Castles in the Sand - Spidery(J) vs MrKane(A) no MrKane please

[Lowpe]

In looking closer at the report...what altitude did the Nells go in at? And were the Jakes all on search/asw?

[Spidery]

Thank-you for the cheering words folks. I'm not as happy about the result. I seem to have blown much of my pre-war trained pilots without getting a single enemy ship sunk. Next time we engage I won't have such good pilots.

Looking a bit more closely I see two of my carriers have a cruise speed of 1 which is going to make it hard to save them.

I will send a CL/DD force to a destination just a bit South so that it should sweep through the area and return North before the day but may encounter some stragglers if he retreats South. The BB and CA forces will move to cover the retreating carriers. I am also expecting a lot of subs to move to try and catch me and will try and cover the string of islands with ASW forces so I can engage some of them in shallow water.

Two of the CS ships were with the KB and had all their Jakes on search at 6000 feet. With the carrier forces so close (I had expected to be engaging at range 6 or so with him in the Tulagi area) they were lost to CAP in droves. There were also some Jakes at Buik on 50% search/50% attack, 11 of those attacked.

I had my Vals on the carriers at 10% search which probably wasn't necessary given the close engagement.

The Nells & Betties were at 6000 feet, the KB planes at 12000 feet (with some A6M5 on CAP at 18000 feet), some army planes were at 1000 feet with Low Nav trained pilots in them.

[setloz]

You are right, it's not a fair exchange for you.

I don't think there's much you could do to turn this around. On an optimistic level, you stand to lose at least 3 carriers.
Keep in mind that TFs in port do not disband until AFTER the air combat phase has resolved. I've lost several BBs that I was hoping to save by disbanding in port because of this.
So, with the allied CVs still hunting, it wouldn't help if you tried to disband the heavily damaged CVs in a port like Buin.

And of course, I'll state the obvious - he's surely going to send lots of TFs to clean up your stragglers. So prepare for night and day surface combat.

Good luck!

[Lowpe]

ORIGINAL: Spidery

Looking a bit more closely I see two of my carriers have a cruise speed of 1 which is going to make it hard to save them.

Ugh., Then pray for bad weather. I have got my fingers crossed...Allies might retreat...

[Spidery]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

ORIGINAL: Spidery

Looking a bit more closely I see two of my carriers have a cruise speed of 1 which is going to make it hard to save them.

Ugh., Then pray for bad weather. I have got my fingers crossed...Allies might retreat...

Forecast is for clear skies[:D].

The Zuiho is trying to make a full speed move that may well break it. The Zuihaku can move at cruise speed to Buka. Everything should reach Buka this turn, or sink. The intact CVs are stopping 1 hex off there. SCTF have been left on the approaches and there is a nice minefield freshly laid. I have flown more aircraft into Rabaul and Buka and am airlifting some more aviation support to Buka.

Another worry is that a lot of ships are short of AA ammo.

Could be interesting to see what happens

[Spidery]

ORIGINAL: setloz

You are right, it's not a fair exchange for you.

I don't think there's much you could do to turn this around.

...

Good luck!

I hope there is something I can do or I have just wasted 4 hours moving planes around, sorting out task force composition, etc.[:D]

[Spidery]

September 14th 1942

Air Losses: 45 Japanese, 5 Allied, 19 Pilots
Japanese occupy:
Allies occupy:
Japanese land at:
Allies land at:

Pacific

Allied carriers retreat to Tulagi but three cruiser forces pursue.

The first one is of 3 CL and meets a cover force of 3 CA and suffers

Japanese Ships
CA Maya, Shell hits 1
CA Nachi, Shell hits 1
CA Mikuma, Shell hits 12
DD Hatsuyuki, Shell hits 1
DD Ayanami
DD Sagiri
DD Yugiri, Shell hits 1, heavy fires

Allied Ships
CL St. Louis, Shell hits 7, Torpedo hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
CL Helena, Shell hits 6, heavy fires
CL Honolulu, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Lardner, Shell hits 1
DD Woodworth
DD Bancroft, Shell hits 3, on fire
DD Sims, Shell hits 1
DD Hughes
DD Anderson
DD Hammann

The second one is of 3 CL and gets up against the KB and the big BB guns that are useless. CS Chiyoda and DD Kagero are lost.

