Freedom of Speech

[joshuamnave]

fb.asp?m=3872179

[wworld7]

Erik,

I copied this from the other thread as best I could.



Zartacla's questions below



I agree with pretty much all of this, but there are issues not addressed.

Look, let's just get the elephant in the middle of the room out of the way. Steve is not in the best of health. I don't say that to be insensitive, but because so long as Matrix is unable or unwilling to assign additional coders to this project, it's an issue. What I want to know is what happens to MWiF if Steve is unable to continue working on it due to further health declines? Is Matrix prepared to commit additional resources in that unfortunate event or will we be left with MWiF in whatever state it's in at that time? If not, will Matrix release the code so that other hobbyists can try to work through the remaining bugs?

In the last state of the game update, about a year and a half ago, Erik said that someone was coming on to help with networking issues. No mention of that has even been made since then. Did that happen, and if so what was the result? If not, why not?

The switch to a public beta for patches has meant fewer patches with just as many regression bugs and very rare changes from the beta patch to the official patch. Has there been any discussion of going back to a more frequent patch schedule with smaller updates in each patch?

Given the number of bugs still remaining and the frustration among those of us not blessed with the debug tool, has there been any more discussion of releasing the debug tool to the rest of us?

While I once supported letting the beta testers have a private forum for discussion and communication with Steve, we've reached the point where there are less than 20 or so regular posters on this forum. Having a separate forum for some of them now feels exclusionary at best and at worst fosters feelings of distrust between the few remaining beta testers and some of the rest of us. Has there been any discussion of either opening the beta forum to everyone or discontinuing the beta testing, since we're all part of the public beta now anyway?

Is there still a practical, realistic plan to release an AI? If so, are you still planning on charging us for it?

Once lost, trust is a difficult thing to get back. Does Matrix have any ideas or thoughts on how to regain the trust of its customers or are there too few of us to matter at this point?

[Erik Rutins]

Ok, taking these in order:

Look, let's just get the elephant in the middle of the room out of the way. Steve is not in the best of health. I don't say that to be insensitive, but because so long as Matrix is unable or unwilling to assign additional coders to this project, it's an issue. What I want to know is what happens to MWiF if Steve is unable to continue working on it due to further health declines? Is Matrix prepared to commit additional resources in that unfortunate event or will we be left with MWiF in whatever state it's in at that time? If not, will Matrix release the code so that other hobbyists can try to work through the remaining bugs?

Realistically, I'm not sure anyone other than Steve can achieve the mastery of both the game and the code required to be of any assistance. We all certainly hope for Steve's good health and we've been careful to make sure, going back to pre-release, that he is balancing his workload so that it does not affect his health negatively and allows him to continue to work on MWIF for the long-term.

I cannot think of anyone other than Steve that could possibly have gotten it this far and I can't think of anyone else who has a realistic chance of getting it to where it needs to go. He has put an incredible amount of effort in both programming and organization and communication with the community into all this and continues to do so. The testers who have also helped MWIF and stuck with it have been an incredible help. This is a project that I think 99/100 times would have never seen the light of day, if it was even taken on by any other programmer or company.

As far as worst case scenarios, we would do whatever we could to allow MWIF to continue - Steve also has a say in that, but I hope we never have to discuss specifics on that.

In the last state of the game update, about a year and a half ago, Erik said that someone was coming on to help with networking issues. No mention of that has even been made since then. Did that happen, and if so what was the result? If not, why not?

Yes, that help was provided, but the issues relating to NetPlay are really internal to the game rather than networking issues related to our server. The incredible complexity of the game means that getting every last bug out both in NetPlay and solitaire, has been far beyond any other process we've experienced. We are a computer game company and MWIF simply blows everything else we've ever made away in terms of the complexity of getting it debugged and working for all the nearly infinite combinations of playstyle, play choices, optional rules, etc. Both Steve's and our own estimates have consistently been off - even apparently trivial bugs can take much longer than expected to fully resolve.

The switch to a public beta for patches has meant fewer patches with just as many regression bugs and very rare changes from the beta patch to the official patch. Has there been any discussion of going back to a more frequent patch schedule with smaller updates in each patch?

We don't have a rule that says it should now take longer and so we haven't discussed releasing more frequently, we've just been going as fast as we can.

