In depth analysis of M4 weaknesses

[Belisarius]

Originally posted by Frank W.
who cares ?

with iraq and such enemies it seems to work....

Yep. In GWI, Bradleys accounted for more tank kills than the Abrams'

[Belisarius]

Originally posted by Frank W.
i agree the normal tiger ( though this one was classed as a heavy tank so not directly comparable ) and panther were better
than any M4 variant ( with the later HVSS 76mm gun
variants were better than any Pz. IV ! ).

Even Grants were better than a PzIV with the L/24 gun. :p HVSS shermans are probably better than any PzIV, except for optics.

[Vetkin]

There is nothing wrong with Shermans. Just don't place them in front of the big tanks in an open field and they should be OK hehe

I don't think it's possible at all for example; for 10 Tigers vs. 10 Shermans to engage in an open field with a Sherman surviving. However, a platoon of Tigers can easily be killed by a platoon of Shermans that shoot & scoot... Well, maybe... I dunno... Tigers ARE pretty tough however you think of them.

And oh yeah turret speed doesn't actually matter much in SP:WAW hehehehe

All I saw on CNN in Tikrit, the place of the "final battle" were abandoned but fully functional T-55s, various BMPs of all kinds and some BRDMs... I don't think a Bradley would have a difficult time destroying these antiquated equipment. Where were the Iraqi MBTs??

[Raskolnikov]

Originally posted by WhiteRook
Ok guys lets remember that the M4 helped win the war no matter what faults it had! You can thank your lucky stars for it, other wise you would be goose stepping!

The actual contribution of the M4 to winning the war was pretty slim - yes, it was the main western allied tank, but it didn't possess any super-special qualities.

If any tank won the war it was the T-34; the biggest contribution made by any western vehicles to victory was not in a combat role, but the impact of the 30,000-plus jeeps and trucks shipped to the Soviet Union.

[WhiteRook]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Raskolnikov
The actual contribution of the M4 to winning the war was pretty slim - yes, it was the main western allied tank, but it didn't possess any super-special qualities.

Your right it did not. And to clear the air - your all correct, as an MBT it sucked. But as a medium tank it was as good as any other countries give or take certain factors, we all know them.

The main point for me is that it was an American tank, I'm an American, I would take an American tank over any other any day.

We could debate the pros and cons until the next century, people are passionate about their choice of armor, just look back through the many=many threads that deal with this!

As of me, well I'll stick with the Easy8, just wish that they had developed the Pershing sooner!

[Scharfschütze]

Originally posted by willy
Hey, the M4's biggest advantages IMHO were that it was hella reliable and there were LOTS of them ... a King Tiger is pretty scary on paper, but if the transmission fails on the way to battle (fairly common occurence) it's useless!

The biggest strike IMHO against the M4 is the inexcusable delay in the introduction of the 76mm armament ...

Absolutely. I thought lowly of the M4 until I battled lots of them in a Normandy game against Jess. Sure those were the 76mm variants, but my own 75mm PAK had difficulties penetrating their armour at medium range. Despite a slight height advantage for the ATGs.

And that was in SPWaW. In real life, any german formation would have considered itself fortunate to have tons of Nebelwerfer ammo, hordes of 75mm PAK, legions of SS with Panzerfausts and the occasional KT to crush any advance.

[Goblin]

Of course, in real life you didn't often have five 88mm rounds simply bounce off an M4 either. I have seen this uncountable times in the game. I have seen pictures where German rounds went through BOTH sides of the M4 they hit.



Goblin

[Scharfschütze]

Sure as sure, Goblin. Still, the late-war models aren´t too shabby, they earned their "Ronson" nickname well before the improved models came to the front. Britain was lucky to have a channel between itself and the continent, while the US has a whole ocean to cover up learning curves;)

[Belisarius]

Originally posted by Goblin
Of course, in real life you didn't often have five 88mm rounds simply bounce off an M4 either. I have seen this uncountable times in the game. I have seen pictures where German rounds went through BOTH sides of the M4 they hit.



Goblin

BOTH sides AND the entire engine block as well.

[Goblin]

Yep.

Goblin

[WhiteRook]

Sissys! :p :p