I started a 41 pbem campaign, first one in a long time.
V2.3 should fix earlier problems with german units shattering en masse during the first winter.
I took Leningrad and Moscow by november 41 and prepared for the winter. Yeah right! No matter how much I try, I can't prevent my units from shattering.
70% readiness and 50 op's and they still shatter as grass against the sickle. From late november and to 080242, there's been continous blizzards and my front is reeling.
type............On map.In Pool.Total
infantry squads 26743 48 26791
27k squads? This is less than I had in mid 44 after starting the 43 campaign :p
Another month of blizzards and there will not be any units left at all. Is it just me or is this as it should be : }
Blizzard bug or the way it should be...
Blizzard bug or the way it should be...
"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower
We play wirpossum v4 with shane using wir 3.3. We aborted this game because of the blizzard bug when we used wir 3.2. We restarted now at the start of blizzards. Shane has made a defensive line well before the blizzards so he has high readiness and entrenchment. So far we had 1 week of blizzards where his troops held my attacks very well (as they should). With wir 3.2 they shattered like eggs. We had some snow, but it is blizzard again. I will keep attack him as hard as I can. If there is anybody intrested I can make some reports about this blizzard campaign.
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matt.buttsworth
- Posts: 886
- Joined: Sat May 26, 2001 8:00 am
- Location: Weimar, Germany
- Contact:
1941. november 30.
Blizzard
The red army attacked at only 3 places of the front, as the germans must be quite fresh as this is only the first week of blizzards. These 3 attacks were massive, including our strongest armored forces. All 3 attacked german infatry korpses held out our attacks but they had some difficulties doing so. Our obsolete armor was destroyed in great number's, but we could not care less as they are crap anyway. They will be replaced by kv's and t34's soon. Blizzard continued, so we will keep pushing against the very stable german defenses.
Losses this week:
Axis/Soviet
489/658
61/422
284/60
120/0
Blizzard
The red army attacked at only 3 places of the front, as the germans must be quite fresh as this is only the first week of blizzards. These 3 attacks were massive, including our strongest armored forces. All 3 attacked german infatry korpses held out our attacks but they had some difficulties doing so. Our obsolete armor was destroyed in great number's, but we could not care less as they are crap anyway. They will be replaced by kv's and t34's soon. Blizzard continued, so we will keep pushing against the very stable german defenses.
Losses this week:
Axis/Soviet
489/658
61/422
284/60
120/0
Yes it'll be interesting to see whether the Germans will be able to contain the Soviet counterattack.
My own experience shows that most of the inf divs will be shattered or severely reduced. The panzer divs' can be pulled back and held in reserve and revive them when the weather improves, but I doubt anything more than a draw can be obtained.
I think that 3-4 months of continous blizzards is a load of bull...
Half of that would be historical. Weather in Russia varied a lot. In the south the weather was much less harsh than in the north.
It's also completely unrealistic that the Red Army would be fit for continous counterattacks on the whole front lasting for more than 4 months. They ran out of steam in january 42.... Tactical and strategical skills were much to low and most of their artillery had been destroyed in the summer of 41.
Guess it all comes down to game limitations: WIR is an old game and the developers have done miracles already. Perhaps we have to live with it as it is and impose our own rules to improve realism and playability.
My own experience shows that most of the inf divs will be shattered or severely reduced. The panzer divs' can be pulled back and held in reserve and revive them when the weather improves, but I doubt anything more than a draw can be obtained.
I think that 3-4 months of continous blizzards is a load of bull...
Half of that would be historical. Weather in Russia varied a lot. In the south the weather was much less harsh than in the north.
It's also completely unrealistic that the Red Army would be fit for continous counterattacks on the whole front lasting for more than 4 months. They ran out of steam in january 42.... Tactical and strategical skills were much to low and most of their artillery had been destroyed in the summer of 41.
Guess it all comes down to game limitations: WIR is an old game and the developers have done miracles already. Perhaps we have to live with it as it is and impose our own rules to improve realism and playability.
"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower
Shane has a very strong defence in this game... All of the attacked korpses had 400+ squads and strong artillery showing up for the fight. Right now this is do or die for the soviets. If I don't annihilate his infantry he will finish me off in the summer with his untouched panzers. He already took Lenningrad, and he is close to Moscow.... From the first results I doubt if this blizzard campaign knocks out the germans.
1941. december 7.