Japanese Ships
CV Junyo
CV Hiyo, Shell hits 1
CVL Shoho, Shell hits 1
CS Chitose, Shell hits 3
CS Chiyoda, Shell hits 7, heavy fires, heavy damage
BB Hiei, Shell hits 1
BB Kirishima
BB Ise, Shell hits 2
DD Kagero, Shell hits 1, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
DD Arashi
DD Tanikaze
DD Arashio
DD Kasumi, Shell hits 1
DD Hibiki
DD Shinonome

Allied Ships
CL Boise
CL Phoenix
CL Nashville, Shell hits 3
DD Laffey
DD Mustin
DD Russell
DD O'Brien, Shell hits 2
DD Walke

The third one has 4 CA and finds no action.

Allied subs score one hit on the CVL Zuiho but it is a dud. Sea and air ASW claims many hits but no idea how much damage really inflicted.

The only air strikes are against the Allied CA group which has no CAP. The first strike is of 56 Nells or Betties, average NavT skill of 70, experience about 60, attacking with torpedoes under partial cloud against 4 CA they score zero hits[:@]. Next up is 18 Kates, another 18 misses[:(]. Finally, 16 Kates and 24 Vals score[:)]:

CA Minneapolis, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 1, heavy fires
CA Vincennes, Bomb hits 1
CA Astoria
CA New Orleans, Bomb hits 3, on fire

Ship sunk sounds are heard, Intel is claiming the CL St Louis and a CA. VP gain suggests just the St Louis.

Status of CV see below. The Zuiho is unlikely to survive. The others should survive if they can make it through the sub threat to somewhere safe.

China

The IJA performs much better than the IJN.

Defenders are driven back across the river into Kienko

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 42620 troops, 693 guns, 495 vehicles, Assault Value = 1034

Defending force 48505 troops, 133 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 765

Japanese adjusted assault: 491

Allied adjusted defense: 232

Japanese assault odds: 2 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), disruption(-), fatigue(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1083 casualties reported
Squads: 20 destroyed, 133 disabled
Non Combat: 8 destroyed, 67 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 5 disabled
Guns lost 24 (12 destroyed, 12 disabled)
Vehicles lost 52 (23 destroyed, 29 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
17465 casualties reported
Squads: 361 destroyed, 58 disabled
Non Combat: 526 destroyed, 89 disabled
Engineers: 26 destroyed, 3 disabled
Guns lost 18 (16 destroyed, 2 disabled)
Units retreated 7

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
37th Division
19th Division
14th Division
15th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
2nd Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment
13th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
7th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
4th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
1st Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
9th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
15th Ind.Medium Field Artillery Regiment
5th Army
26th Field Artillery Regiment
51st Ind.Mtn.Gun Battalion
4th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
2nd Hvy.Artillery Regiment
8th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
52nd Ind.Mtn.Gun Battalion
3rd Hvy.Artillery Regiment
22nd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
6th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
2nd Medium Field Artillery Regiment

Defending units:
40th Chinese Corps
71st Chinese Corps
48th Chinese Corps
2nd Chinese Corps
67th Chinese Corps
75th Chinese Corps
36th Group Army

Chinese forces wandering in the wilderness near Chihkiang are attacked and severely mauled:

Attacking force 13457 troops, 113 guns, 56 vehicles, Assault Value = 431

Defending force 41615 troops, 60 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 813

Japanese adjusted assault: 88

Allied adjusted defense: 35

Japanese assault odds: 2 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), disruption(-), fatigue(-), experience(-)
supply(-)
Attacker: leaders(-)

Japanese ground losses:
129 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 24 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Allied ground losses:
13806 casualties reported
Squads: 369 destroyed, 37 disabled
Non Combat: 289 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 6 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 4 (4 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units retreated 8

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
17th Division

Defending units:
46th Chinese Corps
9th Prov Chinese Corps
65th Chinese Corps
50th Chinese Corps
70th Chinese Corps
58th Chinese Corps
53rd Chinese Corps
5th Chinese Cavalry Corps

Engineering

Quiet

R&D

Quiet

[Spidery]

China situation.

