The Arsenal of Idiocracy - Cribtop (A) vs John 3rd (J) - BTS Mod

[zuluhour]

Will be reading from my I-Phone at work. Time to swap out that banner.

[pontiouspilot]

Collect many AKs and APs from DEI and Indian Ocean area and get them to Aden and Capetown. You will need them to load reinforcements and supplies. When you get them to Capetown send at least 2/3 to East-coast USA. You start with little there and it is easier to resupply Indian Ocean theatre out of eastern USA notwithstanding the distances involved. Collect many tankers and get them to Abadan ASAP. If able, load up as much fuel outa DEI as possible and remove it somewhere as you exit.

If you want to throw a monkey wrench at an early landing in or near Oz I find the 2-3 non-static Aussie coastal artillery units to be extremely effective. I have held off invasions at Pt moresby with 1 such unit and have severely crippled another at Rabaul. It does however cost some Pol pts.

[Q-Ball]

You can get the AVG to DEI via Victoria Point/Tavoy/Alor Star, but this is dependent on starting immediately on Dec 9th at latest. But I've done it.

I like doing it, at least for 1 group, as they are a nasty surprise. You can also move them to Australia eventually, where there is little else available for fighter support in early 1942, so there's that.

Swapping out P-40Es to put the older planes into Chinese pool is a good idea, provided you have the supply available later for the CHinese airforce, which is debateable. If you evac a couple units to India, you do solve that problem.

[Cribtop]

Thanks, all. Currently, everything in the DEI is loading fuel and will run away. Most will indeed go to Cape Town/Aden as suggested.

[Cribtop]

Well, more of the Thundering Herd die on the 8th as does CL Marblehead and 2 escorting 4 stacker DDs at Balikpapan. The latter ships were bait for a trap, we shall see if John sticks around or tries to invade. We are sending in the Asiatic fleet CLs and CAs with DD support tonight. 30% chance we catch something but if we hit pay dirt it should be fun.

The brave Hong Kong DDs make Singers alive! Next mission: Kamikaze against the anticipated Mersing landing.

We have ordered an Op against a group of cruisers that invaded Lae on the 8th by FT TF. If they stick around it could be fun.

Heard unexplained sinking sounds during the turn. We must've sunk a few of those Samah to CRB transports, which is nice.

Coming soon: Screenshots by AO and some idea of THE PLAN. After the first few days of chaos I intend to settle down into a weekly summary of key events in each AO.

[durnedwolf]

why not wait two turns after they start dropping troops and then go after them as they leave. Also, if you have any aircraft that can do night time naval search it should help your DD to home in on the targets.

[Cribtop]

A few musings on early Allied naval tactics. Like many players, I am seeking to use expendable surface forces in AOs we all know will fall to turn back poorly guarded invasion forces (so far John hasn't given me anything much to get hold of in this regard). Looking at things from both JFB and AFB eyes, I begin to wonder about the efficacy of this approach. In all my Japanese games, one or two smallish invasions got hit by SCTFs or bombers and eviscerated, leading to shame and loss of face. However, in the end as Japan I loaded up again, provided more force protection, and really suffered neither strategic dislocation nor material delay. This all leads to the question of whether or not these raids really provide any benefit to the Allied side other than something to do and morale improvement. Hmm.

That said, we are currently engaged in Operation Groundhog. At undisclosed islands in the Solomon Sea and the DEI, small dot bases that are unlikely to be reconned by fast-moving John now host disbanded SCTFs. Intention is for the Japanese to move on a nearby target thinking the coast is clear only to pop up (like a Groundhog) and run in for unexpected mayhem.

[zuluhour]

I assume you have sent engineers to the eastern south Pacific to set up a relay station for fuel to Australia and New Zealand. The short legged small tankers can make the round trip without refueling. I send them out singly from San Diego on a daily basis and use the big tankers to make the final leg. A level 5 port has proved more than adequate for the job with 100 naval support, one BF which can also support a little ASW as well. The computer direct route seems to work fine for me. I am curious to see how the ambushes play out. In the same vane I like to hide one or two sea plane bases in CenPac the same way to give early warning on my "deep" sea lanes to Australia.

NorPac: Not sure what John will do or when, but I hate Dutch Harbor and move that base to Umnak next door as quickly as I can. I risk the engineers alone to do the dirty work first before garrisoning. If he ignores it long enough it can prove to be a nice airbase.

[HansBolter]

I personally don't see a need for a relay station, although I use Pago Pago as one of sorts for fuel headed to Suva or Noumea.

Even the 8k leg tankers can make one way trips from LA to Auckland. The 12k leg ones make it even easier. I send one third with orders to unload at Auckland and two thirds with orders to not unload.
At Auckland they pick up escorts to ship the two thirds to Sydney.

Using PP for distribution to SoPAC and Auckland for distribution to SWPAC helps me keep them straight and separated.

It also pays to set up tankers and/or xAKLs shipping fuel from the East Coast to Balboa and to Capetown.
Balboa can be a relief from shipping through concentrated sub fields that may cluster around LA and Capetown is vital to getting fuel to SW OZ.

[Cribtop]

I am definitely planning the tanker and supply route but am waiting a bit to see whether John goes for the Line Islands and Christmas Island (Pacific) first. In far SOPAC, I am building a defended base at Pago Pago with a rear area base at Tahiti. The level of commitment to these bases will again vary based on how far and fast John moves in their direction.