Blizzard
The mass human wave attacks have begun. All but one attack were held by the strong german defence. One of our tank armies in the centre forced the enemy to retreat and now is in good position to test the german 2nd line of defence. In the south our other tank army were only just held (odds:6) by the enemy. The germans know that this fight is for their life and fight like devils. We have huge tank losses, and we count on having only about 1/6th of our current tank forces after this campaign, but they all will be battle hardened KV units. Our infantry losses are high, but we have so many volunteers that not all can be called in so that is no problem right now. German artillery losses are going up nicely.
Losses this week:
935/2104
106/649
640/246
52/0
Blizzard
The mass human wave attacks have begun. All but one attack were held by the strong german defence. One of our tank armies in the centre forced the enemy to retreat and now is in good position to test the german 2nd line of defence. In the south our other tank army were only just held (odds:6) by the enemy. The germans know that this fight is for their life and fight like devils. We have huge tank losses, and we count on having only about 1/6th of our current tank forces after this campaign, but they all will be battle hardened KV units. Our infantry losses are high, but we have so many volunteers that not all can be called in so that is no problem right now. German artillery losses are going up nicely.
Losses this week:
935/2104
106/649
640/246
52/0
1941. december 14.
Blizzard
We made some troop transfers this week, and only attacked at 2 places. 1 attack suceeded in the south.
Losses this week:
Axis/Soviet
383/573
53/121
209/69
9/0
p.s: I think this version fixes the blizzard a bit too much. It is ok that high entrenchment german troops will resist like in snow, but with entrenchment down they should get an 50 % penalty... I surely destroyed some enemy entrenchment to 1 with odds of 4,5 for weeks. Still with high readiness they fight like it were summer. I think it makes winning with soviets even harder, as a clever german player can stop in oktober, get high readiness and survive even if the entrenchments go down. It will make 41 a bit harder to win, but in 42 much easier. In all it will be easier to win as german.
Blizzard
We made some troop transfers this week, and only attacked at 2 places. 1 attack suceeded in the south.
Losses this week:
Axis/Soviet
383/573
53/121
209/69
9/0
p.s: I think this version fixes the blizzard a bit too much. It is ok that high entrenchment german troops will resist like in snow, but with entrenchment down they should get an 50 % penalty... I surely destroyed some enemy entrenchment to 1 with odds of 4,5 for weeks. Still with high readiness they fight like it were summer. I think it makes winning with soviets even harder, as a clever german player can stop in oktober, get high readiness and survive even if the entrenchments go down. It will make 41 a bit harder to win, but in 42 much easier. In all it will be easier to win as german.
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matt.buttsworth
- Posts: 886
- Joined: Sat May 26, 2001 8:00 am
- Location: Weimar, Germany
- Contact:
Not really, been using all my bombers to airlift supplies.
HQ's always got 50+ OP's and readiness varies from 40-75%.
Tried to maximise supplies to threatened sectors..but that didn't help either.
As long as you play with house rules and ain't allowed to change HQ's more than once, it's not impossible to boost readiness much higher without reducing OP's to low.
Finnish troops on the northern part of the front are really holding their own against anything the Soviets can throw at them.
HQ's always got 50+ OP's and readiness varies from 40-75%.
Tried to maximise supplies to threatened sectors..but that didn't help either.
As long as you play with house rules and ain't allowed to change HQ's more than once, it's not impossible to boost readiness much higher without reducing OP's to low.
Finnish troops on the northern part of the front are really holding their own against anything the Soviets can throw at them.
"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower
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Gwynn Compton
- Posts: 16
- Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2003 3:09 pm
- Location: New Zealand
PzB,
My troops shattered in my game against Popov. Though admittadly I had taken more casualties than usual in the Barbarossa attack, but I lost about 75% of my korps in the winter.
I was quite taken aback by it, never thought the shattering would be that bad.
Gwynn
My troops shattered in my game against Popov. Though admittadly I had taken more casualties than usual in the Barbarossa attack, but I lost about 75% of my korps in the winter.
I was quite taken aback by it, never thought the shattering would be that bad.
Gwynn
"History is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace, and revolution continue on forever."
1941. december 21.
Blizzard
The red army attacked with force again this week. We were held at everywhere again. The only light in the tunnel is that the germans began to use panzers/jagdpanzers to hold the front. This means rising panzer losses. Of course our armor gets beaten badly but we have over 2000 crap tanks in reserve and the germans should be lacking any real panzer resreve.
Losses this week:
Axis/Soviet
1111/2204
248/891!
686/287
70/0
How long can 4-5 german korps take this beating? I think more then half of the german infatry divisions already served in this korpses:) They just get back strength week after week.
Blizzard
The red army attacked with force again this week. We were held at everywhere again. The only light in the tunnel is that the germans began to use panzers/jagdpanzers to hold the front. This means rising panzer losses. Of course our armor gets beaten badly but we have over 2000 crap tanks in reserve and the germans should be lacking any real panzer resreve.
