Distant Worlds AI

[Icemania]

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins
- NEW MODDING FEATURE: defined Research path. Optionally allow specifying project order for a race for each tech tree (see new entries in race files: WeaponsResearchProjectOrder, EnergyResearchProjectOrder, HighTechResearchProjectOrder)

Massive, massive change! Please use this feature to kick some human ass! Weapons combined with Ship Designs would be a productive first target.

#1 Mod Request: AI Research Build Orders

[Tcby]

Yep, this is excellent. Combined with the research output buffs....these be good times.

[Icemania]

MOVED TO: Possible AI Improvement Mod

[BlueTemplar]

Do the AI-controlled empires have any bonuses/handicaps/different ways to function in Normal Difficulty compared to the Player controlled (even if completely automated) empire?

[Wanabe]

Awesome work there Icemania. With a fixed research path for each race I imagine substantial performance improvements for various races, can help slightly improve the "flavour" of races aswell

[Tcby]

Wow Ice, amazing work.

[Icemania]

In the AI Improvement Mod link posted earlier there is a link to an early working version. Races updated include the Boskara, Dhayut, Gizurean, Quameno, Shakturi, Sluken and Wekkarus. Ideas to further improve the Race, Policy or Design Templates are welcome. Probably the best way to do this is to select one of these races, play on full auto, and note any observations in that thread. Note it's setup as a Theme for Vanilla only at this stage.

[Icemania]

For those that only check the main forum please note that the AI Improvement Mod has been released as an Alpha. This Mod covers a number of the topics raised in this thread including AI Research and AI Ship and Base Designs. Feedback welcome.

[Icemania]

For those that only check the main forum please note that the AI Improvement Mod has now been released 1.0.

[Icemania]

For those that only check the main forum please note that the AI Improvement Mod has now been released 1.01 for both Vanilla and Extended.

[Evan85]

Dang Ice, that looks so awesome...

I feel bad for just finding DW:U and still playing around vanilla. Anyways just starting a hard game setting to see if I can steamroll in it about as easily as I did in the default setup. If my assumption is correct, I'll jump on your mod soon and you'll get some fresh-eyed feedback.

Keep up the good work!

[Werewolf13]

ORIGINAL: Icemania

But the reality is all this is probably going to have to wait for Distant Worlds 2. I really hope Matrix put an AI Programmer in the team which sole purpose in life is to challenge the player base. Or follow what Frogboy has in mind for Galactic Civilisations 3 e.g. using Steamworks to monitor player strategies and then use the best of those strategies in AI updates.

That's an interesting concept and one I've seen utilized in real life. It is also fraught with much danger. Here's why I say that.

In 1979 while serving on USS Dewey, DDG-45 we deployed to the Mediteranean. An FT buddy and I were both into chess at the time. As a Fire Control Tech he had access to the firecontrol computers (pretty primitive at that time but good enough to do what we wanted). He programmed it to play chess. It was dumber than dirt at first but the programming had it save every move and position it made that led to a computer victory. By the end of that Med run (6 months worth) there wasn't a person on board that could beat that computer. the Dewey had a crew of a little over 400 sailors - not all of them played chess.

Now imagine that the AI developed for DW:Universe uses a plan as proposed by Icemania (highlighted above). With 1000's and 1000's of players it wouldn't take long before the AI became unbeatable - even by you gurus and certainly not by the likes of me.

Is that really what y'all want? An unbeatable AI?

[Ikke]

Considering, you, the player has the option of automation, I don't fear an unbeatable AI. Rather, I am interested in seeing a game where you work together with the AI, guiding it along - the potential is there in DW. Imagine a game where you set the overall war strategy (attrition, blitz, research more strategies), prioritise targets, set targets for operations, etc, and let the AI work it out.

[Icemania]

ORIGINAL: Werewolf1326

ORIGINAL: Icemania
But the reality is all this is probably going to have to wait for Distant Worlds 2. I really hope Matrix put an AI Programmer in the team which sole purpose in life is to challenge the player base. Or follow what Frogboy has in mind for Galactic Civilisations 3 e.g. using Steamworks to monitor player strategies and then use the best of those strategies in AI updates.

Is that really what y'all want? An unbeatable AI?

No Mr Wolf. There are many, many more variables to optimise in a Space 4X game than a Chess game.

What this approach would deliver is semi-adaptive AI, albeit a manual one:

Frogboy would program new strategies, and any decent human player is then going to adapt, fast, and find another way to outsmart the AI.

Frogboy would program some more new strategies, and any decent human player is then going to adapt, fast, and find another way to outsmart the AI.

Along the way Frogboy could probably include better true adaptive AI as well i.e. routines to counter various player strategies.

And so on.

As compared to:

Matrix program basic AI strategies, that never change, which any decent human player is going to slaughter before long, and thereafter never be remotely close to being challenged in a fair fight.

While I'd like to think the AI Improvement Mod has helped here a little (they are more or less my research build orders and the designs are as close as I can make them with the restrictions in the templates), doing this properly adds a whole new dimension to the gaming experience.

Distant Worlds is a mighty fun game anyway. But for me the AI is by far the most important element of a Space 4X game and hence is top of my wishlist for Distant Worlds 2.

And if you don't want a challenge just play on low difficulty.

[AKicebear]

The AI could also select designs/strategies based on their probability of winning within the whole history of tracked games.

Normal difficult - AI uses tactics that lead to victory in 50% of games
Hard - 75%
etc...

[Icemania]

And when Normal difficulty AI victory rates drop to 40% ... beef the designs/strategies up again! No complacency!

[Cauldyth]

What most of us just want is an AI that doesn't do stupid things. As a bonus, many of us would also like an AI that roleplays a little, for immersion.

[Icemania]

ORIGINAL: Cauldyth
What most of us just want is an AI that doesn't do stupid things. As a bonus, many of us would also like an AI that roleplays a little, for immersion.

For Distant Worlds 1 that's fair enough. It's one of the reasons I've invested so much time in the AI Improvement Mod, to do whatever I can within modding limitations. But for Distant Worlds 2 I hope more significant goals are set, while retaining the roleplay and immersion.