[zuluhour]

I agree Hans on the straight trip later, but there is not enough fuel left to reroute them (I move the small ones singly until '44) when a naval air "danger" presents itself, outside of disbanding them somewhere. Some thoughts on SWPac. HO: build Alice Springs now to AF9. Get some supply into Terapo (the PM garrison always retreats that way for me) so they can build forts and recover some. Ref Hans, I don't escort the little guys either so I need to have one day of flank in reserve. I also like to build up Cloncurry? as well for stationing air transports should the need arise to get supply south to Katherine or Daly Waters. DBs and a CL SAG cover Port Aurther  as well to serve as EW for Oz if Perth goes early. For me the Allied strategy early, and I have failed miserably at it in my current game, is looking ahead a month after the "what if" happens.



**I should note that another reason I use the relay approach is to refuel every convoy (now I mean LCUs, AC/TFs, SCTF, ) there so they enter the theater fully ready to use flank if necessary.

*** The Alice Springs thing, You can hit the IJA in the open by 4E and Darwin and any land approach from Perth using the rail trail. Provides huge moral boost. I see no reason to garrison Darwin either after the herd passes through. No need to make a sacrifice to the emperor for no gain. I combine the Aussie base units and begin construction at Daly or Katherine so my escorts can fly LRCAP over targets should the need arise. This only works with PDU on as you will need the P38 to really make it work well. This game I have played the air war well IMO. I am at 2:1 a2a and climbing. The ground on the other hand....I hope you are playing with stacking.

[Cribtop]

Good thoughts. I've been on the receiving end of IJA tanks bombed by 4Es in open desert - not fun. Nice as Allies to be able to contemplate building to level 9. Looking forward to the SeaBees!

We are playing with stacking.

[Mike Solli]

Speaking from the experience of being on the receiving end, sacrifice assets where it really matters to the Japanese player. Ted opted to oppose me at Pt. Moresby, a base I really needed. The end result was my not taking Pt. Moresby and losing the Hiryu. Using assets is good, for the right reason.

The same can be said for Japan too.

ORIGINAL: Cribtop

A few musings on early Allied naval tactics. Like many players, I am seeking to use expendable surface forces in AOs we all know will fall to turn back poorly guarded invasion forces (so far John hasn't given me anything much to get hold of in this regard). Looking at things from both JFB and AFB eyes, I begin to wonder about the efficacy of this approach. In all my Japanese games, one or two smallish invasions got hit by SCTFs or bombers and eviscerated, leading to shame and loss of face. However, in the end as Japan I loaded up again, provided more force protection, and really suffered neither strategic dislocation nor material delay. This all leads to the question of whether or not these raids really provide any benefit to the Allied side other than something to do and morale improvement. Hmm.

That said, we are currently engaged in Operation Groundhog. At undisclosed islands in the Solomon Sea and the DEI, small dot bases that are unlikely to be reconned by fast-moving John now host disbanded SCTFs. Intention is for the Japanese to move on a nearby target thinking the coast is clear only to pop up (like a Groundhog) and run in for unexpected mayhem.

[Cribtop]

Good thoughts. On the latest turn, John invaded Palembang by FT TF. I had the UK CLs and Force Z disbanded in ports nearby but the use of FT TFs negated my intention to hit him at a base he really needs. I am thinking of where else to oppose him.

[Cribtop]

OK, I owe you screenies and the first true weekly update, but for the moment:

ALERT!

Cats provide a good report on a 6 ship enemy TF, mostly claimed to be APDs. So what, you say? The Cats are flying from Pearl. The TF is already past Johnson and Palmyra by a good bit and is headed East. He is SW of the Big Island.

Is John actually trying for Hawaii? Well, well. He could just be trying to sneak up before heading to the Line Islands from the back side, but really there isn't anything the direction this TF is heading except for Hawaii. Buckle up, kids, this might get rough!

[apbarog]

That is very interesting. A small quick landing near Hilo is certainly possible, but I don't see that accomplishing anything other than being a distraction. Unless a big invasion is on the way, and you just don't see it yet. I think it is more likely a deep raiding task force. One week into the war, everyone knows that by now stuff is leaving the West Coast. If there was a time to be able to almost predict where some outgoing task forces could be, now is that time. Use extreme caution. If he's raiding, fuel has to be an issue for him. Time is on your side.

On the other hand, if he's going for Hawaii, time is not on your side. At least to be able to reinforce first.

Definitely watching this one.

[Cribtop]

Agreed. It seems nuts to try for Hawaii, but this sighting means there is a small chance he is. Every Cat in Pearl is up tomorrow on the lookout. One thing that argues against Hawaii IMHO is the certain sighting of Hiryu/Soryu in the DEI. If he's coming for Hawaii, he has to bring the kitchen sink. Plus, there aren't that many available divisions unless he diverts a lot from Singapore. Still, certainly something to watch and frankly a defense of Hawaii is not a task I relish in my first Allied game.

[BBfanboy]

Search skills are notoriously poor in the first months of the war. Many times - indeed most often - the sighting of six ships is a pod of dolphins or at most, a single sub. For some reason six is a number that often comes up in the phoney report. The class of ship seems to be randomized a bit.

You can't ignore the report, so continue your searches - but don't throw the entire kitchen sink out that direction just yet, or begin flying all the troops at PH to Hilo.

PS - B-17s and Liberators can be pressed into Nav. Search duty too, but their skills are even worse than the Cat squadrons.

[zuluhour]

perhaps cluster of I-boats heading to the west coast....
 

[ny59giants]

John did invade Hawaii once. It became a very expensive operation as Allies were able to send out BB TFs to hit Hilo and be back at Pearl before lunch. Don't think its where he is going, but he does try to send out bait for his CVs to pounce on if you allow.

CVs - Where are yours now and where are they headed?? You have three plus the hybrids. Those 2 American BCs are very nasty ships. Any idea on where you will use them?? You'll see mine plus the 2 French BCs in mid-42. Them vs your beloved Kongos is a match I want!!