Losses this week:
Axis/Soviet
1111/2204
248/891!
686/287
70/0
How long can 4-5 german korps take this beating? I think more then half of the german infatry divisions already served in this korpses:) They just get back strength week after week.
WIR 3.2 Blizzard
WIR 3.2 Campaign 41...
I as German...simply retreated...albeit about 15 hexes to avoid the 41 Blizzard bug. My troops have good experience. The downside is summer 42 has been WW-I trench warfare. It didnt help that my enthusiastic flyers were doing attition attacks during the spring. They have now(aug - Sep 42) been doing training to recover.
If the Ruskies advance(ie have no entrenchment), then i can sometimes? attack to force them back. I find that German PZIIIHs lose about 50% of the German tank force attacking Ruskies....while Ruskies lose maybe 20% of their force when attacking good German entrenched youths.
The details of combat losses, recoveries/repairs and allocation of new builds is lacking in this game(among other details). I have come to live with it as the 'fog of war' element. As German, i am disappointed about being on the strategic defensive from Dec 41 onward. Sounds hardly worthwhile playing.
Mike B of Canada...in German Canada vs Russian New Zealand game.(other emails address the details of the game)
I as German...simply retreated...albeit about 15 hexes to avoid the 41 Blizzard bug. My troops have good experience. The downside is summer 42 has been WW-I trench warfare. It didnt help that my enthusiastic flyers were doing attition attacks during the spring. They have now(aug - Sep 42) been doing training to recover.
If the Ruskies advance(ie have no entrenchment), then i can sometimes? attack to force them back. I find that German PZIIIHs lose about 50% of the German tank force attacking Ruskies....while Ruskies lose maybe 20% of their force when attacking good German entrenched youths.
The details of combat losses, recoveries/repairs and allocation of new builds is lacking in this game(among other details). I have come to live with it as the 'fog of war' element. As German, i am disappointed about being on the strategic defensive from Dec 41 onward. Sounds hardly worthwhile playing.
Mike B of Canada...in German Canada vs Russian New Zealand game.(other emails address the details of the game)
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matt.buttsworth
- Posts: 886
- Joined: Sat May 26, 2001 8:00 am
- Location: Weimar, Germany
- Contact:
Wir 3.1 Possum 5 blizzard. Germans tried to retreat a long way after fighting up until the onset of blizzard. Russian steamroll attack during blizzard, near Polish/Rumanian border by end of winter. Summer - near North Germany, Hungary. Unlikely the war will last much into 1943.
Not all one sided though.
The Germans got within one square of cutting off Leningrad and many troops before Blizzard. Cut off thrust into Rumanian oil fields in Winter with Panzer thrust to Oddessa. Very nearly 15 Russian armies destroyed. But Russians cut into supporting infantry and encircled and destroyed attacking Panzer korps. Very close though. Rumanian attack saved, but the Panzer attack gave the Russians a chance to throw out the Germans out of Rumania, and dig in and so saved the Ploesti oilfields which are very, very difficult to take in Possum.
So it has been a very interesting game. Shame the Germans could not recover better though.
From the Russian perspective which I prefer, some of the Russian units you can create with mechanized cavalry, tanks and mechanized divisions are awesome.
M
So it it has
Not all one sided though.
The Germans got within one square of cutting off Leningrad and many troops before Blizzard. Cut off thrust into Rumanian oil fields in Winter with Panzer thrust to Oddessa. Very nearly 15 Russian armies destroyed. But Russians cut into supporting infantry and encircled and destroyed attacking Panzer korps. Very close though. Rumanian attack saved, but the Panzer attack gave the Russians a chance to throw out the Germans out of Rumania, and dig in and so saved the Ploesti oilfields which are very, very difficult to take in Possum.
So it has been a very interesting game. Shame the Germans could not recover better though.
From the Russian perspective which I prefer, some of the Russian units you can create with mechanized cavalry, tanks and mechanized divisions are awesome.
M
So it it has
G'Day all..
With this game Tamas and I are playing, which is a hybrid possum one, which I must say is unhistorical, with it's massive red air force, red army tank corps and very powerful soviet mechanised cav divs etc, and all of this in 1941, along with low german production, poor luftwaffe etc etc, which are issues I have stated in another thread in this forum, make for a game that cannot be played with a view on historical outcomes.
So after the second blizzard bug fix was implemented, I was determined to test it out to the max, and as Tamas and I have not setup any house rules for this game, I informed Tamas that I am using special supply to the max that I can, based on the fact that the axis forces which had totally stopped and carried no offensive actions or movements for weeks and weeks before the blizzard season began, had gained high entrenchment levels with full supply line values of 6 on all rail lines.
