Minefields

[wodin]

Still seems he units make rather silly moves when encountering minefields. I was watching my units go one after the other into minefields even when there was a good few minutes between them..surely they'd see the wreckage or see the other units trying to negotiate the minefield and then try and get around. I think once one unit has entered a minefield any unit say coming along after one maybe two mins max will try and find a different way. The amount of casualties caused needlessly in this particular scenario pretty much finished the scenario off.

[IronMikeGolf]

What kind of movement order?

[CapnDarwin]

This is another can of worms. What movement type, red or blue force since red will run a field more times than not, weather, readiness, under fire, etc.. I agree that we can improve the response based on all these factors and a die roll or two.

I will move this thread to the request sub-forum as well so we all can comment and help drive changes in 2.1.

[wodin]

Deliberate move orders, American units. Either way if you see a unit in front take a hit by a mine your likely to go a different way..which doesn't happen quick enough at the moment.

[CapnDarwin]

Part of the problem while in a combat move all spread out and looking for bad guys is telling what blew up the track 500m in front of you. First reactions are going to be looking for the shooters, not noticing you are driving into the field as well. I will agree that more fidelity needs to be brought in to the situation and it is a good idea to see improved in the 2.1 engine.

[wodin]

Yeah maybe one more unit..bu I had three sometimes more entering the mined area as I said minutes after the first unit went into it..sometimes 10mins. Just needs a tweak I think.

[CapnDarwin]

It will get a bit of a revamp in 2.1 for the things mentioned above.

[MikeGER]

ORIGINAL: wodin

Still seems he units make rather silly moves when encountering minefields. I was watching my units go one after the other into minefields even when there was a good few minutes between them..

did they all start from the same hex, like out of a stack next to the unknown minefield? or were the units like pearls on a string one by one?

I think there is sometines a little difference between how it is 'shown to the player' when the game engine 'does' a move and what the engine does simulate as a abstraction of RL

if the units all sit in the same hex and move into the next one (and that has the mines) all units may be considered moving 'at the same time' like 'moving a stack of counters in a boardgame', even so cause of the nature of the game-engine every counter in the stack is moved single one by one in the UI-display
..but for the game engine 'its still in the same delta-t increment of simulated time' (i guestimate its 1 min increments)
so all units (in the stack) get effected by the hit probability, and all are stuck for 30 min until the field is finally cleared.

well, if the units are in different hexes (so not in one stack) and unit #1 enters minefield (get effected, calls up the combat engineeres) and a second unit enters first the now emty hex the first unit started from, and then also moves on into the minefield, then there is something questionable.

engine-wise a hex with units(s) stuck in a minefield and the 30 min timer has started ticking down for a resonable time (the waring is out), should be seem by the engine as 'full' depening on the countries doctrine

[Mad Russian]

ORIGINAL: wodin

Deliberate move orders, American units. Either way if you see a unit in front take a hit by a mine your likely to go a different way..which doesn't happen quick enough at the moment.

Anti-vehicle mines:

No doctrine I know of says that you go another way if you encounter mines.

Soviet doctrine is to immediately breach the field with the vehicles present. NATO would to my knowledge do the same. To stop, turn around and move another direction is a worse answer.

You personally, want your units to not move into the minefield. That means they stop and start to pile up. They won't just automatically go in a different direction. First it has to be determined what it is that is causing the casualties. When that's been determined you have already degraded the minefield. Each mine that goes off degrades it. The real intent of the minefield is to in fact, slow or stop you. If you slow or stop they will hit you with the real weapon of choice. Artillery.

So, stopping, milling around for a bit, giving new orders and turning everyone around for a new route will get far more of your people killed than simply identifying where the field is and running it. Engineers will come long after the battle and clear the field. Or do an assault breach if it's part of a static defense line.

Anti-infantry mines:

This is far more problematic. A single mine here will more than likely cause multiple casualties and if the unit is small could make them combat ineffective. The same problem is still active however, the real reason for the minefield is to slow or stop you so they can deliver artillery on you.

Hope this helps.

Good Hunting.

MR

[IronMikeGolf]

What MR, said. In the US Army, it's called the "In-Stride Breach".

Not far fetched for a Bn Commander to have more than one company breach. By doctrine, a battalion will use two lanes through a minefield. A company would use one lane.