move. If the Belgians defend in front of or south of their capital, the Germans can use the game structure of a breakthrough advance to occupy the capitol before the Allies can. No way around any of this, in a game.


And I know you probably are using the von Rundstedt HQ, but it sure would be fun to have Manstein on the board in Sep/Oct 39 in an alternate reality WiF.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: brian brian

It looks gamey on its face to defend behind the capital, sure, but you are playing a game with an artificial I-Go-You-Go structure and Zones of Control rules as well. So with the CW in Rotterdam the best way for the Belgians to defend their capital is to use the gameyness of those two game structures to keep the Germans out of Brussels on the German move and then occupy it on the Allied move. If the Belgians defend in front of or south of their capital, the Germans can use the game structure of a breakthrough advance to occupy the capitol before the Allies can. No way around any of this, in a game.


And I know you probably are using the von Rundstedt HQ, but it sure would be fun to have Manstein on the board in Sep/Oct 39 in an alternate reality WiF.

He was in Stettin during the Ardennes Offensive if I recall correctly. He was the one who pushed for it, worked out the general scheme, and talked Hitler into it. But the general staff was unhappy with him for doing just that so they sidelined him during the early part of the campaign.