Empire strikes back- NJP vs Wargmr Game over :-)

[pontiouspilot]

Good show so far.

I hate to be orthodox but I would never leave PI this late either. What if he has snuck significant supplies in there? With KB on Caribbean duty he certainly could have. The forts will be 4-5 by now.

I wonder if it isn't time for Dorothy to bug outa Oz? Most Japanese players allow their willpower to overwhelm their stamina.

[Sangeli]

ORIGINAL: pontiouspilot

Good show so far.

I hate to be orthodox but I would never leave PI this late either. What if he has snuck significant supplies in there? With KB on Caribbean duty he certainly could have. The forts will be 4-5 by now.

I wonder if it isn't time for Dorothy to bug outa Oz? Most Japanese players allow their willpower to overwhelm their stamina.

PI is the one place I think it is acceptable to leave till very late. Oil isn't at risk by leaving it there nor is there a way to quickly bypass defenses so a smaller force can take it (i.e. Mersing to Singapore). Not to mention I think there are good halfway measures for the Philippines like establishing air bases near Luzon to prevent supply from being snuck in and attacking the soldiers on the ground. Maybe the forts could reach level 5 but even if you move quickly they reach level 3 anyway. All in all, I don't think I have seen a time so far when bypassing the Phillipines turned out to be a bad idea.

[Lowpe]

+1, PI can definitely be bypassed....I think I got them in Oct/Nov of 42. If they are bottled up in Manila or somewhere. Hard to build forts with no supplies.[:)]

The danger is if you let supply in and the Allies start coordinating recon flights with subs...could be ugly.

[njp72]

Always a valid and good question.

Singapore was a pain because I wanted to use the shipyard but the bigger issue was the additional transit time required to get to Ceylon and India.

I don't sail through the strait until Singapore falls.

Java was not really a problem as the entire island was secured except for that one mountainous hex. I left a couple of inf regts initially to ensure they didn't get up to mischief.

In hindsight I am reasonably happy to adopt the same course of action but having the additional ground units with Sce 2 makes a big difference!

ORIGINAL: Sangeli

In retrospect, how do you feel about your decisions to take Singapore and Java so late? My opinion is that those two areas should be taken ASAP as to free up the IJA for deeper ops. I also believe they can be taken with fewer forces if you move on them early. I realize your decision allowed you to move quickly in OZ and India but it seems that because you had many divisions still stuck in the SRA that your attacks didn't have enough firepower to achieve anything truly decisive as you were spread to thinly. Personally I believe this is going to make early 1943 a lot more painful for you than it otherwise could have been.

[njp72]

Thanks pontious, I'm glad it is interesting

Very hard to reinforce PI due to all the airbases secured around it. I would see him from a long way out and smash him.

You are correct about Oz. I'm shortening my lines now in anticipation of conducting an orderly withdrawal.

ORIGINAL: pontiouspilot

Good show so far.

I hate to be orthodox but I would never leave PI this late either. What if he has snuck significant supplies in there? With KB on Caribbean duty he certainly could have. The forts will be 4-5 by now.

I wonder if it isn't time for Dorothy to bug outa Oz? Most Japanese players allow their willpower to overwhelm their stamina.

[njp72]

well the game is moving rapidly with significant activity right across the map.

On the Indian coast I have commenced hit and run tactics to tie down his forces and attrite his navy and air.

So far it has been working well but the results over the last few days have been dropping off.

[njp72]

And what's this off the coast of NZ????

I suspect Wargmr does not realise this but I have been stalking these CVs over the last few days.

I haven't been ready to engage yet but very soon I will be. Depending which direction he heads, and the Gods of War don't throw any curve balls, the war may end abruptly for some of his ships

Of course I could still lose (I did last time) but this is still only 42.

Jaws music may or may not be appropriate.

[njp72]

Its getting harder by the day as he counter attacks in Oz, central pacific and India but this game is still quite winnable.

I am starting to make good progress in the PIs and China is largely mopping up of pockets.

I am disappointed at the lack of shipping I have managed to sink but Wargmr is very sly.

One thing that has worked well with this strategy is the Allied Army lost points. Ships and aircraft can escape but it is a bit harder for armies

[njp72]

And of course when you are fighting high calibre opponents there are always problem theatres.

