Units overstack crash

[Viktor_Kormel_slith]

Here a new bug that crash the game. There are two russian partisan units near Leningrad in lake hexes, the program starts a digression to destroy the units when the ice melts and I can´t select the units, driving the game to a dead way.

Here a picture of the screen.

[Viktor_Kormel_slith]

And now a saved game, you must end the phase to see the bug in the beginning of the turn after the initiative.
I hope Steve fix it becouse I consider a serious bug.

[Joseignacio]

F*ck, Victor, you should be betatester... [:D]

Partisan bugs, and with partisans in the lake by Leningrad, and letting them drown there (while they are so little help in a possible attack to Leningrad???? OOOOOF[:'(]

[Viktor_Kormel_slith]

José, the truth is that these partisans should not being in the board. There must be another bug with partisans calculus in Russia so we put them in the lake to destroy them when jul/ago will begin and you see surprise! game crashed and we had to stopped playing...[:@]

[paulderynck]

Partisan appearance rules are different in MWiF than WiFFE. It's a consequence of having no cardboard limitations on including counters - like US entry is different.

So if they appeared, then under the rules of MWiF (RAC), they probably should have appeared.

[Centuur]

First, on the partisans itself: The garrison value in the USSR itself is only 8. Most of the German units are in Siberia. This makes it perfectly OK for the partisans to appear on the map in the "European" USSR...

Now, on the bug. I'm really, really impressed... This is one of those very obscure situation which never get tested...

Question: was the lake frozen when you placed those units in there during the last or were you able to set up partisans in that hex when the lake wasn't frozen?

If so, than we have a bug regarding the placement of partisans too. Now, it might be possible that the weather was snow in the previous turn, but that is only 10 % chance.

But this is a fatal bug.

[Viktor_Kormel_slith]

Paul, in partisan form there was 6 garrison so the partisan number was 30 - 6 = 24, the dice was 29 if I understand the rule there should not appear partisan units this turn but I don´t know if there are some modifiers to the roll.

Centuur, it was snow the last impulse of may/jun and it was a very short turn, strange but it happened. I was very lucky becouse my german troops were in a very bad situation in the urals front and the soviets could not advance behind my lines! [;)]

[Centuur]

Are you sure the die roll for partisan creation is 29? There are two die rolls. One to determine whether or not the country has got partisan activity this turn and the second one to see if a partisan is created...

The second one is a 1D10 roll, which get modified by -1 for each partisan unit already in the country and is increased with the garrison number...

So if the roll was a 9, it becomes a 15 with only 6 garrison points in the USSR. You than get the partisan number of the country (30 for the USSR) and substract this result from the partisan number, this makes it again a 15, allowing for 2 partisans to appear in the USSR...

[Viktor_Kormel_slith]

The first die roll was 29 and my garrison value in european URSS was 6. The base partisan number for URSS is 30 so 30 - 6 = 24 % chance. I don´t remember the second and third rolls. Anyway, we will have to reload the game in partisan phase the next session to unblock it then I will test it and if there is a bug I will report it.

[paulderynck]

ORIGINAL: Viktor_Kormel

Paul, in partisan form there was 6 garrison so the partisan number was 30 - 6 = 24, the dice was 29 if I understand the rule there should not appear partisan units this turn but I don´t know if there are some modifiers to the roll.

Centuur, it was snow the last impulse of may/jun and it was a very short turn, strange but it happened. I was very lucky becouse my german troops were in a very bad situation in the urals front and the soviets could not advance behind my lines! [;)]

In the boardgame, there is a 40% chance Russia will be "tested" for partisans every turn there are enemy controlled hexes in Russia. (i.e. in the partisan phase you roll a die and USSR comes up on a 3, 5, 7, or 10. If you did roll that, then with a garrison of only 6, Russia is absolutely guaranteed getting 2 partisans and has a 30% chance of getting a third.

This is the RAW (edited to just what pertains here):

At the start of this step, roll a die and locate the result on the partisan table. This will specify 8 countries eligible for partisan activity in the turn.
Each of those countries named on the chart on a green background is eligible if it is conquered or any of its hexes are enemy controlled.

Roll another die for each eligible country and compare it to that country’s partisan number (in the fist symbol on the map). If an unconquered country was neutral at any time in the calendar year, halve its partisan number.

You put a partisan unit in the country if the result is less than or equal to that country’s (modified) partisan number. If it is at least 11 less, place 2 partisan units in the country. If it is at least 21 less, place 3 partisan units in the country. If the roll exceeds the partisan number, there is no effect.

There are some modifiers to the die roll:
-1 for each partisan unit already in the country; and
+ the total garrison value in the country.
Each unit’s garrison value is:
any division (AsA/MiF/PoliF option 2): 0.5
other HQ-A, ARM, MECH, MTN or SS unit: 2
carrier plane unit (CVPiF/SiF option 56): 0
other land or aircraft unit: 1
A unit has a garrison value only if it is face-up and not in the ZOC of an enemy unit. The unit must also be on the opposite side to the major power that will control the partisan.

So assuming Russia was up for being "tested", then a second die roll of 1, 2, or 3 added to the garrison of 6 would still be 21 less than 30 and there'd be 3 partisans generated. (This is assuming this is not the same calendar year that Russia was attacked, because then the partisan number is 15, and then, with a garrison of 6, there'd be a 90% chance on the second roll of getting only one partisan.)

Now here's what the RAC says under deviations:

There is no die roll to select a row on the partisan table. Instead, each country has a probability of partisans appearing as a value in the data for the country. The probability of partisans appearing in each country is the same as in the table. However, a separate random number is generated for each country and tested against the probability of partisans appearing in that country. The result is that partisans might appear in more than 8 countries.

So here, I'm not entirely sure of the exact workings of the program, (Steve would have to confirm) but it would seem to be saying all countries are tested against the combined probability of the first and second rolls per the RAW. So for a garrison of only 6 (which is quite small for a country with a partisan number of 30), then there's a 40% chance of getting 2 partisans and 30% of those occurrences would actually give 3 partisans. So FREX a random number between 1 and 100 is generated and if it is between 1 and 12, 3 partisans appear; if between 13 and 40, 2 partisans appear, and if greater than 40, no partisans appear. You'd need a garrison of 30 (actually 29.5), and no existing partisan in the country to guarantee getting none. (i.e. 40% x 0% = 0%)

Similarly if it was the first calendar year, the random number would have to lie between 1 and 36 in order for only one partisan to appear. (i.e. 40% x 90% = 36%).

[Viktor_Kormel_slith]

Oh, it´s some complicated but I think you are right and then the program worked correctly. Anyway, we (my opponent and me) agreed to desactivate partisans in URSS while soviets don´t control unless one city of Leningrad, Moscow or Stalingrad. It´s an improvised house rule to compensate the no bad effects or penalization for heavy soviet losses and complete capture by Germanny of the european Russia. By other side, we don´t understand why partisans and garrison only include european russia, we dislike this rule. Thanks for your complete explanation.[:)]

[Joseignacio]

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