Public betas actually allows us to catch more issues before an update goes official and reaches all customers instead of just a fraction. The upcoming beta updates have just been in development and testing longer than the previous ones both because of the time it takes to test out certain fixes (especially NetPlay) and because we've been waiting to get to a good point and in this case there have been a lot of "this could be the build.. no wait" moments. You can't really predict those, but there have been many, many internal iterations for each public beta posted to the community. In many cases, those internal iterations had game-breaking bugs and I'm quite glad to wait for a release build we have confidence in.

Given the number of bugs still remaining and the frustration among those of us not blessed with the debug tool, has there been any more discussion of releasing the debug tool to the rest of us?

I have not discussed that with Steve, but I'll raise it with him the next time we speak.

While I once supported letting the beta testers have a private forum for discussion and communication with Steve, we've reached the point where there are less than 20 or so regular posters on this forum. Having a separate forum for some of them now feels exclusionary at best and at worst fosters feelings of distrust between the few remaining beta testers and some of the rest of us. Has there been any discussion of either opening the beta forum to everyone or discontinuing the beta testing, since we're all part of the public beta now anyway?

While we could potentially do that, from where I am sitting there is still value in it. As mentioned above, the nature of the game is that the more frequent builds sometimes include major bugs and I'd rather not put the larger pool of customers through that as they did not volunteer for it. We've found over the years that opening up that process more often doesn't work because customer expectations are very different in terms of updates than tester expectations.

Is there still a practical, realistic plan to release an AI? If so, are you still planning on charging us for it?

There is a plan that I believe will work in theory, but it's clearly very difficult to predict the timeline when fixing and improving issues with the existing features is still in progress. Steve very much wants to work on the AI, so as the issues diminish to a point that we all consider reasonable, I'm confident that Steve will want to move forward on that. Because of the uncertain timeline, there has been no decision on future sale or pricing plans. I would expect that decision to be made when we reach that point and with both Steve involved and the community feedback strongly considered.

Once lost, trust is a difficult thing to get back. Does Matrix have any ideas or thoughts on how to regain the trust of its customers or are there too few of us to matter at this point?

The only way I know to regain trust is the hard way - to keep on going, working and earn it back. I recognize that the shape of the release cost us trust with the WIF community. I've posted regarding the release before, but in short I'm sorry and I wish we could have done better by you all. The ongoing work and commmitment on MWIF is our best answer to the community and we consider this a commitment to get this right.

Regards,

- Erik

[bo]

I have just finished reading Flippers very honest concerned post about about the state of MWIF. I feel his question were very legitimate and from the heart with no animosity against Steve, yourself or Matrix.

With that said, Erik you answered all questions to the best of your knowledge without evasion or ambiguity. I feel this is what the posters have been looking for over the last year or so and have not received that which may have led to mistrust as mentioned by Flipper.

They may be looking beyond your answers but that is up to them, I have knowledge of the state of MWIF from the beta testing posts but the general posters do not and it might lead to despair and mistrust for themselves, I feel your answers were correct and forthcoming to Flipper and hope he appreciates the honesty of the answers.

With all that said you should keep the general public informed as best you can and as often as you can over the next year even if you have nothing to say. That is a big change for me to say that as I felt if you are not getting information from the programmer what could you possibly have to say.

I have come to the conclusion that even if you have nothing to say, say it anyway. Good post Erik keep them coming.

Bo

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: bo

I have just finished reading Flippers very honest concerned post about about the state of MWIF. I feel his question were very legitimate and from the heart with no animosity against Steve, yourself or Matrix.

With that said, Erik you answered all questions to the best of your knowledge without evasion or ambiguity. I feel this is what the posters have been looking for over the last year or so and have not received that which may have led to mistrust as mentioned by Flipper.

They may be looking beyond your answers but that is up to them, I have knowledge of the state of MWIF from the beta testing posts but the general posters do not and it might lead to despair and mistrust for themselves, I feel your answers were correct and forthcoming to Flipper and hope he appreciates the honesty of the answers.

With all that said you should keep the general public informed as best you can and as often as you can over the next year even if you have nothing to say. That is a big change for me to say that as I felt if you are not getting information from the programmer what could you possibly have to say.