Oz is turning into this as sheer weight of Allied Armour is causing me grief. I am slowly conducting a fighting withdrawal from Adelaide which is disappointing but I have no intention of getting trapped.

[obvert]

Once that armor hits the shore your naval supremacy should crush it. Armor doesn't do well against high caliber bombardments in clear hexes, like that one in front of Port Augusta. The replacement rates are poor so if you get a bunch these guys won't come back.

[njp72]

Thanks Obvert

That was my original plan but due to logistic reasons I had to abandon Adelaide which makes it slightly harder to implement.

He is moving quite rapidly at the moment but I managed to crush one of his armoured spearheads near Pt Augusta through sheer weight of numbers.

It doesn't seem to worry him though, more armour on the horizon backed by about 70 B-17es.

ORIGINAL: obvert

Once that armor hits the shore your naval supremacy should crush it. Armor doesn't do well against high caliber bombardments in clear hexes, like that one in front of Port Augusta. The replacement rates are poor so if you get a bunch these guys won't come back.

[Crackaces]

Depending on the agreed victory conditions ... THe PzB vs. AndyMac Scenario #2 AAR shows that the IJ will run out
of supplies with an overly aggressive IJ expansion plan. Southern Oz like you are fighting now is a huge sinkhole
of supplies. You have to transport supplies to a distant location requiring fuel .. this investment does not accumulate
until 1944 when the slow drip drip drip accumulates to the point that it all comes to roost.

I feel India is also such a sinkhole. That is because the interior of India requires the IJ to move many more supplies
into ports that can move out to the interior in waves/pulses. It takes much more supplies than required to support troops
to get these pulses to happen. Plus if units are to take replacements at least 20K is required ..

Interesting turn of events ..

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

Depending on the agreed victory conditions ... THe PzB vs. AndyMac Scenario #2 AAR shows that the IJ will run out
of supplies with an overly aggressive IJ expansion plan. Southern Oz like you are fighting now is a huge sinkhole
of supplies. You have to transport supplies to a distant location requiring fuel .. this investment does not accumulate
until 1944 when the slow drip drip drip accumulates to the point that it all comes to roost.

I feel India is also such a sinkhole. That is because the interior of India requires the IJ to move many more supplies
into ports that can move out to the interior in waves/pulses. It takes much more supplies than required to support troops
to get these pulses to happen. Plus if units are to take replacements at least 20K is required ..

Interesting turn of events ..

Only if the goals are tactical and not economic. PzB vs Andy Mac is one game. There are others where the IJ expanded and didn't run out of supplies. In one game rader invaded the usual and then spent three years fighting in Russia tooth and nail, and still didn't get all of it. He kept the Allies at bay long enough that his economy was still churning in late 45!!! [&o] (AAR - Taming the Bear)

Against GreyJoy he went for India, but as several people figured out, he was making a profit on the industry there and in China to feed his massive airframe production. Again, a game that went the distance and would have gone farther had not the density of units around the HI messed up the air model a bit.

Mr Kane did a pretty good job of staying in and around OZ long enuogh to strat bomb it into oblivion and pick up enough VPs to threaten AV in 43.

There are others, but the point of the expansion has to always take into account the needs of the economy. In this one njp72 fully stated he hadn't intended to go for al of OZ, and that once he crossed the line accidently he decided to give it a try. Now, and I think correctly, he's pulling back to more reasonable distances.

It's not about how far you go but how long you stay, what you bring home, and how much you bag in VPs on the way.

[njp72]

Thanks guys good conversation.

Spot on Obvert that is exactly what I was trying to achieve. However in recent events I was lured into a trap by wargmr which may cost me 2 divisions in Oz.

Still the amount of damage I have inflicted and continue to inflict on Oz ground forces is significant. Last turn 180 Oz vehicles were destroyed with another 200 disabled.

I probably did stay a little bit too long (and will pay the price for that now) but the fuel and supply expenditure is not really material.

What is material is how long I can keep him out of the DEI and protect my oil. Once the oil is gone so is my beautiful war machine.

ORIGINAL: obvert

ORIGINAL: Crackaces

Depending on the agreed victory conditions ... THe PzB vs. AndyMac Scenario #2 AAR shows that the IJ will run out
of supplies with an overly aggressive IJ expansion plan. Southern Oz like you are fighting now is a huge sinkhole
of supplies. You have to transport supplies to a distant location requiring fuel .. this investment does not accumulate
until 1944 when the slow drip drip drip accumulates to the point that it all comes to roost.