This means that when the blizzard hit, the axis troops were very well entrenched and supplied, with solid and secure lines of supply and communication, plus they were fully stocked up on winter clothing and lubricants etc, with very high morale (ie.. high experience levels).
I had setup the defensive arrangements (ie.. two lines of defense) along with redeployments etc, in the time whilst no offensive operations were taking place, which when combined with the blizzard bug fix, gave me a strong defensive front, and justified me in using special supply as all the right conditions were in place for it.
Readiness drops to about 70% there-abouts between turns, and using special supply I can get back up to say around 85 to 90%.. Doing this every turn enables me to maintain high readiness.. I use about 8 - 9 HQ's for their op points and nothing else.
The other factor is that I have deployed just about every axis fighter, fighter bomber and a number of bomber units to the east, and concentrated them in a small number of HQ's, close enough to one another to offer mutal support, and in the areas of critical importance. My soviet opponent, has helped me out here
in that he withdrew every single soviet aviation unit to the rear and enabled me to steadly build up the weak luftwaffe to a strong force, as these HQ's in these critical areas have their replacement levels set to a minimum of 90%, plus these unopposed axis air units contribute significantly to the defensive equation, and there are now thousands of them.
So yes, by keeping the readiness values up, combined with the blizzard bug fix, this now enables the axis forces to survive, as long as they are not skeletons through continual combat, plus it also helps to improve the experience levels as well.
The axis high command though, has grave doubts about these absolute monster tank corps, that the soviet player is able to setup and deploy in 1941 of all times
as they are far more powerful than any panzer korps the wehrmacht could deploy.
It is proving to be an interesting (non-historical) game now, but being on the defensive is wearing the wehrmacht down through attrition losses, and I fear Tamas will eventually pierce all the defensive belts at some location soon, given that there is still at least half a dozen blizzard turns left to go, plus the fact, that he is a very determined commander.
..Shane
With this game Tamas and I are playing, which is a hybrid possum one, which I must say is unhistorical, with it's massive red air force, red army tank corps and very powerful soviet mechanised cav divs etc, and all of this in 1941, along with low german production, poor luftwaffe etc etc, which are issues I have stated in another thread in this forum, make for a game that cannot be played with a view on historical outcomes.
So after the second blizzard bug fix was implemented, I was determined to test it out to the max, and as Tamas and I have not setup any house rules for this game, I informed Tamas that I am using special supply to the max that I can, based on the fact that the axis forces which had totally stopped and carried no offensive actions or movements for weeks and weeks before the blizzard season began, had gained high entrenchment levels with full supply line values of 6 on all rail lines.
This means that when the blizzard hit, the axis troops were very well entrenched and supplied, with solid and secure lines of supply and communication, plus they were fully stocked up on winter clothing and lubricants etc, with very high morale (ie.. high experience levels).
I had setup the defensive arrangements (ie.. two lines of defense) along with redeployments etc, in the time whilst no offensive operations were taking place, which when combined with the blizzard bug fix, gave me a strong defensive front, and justified me in using special supply as all the right conditions were in place for it.
Readiness drops to about 70% there-abouts between turns, and using special supply I can get back up to say around 85 to 90%.. Doing this every turn enables me to maintain high readiness.. I use about 8 - 9 HQ's for their op points and nothing else.
The other factor is that I have deployed just about every axis fighter, fighter bomber and a number of bomber units to the east, and concentrated them in a small number of HQ's, close enough to one another to offer mutal support, and in the areas of critical importance. My soviet opponent, has helped me out here
in that he withdrew every single soviet aviation unit to the rear and enabled me to steadly build up the weak luftwaffe to a strong force, as these HQ's in these critical areas have their replacement levels set to a minimum of 90%, plus these unopposed axis air units contribute significantly to the defensive equation, and there are now thousands of them.So yes, by keeping the readiness values up, combined with the blizzard bug fix, this now enables the axis forces to survive, as long as they are not skeletons through continual combat, plus it also helps to improve the experience levels as well.
The axis high command though, has grave doubts about these absolute monster tank corps, that the soviet player is able to setup and deploy in 1941 of all times
as they are far more powerful than any panzer korps the wehrmacht could deploy.It is proving to be an interesting (non-historical) game now, but being on the defensive is wearing the wehrmacht down through attrition losses, and I fear Tamas will eventually pierce all the defensive belts at some location soon, given that there is still at least half a dozen blizzard turns left to go, plus the fact, that he is a very determined commander.
..Shane