I have come to the conclusion that even if you have nothing to say, say it anyway. Good post Erik keep them coming.

Bo

warspite1

bo, purely for the sake of good order, these were Zartacla's questions not flipperwasirish's.

[bo]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: bo

I have just finished reading Flippers very honest concerned post about about the state of MWIF. I feel his question were very legitimate and from the heart with no animosity against Steve, yourself or Matrix.

With that said, Erik you answered all questions to the best of your knowledge without evasion or ambiguity. I feel this is what the posters have been looking for over the last year or so and have not received that which may have led to mistrust as mentioned by Flipper.

They may be looking beyond your answers but that is up to them, I have knowledge of the state of MWIF from the beta testing posts but the general posters do not and it might lead to despair and mistrust for themselves, I feel your answers were correct and forthcoming to Flipper and hope he appreciates the honesty of the answers.

With all that said you should keep the general public informed as best you can and as often as you can over the next year even if you have nothing to say. That is a big change for me to say that as I felt if you are not getting information from the programmer what could you possibly have to say.

I have come to the conclusion that even if you have nothing to say, say it anyway. Good post Erik keep them coming.

Bo

warspite1

bo, purely for the sake of good order, these were Zartacla's questions not flipperwasirish's.

Thank you warspite I knew that but I was answering the moderator of Zartacla's questions which was Flipper and Flipper surely must have the same concerns or he would not have brought up those questions on his post. But my main concern was Erik's answers.

Bo

[wworld7]

ORIGINAL: bo

Thank you warspite I knew that but I was answering the moderator of Zartacla's questions which was Flipper and Flipper surely must have the same concerns or he would not have brought up those questions on his post. But my main concern was Erik's answers.

Bo

Hi Bo, all I did was copy Zartacla's questions from the other thread so Erik could expend as little time as possible to answer.
I am moderator of nothing, those days were long ago, and had no connection to Matrix Games.

For the record, I do not share ALL of Zartacla's concerns and disagree with the premise of a few. But I see no need to waste time expanding on my views on his list.

[bo]

ORIGINAL: flipperwasirish

ORIGINAL: bo

Thank you warspite I knew that but I was answering the moderator of Zartacla's questions which was Flipper and Flipper surely must have the same concerns or he would not have brought up those questions on his post. But my main concern was Erik's answers.

Bo

Hi Bo, all I did was copy Zartacla's questions from the other thread so Erik could expend as little time as possible to answer.
I am moderator of nothing, those days were long ago, and had no connection to Matrix Games.

For the record, I do not share ALL of Zartacla's concerns and disagree with the premise of a few. But I see no need to waste time expanding on my views on his list.

flipper my bad, then I misunderstood which is par for the course lately [:(] I was still more concerned about Erik answering which he seems to be doing that very well lately. Understood [;)] Damn warspite was right again [:(] as usual [;)]

Bo

[operating]

Popped a couple of pills, smoked a fat joint, now everything is starting to make sense to me....

[wworld7]

Bo,

Forget it, I just didn't want anyone to think I was a moderator of the MWIF forum. Most users would see that Steve is the only one, but some
would incorrectly assume I was also. Trust me, Matrix's forum moderators do a far better job than I could.

Something to remember when you think a thread should be closed or not? Undoubtedly there are many posts, in many threads, in many forums that
moderators ONLY read if someone asks them to (could be a user, could be the Help Desk (if their is a complaint).

If a complaint is lodged I am sure the Help Desk notifies Erik in some way (due to his position) and he deals with it as best he can.

[bo]

ORIGINAL: flipperwasirish

Bo,

Forget it, I just didn't want anyone to think I was a moderator of the MWIF forum. Most users would see that Steve is the only one, but some
would incorrectly assume I was also. Trust me, Matrix's forum moderators do a far better job than I could.

Something to remember when you think a thread should be closed or not? Undoubtedly there are many posts, in many threads, in many forums that
moderators ONLY read if someone asks them to (could be a user, could be the Help Desk (if their is a complaint).

If a complaint is lodged I am sure the Help Desk notifies Erik in some way (due to his position) and he deals with it as best he can.

Appreciate the info flipper will keep that in mind.

Bo