Priority is to get across the Jialing and establish a route for fuel to get to Chengtu. This will generate the supply needed to fuel the offensive in the plains.

Second priority is to damage Allied forces that are in the open.

Third priority is the push on Paoshan.

[Spidery]

South pacific and the sub infestation.

It is getting real easy for my ASW aircraft, they can almost drop a DC anywhere and get a near miss!

[Spidery]

Can I risk having ships at Kavieng or Rabaul to get some fixing done and if so for how long?

Once he has Tulagi or Lunga expanded to level 4, Rabaul will be in extended range for medium bombers, even at level 2 he can fly heavy bombers with extended range load. At level 5 he will be able to launch massed heavy bomber strikes at normal range so definitely need to be out of there before then.

Rabaul is in extended range for B-17D and B-24D from Australia and in normal range for LB-30.

The Zuiho, if it can put the fires out, and the Zuikaku will have difficulty making it to Truk through the sub menace with their current speed and state

[Spidery]

September 15th 1942

Air Losses: 11 Japanese, 8 Allied, 3 Pilots
Japanese occupy:
Allies occupy:
Japanese land at:
Allies land at:

Pacific

An Allied cruiser force pursues to very close to Rabaul and engages an ASW task force. DD Hamakaze is lost.

Day Time Surface Combat, near Feni Islands at 107,127, Range 26,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Yukikaze, Shell hits 1
DD Hamakaze, Shell hits 8, heavy fires, heavy damage

Allied Ships
CA Astoria, Shell hits 1
CA Vincennes, Shell hits 1
DD Benham
DD Ellet, Shell hits 2
DD Stack, Shell hits 2, on fire
DD Sterett, Shell hits 2

This enemy force then seems to have vanished but a different one is subject to repeated air attack:

Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Woodlark Island at 106,130

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 44 NM, estimated altitude 16,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 16 minutes

Japanese aircraft
D3A1 Val x 12

No Japanese losses

Allied Ships
CA New Orleans, Bomb hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
CA Minneapolis, Bomb hits 2, on fire

Aircraft Attacking:
5 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb
7 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Woodlark Island at 106,130

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 41 NM, estimated altitude 14,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 15 minutes

Japanese aircraft
D3A1 Val x 12

Japanese aircraft losses
D3A1 Val: 2 damaged

Allied Ships
CA New Orleans, Bomb hits 3, heavy fires, heavy damage
CA Minneapolis, Bomb hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
4 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb
8 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring CA Minneapolis


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Woodlark Island at 106,130

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 49 NM, estimated altitude 8,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 20 minutes

Japanese aircraft
B5N2 Kate x 7
D3A1 Val x 8

Japanese aircraft losses
B5N2 Kate: 1 damaged

Allied Ships
CA Minneapolis, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Lang, Bomb hits 3, heavy fires, heavy damage
CA New Orleans, Bomb hits 3, heavy fires, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
7 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
4 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb
4 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring CA New Orleans


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Woodlark Island at 106,130

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 80 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 30 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 10
D3A1 Val x 30

Japanese aircraft losses
D3A1 Val: 1 damaged

Allied Ships
DD Wilson
CA New Orleans, Bomb hits 3, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Lang, Bomb hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
CA Minneapolis, Bomb hits 6, heavy fires, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
15 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
3 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb
12 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg GP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring DD Lang
Heavy smoke from fires obscuring CA Minneapolis

4 Seagull show up as ground losses on the day so I assume one of the CA has been sunk. This matches the VP tally.

The SS Gar hits a mine at Buka. Various Allied and Japanese SS are subject to air attacks with claimed hits.

CVL Zuiho is one hex from Rabaul and now has 62/71/22/11 damage.
CV Zuikaku also has one hex to go and is at 52/48/40 damage

Burma

Allied cruiser forces bombard Akyab. Light damage to troops but some damage to base facilities and supplies lost.

