Something fishy here

[WarHunter]

First picture set is without the engineer unit in the attack.

Second picture is with Engineer unit in the Attack.

Why is the second attack not a 7-1?

[WarHunter]

SAVE file

[joshuamnave]

Because the engineer's bonus is affected by rivers and fort hexsides. No, it doesn't say that in the rules - apparently that was part of a WIF FAQ that wasn't written into the RAC but was coded into the game. As I've pointed out several times, this is yet another reason that combat bonuses really need to be itemized since it destroys the argument that all combat bonuses are already itemized in the RAC.

[WarHunter]

ORIGINAL: Zartacla

Because the engineer's bonus is affected by rivers and fort hexsides. No, it doesn't say that in the rules - apparently that was part of a WIF FAQ that wasn't written into the RAC but was coded into the game. As I've pointed out several times, this is yet another reason that combat bonuses really need to be itemized since it destroys the argument that all combat bonuses are already itemized in the RAC.

To be really picky. The odds shown are only 9-1 with a fractional odds that was not rolled for. Yet was given a 10-1 automatic during combat declaration.

Before the engineer was used it clearly shows an 8-1 down shifted to a 5-1.

I do agree completely an entire list of bonuses + or - would be a good thing. Especially for 2D10 players.

[paulderynck]

All units east of the Rhine are one sixth of normal value due to the Maginot line fort hexsides. With the engineer, then it and one other (if east of the river) are only halved.

from RAW7 and the RAC (not the FAQ):

ENG attacking across both a river and a fort hexside, ignore only the fort hexside.

[joshuamnave]

Yes, but the bonus for engineers attacking a city/factory is halved by rivers (and thirded by fortifications) which is not in RAC but is only in the FAQ (or so I've been told - since the FAQ was not included with the game, I can't verify that one myself). In other words - an engineer attacking a city gives a +1, but an engineer attacking a city across a river only gives +.5, and that is not mentioned in the RAC.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: Zartacla

Yes, but the bonus for engineers attacking a city/factory is halved by rivers (and thirded by fortifications) which is not in RAC but is only in the FAQ (or so I've been told - since the FAQ was not included with the game, I can't verify that one myself). In other words - an engineer attacking a city gives a +1, but an engineer attacking a city across a river only gives +.5, and that is not mentioned in the RAC.

See RAC page174, Note #4 at the top of the page.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: WarHunter

ORIGINAL: Zartacla

Because the engineer's bonus is affected by rivers and fort hexsides. No, it doesn't say that in the rules - apparently that was part of a WIF FAQ that wasn't written into the RAC but was coded into the game. As I've pointed out several times, this is yet another reason that combat bonuses really need to be itemized since it destroys the argument that all combat bonuses are already itemized in the RAC.

To be really picky. The odds shown are only 9-1 with a fractional odds that was not rolled for. Yet was given a 10-1 automatic during combat declaration.

Before the engineer was used it clearly shows an 8-1 down shifted to a 5-1.

I do agree completely an entire list of bonuses + or - would be a good thing. Especially for 2D10 players.

Total combat factors for each side are rounded just before the odds ratio is calculated. So the 29.666 becomes 30.

But the 3 'column' shift should bring it down to 7:1 on the Assault table, not Automatic. It would be automatic on the Blitz table.

[paulderynck]

ORIGINAL: Zartacla

Yes, but the bonus for engineers attacking a city/factory is halved by rivers (and thirded by fortifications) which is not in RAC but is only in the FAQ (or so I've been told - since the FAQ was not included with the game, I can't verify that one myself). In other words - an engineer attacking a city gives a +1, but an engineer attacking a city across a river only gives +.5, and that is not mentioned in the RAC.

The FAQ doesn't say that. I don't think the game is coded that way. Did you run into this in MWiF? If an engineer attacked a city across both a river and a fort hexside, then its mod would be halved. (FAQ Q11.16-18)
Edit: this question is the source for the last part of note 4 on page 174 that Steve mentioned.

For future reference here is the 2008 Errata and the FAQ.

[joshuamnave]

I point you to this thread tm.asp?m=3542814&mpage=2 Which is where I was told it came from the FAQ, not the RAC.

I see note 4 now. And the fact that someone who has spent as much time as I have pouring over the RAC still missed that or misread it/misinterpreted that does nothing to change my conviction that the DRM's need to be fully itemized. As this thread shows, I'm not the only one that missed it.

I just don't get the logic behind not wanting to make the game more accessible to new players.

[paulderynck]

I agree listing all the DRMs would be helpful. Steve's reply at the time was there's insufficient room on the form for listing all the possibilities. (And clearly, all the possibilities have to be included in such a redesign.) Perhaps this can be examined again when the more pressing issues of Supply, Production, Naval Movement and NetPlay have been dealt with.

[WarHunter]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
Total combat factors for each side are rounded just before the odds ratio is calculated. So the 29.666 becomes 30.

But the 3 'column' shift should bring it down to 7:1 on the Assault table, not Automatic. It would be automatic on the Blitz table.

Thanks for looking at this Steve.

My opponent and i both agreed it should have been a 7-1 on the assault table. As the combat is taking place in Strasbourg, and the assault table was chosen, the program never reduced the odds. If the program routine makes it that an Automatic odds is always no down shift there is a problem.

Anyone who wants to can download the file in post 2 and see for themselves. Just pick to use the engineer or not.

[joshuamnave]

Yet another place where an in game list of modifiers would be useful. I have absolutely no idea why this unit has 1 defense factor.

[Orm]

ORIGINAL: Zartacla

Yet another place where an in game list of modifiers would be useful. I have absolutely no idea why this unit has 1 defense factor.

I am in a rush so I just post the relevant rule for this.


RAC: 13.1 Partisans (option 46)
....
Add 1 to each partisan unit’s combat factors if it is defending in a forest or jungle hex.