I feel India is also such a sinkhole. That is because the interior of India requires the IJ to move many more supplies
into ports that can move out to the interior in waves/pulses. It takes much more supplies than required to support troops
to get these pulses to happen. Plus if units are to take replacements at least 20K is required ..

Interesting turn of events ..

Only if the goals are tactical and not economic. PzB vs Andy Mac is one game. There are others where the IJ expanded and didn't run out of supplies. In one game rader invaded the usual and then spent three years fighting in Russia tooth and nail, and still didn't get all of it. He kept the Allies at bay long enough that his economy was still churning in late 45!!! [&o] (AAR - Taming the Bear)

Against GreyJoy he went for India, but as several people figured out, he was making a profit on the industry there and in China to feed his massive airframe production. Again, a game that went the distance and would have gone farther had not the density of units around the HI messed up the air model a bit.

Mr Kane did a pretty good job of staying in and around OZ long enuogh to strat bomb it into oblivion and pick up enough VPs to threaten AV in 43.

There are others, but the point of the expansion has to always take into account the needs of the economy. In this one njp72 fully stated he hadn't intended to go for al of OZ, and that once he crossed the line accidently he decided to give it a try. Now, and I think correctly, he's pulling back to more reasonable distances.

It's not about how far you go but how long you stay, what you bring home, and how much you bag in VPs on the way.

[pontiouspilot]

oh no....you are drinking the OZ cool-aid! IJA can't afford it if it moves beyond a hobby. You have slammed your opponent with many very nice ambushcades (last game)...you want him north of OZ in Injun country....deja vu.

[njp72]

I know, I got sucked into a decisive engagement when I should have only been skirmishing.

He has part of my army pinned to the coast around Pt Augusta but doesn't have the combat power to finish the job. I can still escape with elements but regardless the cost will be high.

In brighter news all other theatres are reporting reasonable progress and he is stuck on Norfolk island with around 15K of Kiwi troops which offers possibilities.

ORIGINAL: pontiouspilot

oh no....you are drinking the OZ cool-aid! IJA can't afford it if it moves beyond a hobby. You have slammed your opponent with many very nice ambushcades (last game)...you want him north of OZ in Injun country....deja vu.

[njp72]

Quick update- mid September 42

The IJA have escaped the death pocket around Pt Augusta! I believe a combination of factors, including relatively heavy losses amongst his armoured units and the fear of being flanked has halted his pursuit.

Makes sense as Wargmr would have no idea what is possibly moving by sea or rail from Perth to his immediate front or flank- in reality nothing.

We are withdrawing our slightly battered units back to Perth and Alice Springs to regroup.

The main objective now is finish off the 15K of Kiwi troops stuck on Norfolk Island and then concentrate on isolated Allied island garrisons near Fiji.

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: njp72

Quick update- mid September 42

The IJA have escaped the death pocket around Pt Augusta! I believe a combination of factors, including relatively heavy losses amongst his armoured units and the fear of being flanked has halted his pursuit.

Makes sense as Wargmr would have no idea what is possibly moving by sea or rail from Perth to his immediate front or flank- in reality nothing.

We are withdrawing our slightly battered units back to Perth and Alice Springs to regroup.

The main objective now is finish off the 15K of Kiwi troops stuck on Norfolk Island and then concentrate on isolated Allied island garrisons near Fiji.

Can you post an info screen to see what's what? [:)]

[njp72]

Int Screen 18 Sep 42

The sixty-four-thousand-dollar question is, can I still win..... possibly but it is getting harder by the day.

I am going try to target 15K in Army loss points by the start of 43. I have also started a broad air campaign designed to attrite his fighter aircraft. This month he has lost a considerable number of P-40es. My losses are high but very manageable.

Shipping losses for both sides are negligible.

[obvert]

You only real chance seems to be strategic points from OZ. Maybe as he moves his forces to the fronts you can bomb more distant target in the rear. Melbourne of course has a ton, and tends not to be as guarded. Sydney might be tough, but Newcastle and other smaller bases could be hit hard.