China

Another good attack near Chungking

Japanese ground losses:
1489 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 112 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 24 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 11 disabled
Guns lost 22 (5 destroyed, 17 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
11799 casualties reported
Squads: 497 destroyed, 52 disabled
Non Combat: 540 destroyed, 24 disabled
Engineers: 12 destroyed, 5 disabled
Guns lost 18 (13 destroyed, 5 disabled)
Units retreated 4

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
116th Division
13th Division
104th Division
3rd Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment
21st Medium Field Artillery Battalion
28th Mountain Gun Regiment
7th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
11th Field Artillery Regiment
3rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
10th Mortar Battalion

Defending units:
4th Chinese Corps
72nd Chinese Corps
26th Chinese Corps
74th Chinese Corps

Air strikes continue to do damage.

Engineering

Quiet

R&D

Quiet

[Spidery]

September 16th 1942

Air Losses: 5 Japanese, 10 Allied, 2 Pilots
Japanese occupy:
Allies occupy:
Japanese land at:
Allies land at:

Pacific

Tried something novel. MrKane had lots of interesting task forces just south of Tulagi so I-121 slipped in and dropped 40 mines in the hex. Result!

DD Perkins, Mine hits 1, on fire, heavy damage

However, one better

TF 183 encounters mine field at 115,138

Allied Ships
DD Case
DD Drayton
DD Mahan
CV Wasp, Mine hits 1, on fire, heavy damage

6 mines cleared

Wasp was previously damaged, some carrier planes are shown as lost on the ground, jump of 300 unexplained VP for the day all confirm that the CV Wasp has been sunk[8D].

All mines are cleared in the one day but who cares[:)]

Meanwhile, SS I-172 succumbs having been badly damaged by air attack[:(].

Zuiho has its fires out, 65/71/26 damage.

Burma

Recce shows Allied BB at Calcutta.

China

More good progress and heavy damage inflicted.

Engineering

Quiet

R&D

D4Y4 to 11/44
B6N2 to 7/43

[Lowpe]

Good day. My experience with mine hits is that they always list ships as sunk, incorrectly...but perhaps you have enough confirming evidence. Did you hear sinking sounds?

Fires out on Zuiho?

[Spidery]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Good day. My experience with mine hits is that they always list ships as sunk, incorrectly...but perhaps you have enough confirming evidence. Did you hear sinking sounds?

Fires out on Zuiho?

At least two sinking sounds during the turn but those could be related to the fact that he has various CA and DD damaged.

The most decisive evidence is that the day loss shows 4 F4F-4 and 3 TBF-1 as lost on the ground. As I haven't done anything else to cause that I can only see it as being the residue of planes left on a carrier after it was rendered unable to operate and then sunk.

Yes, fires out on Zuiho and only a few more system and engine damage sustained.

[Lowpe]

If you manage to save your two threatened carriers, which I think you will now that the fires are out and submarines are the biggest peril, I think you have pulled off a win here.

The Americans lost a lot of carrier planes...gotta slow him down.

Gee, I am glad you spent four hours on your turn...not much you can do eh? [:D]

[Spidery]

September 17th 1942

Air Losses: 4 Japanese, 2 Allied, 1 Pilots
Japanese occupy:
Allies occupy:
Japanese land at:
Allies land at:

Pacific

Quiet. Allied CVs are spotted South of Tulagi. Lots of attacks on both sides subs. Nothing conclusive.

Burma

Quiet

China

Some damaging attacks but an attack on the road to Tsuying is not good:

Ground combat at 68,47 (near Kunming)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 29545 troops, 370 guns, 166 vehicles, Assault Value = 879

Defending force 16601 troops, 127 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 358

Japanese adjusted assault: 261

Allied adjusted defense: 580

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1515 casualties reported
Squads: 14 destroyed, 140 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 13 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 9 disabled
Guns lost 22 (2 destroyed, 20 disabled)
Vehicles lost 3 (1 destroyed, 2 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
138 casualties reported
Squads: 3 destroyed, 11 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled

Assaulting units:
27th Division
24th Division
20th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
12th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
5th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
12th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
15th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion

Defending units:
1st Chinese Corps
66th Chinese Corps

I'm not going to budge this without extensive air attack first and it is close enough to Allied bases that there is a risk of running into CAP so I can't do that without having more fighters here. At the moment I don't really have fighters to spare with the need for them at Rabaul, Darwin and Magwe in particular.

May see if I can work around it to take Tsuyung directly but it is at least a months walk through the mountains or nearly two months to carry tanks and artillery over the mountains.

Engineering

Yenan expands airfield to 3 (I have had 1 engineer squad here and forgot abput it!)

R&D

Quiet

[Spidery]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

If you manage to save your two threatened carriers, which I think you will now that the fires are out and submarines are the biggest peril, I think you have pulled off a win here.

The Americans lost a lot of carrier planes...gotta slow him down.

Gee, I am glad you spent four hours on your turn...not much you can do eh? [:D]

I'ld count it as a draw or marginal win to me. Although the loss of a CV and a CS is bad the worse loss is of trained pilots. Particularly, as I haven't had much success getting a training program together for the IJN.

I think a lot of his carriers have upgrades in October so it wouldn't surprise me if he moved them all back to do that and his next op was launched in November.

The biggest concern I have now is that he will use a 4E strike at Rabaul port. Moonlight is currently 57% so he could try a night strike in a few days time. Zuikaku fixed 5 float last turn so will probably be able to move it before the full moon (52/39/40). Zuiho fixed 2 float last turn so it may have to stay for the moon (65/69/26).

These last few turns have all been taking longer than I can afford, with both China and the South Pacific needing adjustments each day.

[Spidery]

September 18th 1942

Air Losses: 5 Japanese, 2 Allied, 1 Pilots(but one MIA is recovered)
Japanese occupy:
Allies occupy:
Japanese land at:
Allies land at:

Pacific

Quiet. A couple of sub attacks against task forces containing CA near Ndeni for no result.

Allied subs seem mostly have moved towards Truk, lots of ASW assets there but no success at attacking them (a few claimed hits from the air).

Burma

Quiet

China

Quiet. A few victories against small Chinese LCU; the 2nd Group Army has been destroyed and will be reformed.

Engineering

Ramree Island to 2, Pingsiang to 2, Batavia to 6. Port Blair forts to 4.

Allies have built a port at Lunga and expanded Townsville port to 6.

R&D

Quiet.

Economy

Supply has been increasing rapidly and I now have 1.2 million in Japan.

Still have over a million tons of liquids waiting to be shipped to Japan.

[setloz]

Spidery
I'ld count it as a draw or marginal win to me. Although the loss of a CV and a CS is bad the worse loss is of trained pilots. Particularly, as I haven't had much success getting a training program together for the IJN.

I think a lot of his carriers have upgrades in October so it wouldn't surprise me if he moved them all back to do that and his next op was launched in November.

The biggest concern I have now is that he will use a 4E strike at Rabaul port. Moonlight is currently 57% so he could try a night strike in a few days time. Zuikaku fixed 5 float last turn so will probably be able to move it before the full moon (52/39/40). Zuiho fixed 2 float last turn so it may have to stay for the moon (65/69/26).

Wonderful idea with the mines south of Tulagi! Planes lost on the ground most certainly mean sunk CV. [:D]

The problem with massed 4E night strikes at Rabaul is that no matter how many nightfighters you have on duty, some of them will strike home. And a damaged CV is a big target...

However, I think the biggest danger to moving your CVs will be his subs. Any chance you can clear out a path to Truk with low level search planes (night and day) and lots of ASW TFs?

[Spidery]

The problem with massed 4E night strikes at Rabaul is that no matter how many nightfighters you have on duty, some of them will strike home. And a damaged CV is a big target...

Until he gets Lunga or Tulagi up to level 2 airfield he can't launch a mass strike as he is limited to flying B-17D at extended range or liberators. The later models don't have the reach. As such between CAP, flak, balloons and the aircraft that stray at night during a long range attack I think it is iffy how effective a night strike will be. However, he will have Lunga or Tulagi expanded by the time of the full moon.

Between Rabaul and Truk I would estimate he has about 40 subs operating. I have about 20 DD or SC trying to get some of those and air at Kavieng and Truk. I hope that if I can keep the pressure up he will start taking losses and reduce the number of subs.

I have no feeling for the likelihood that coastwatchers will report the location of my CV.