Chaudron - La Chasse de Sous-marine, 2018 [Updated to Beta 4 10/27/15]

[Kushan04]

This is the first in a series of scenarios I am doing that is roughly based off of "Cauldron" by Larry Bond.

In this scenario US and UK attack submarines conduct a sweep through the Bay of Biscay looking for French ballistic missile submarines.

All of the forces for both sides are completely randomized. Very interested in getting feedback and suggestions on the balancing. I've play tested several times and still have not completed it. Have some ideas for the next beta but want to get some other opinions before I start making changes.

I couldn't get the scenario attachment LUA function to work so the import files need to be manually placed in your ImportExport folder. The pathing should be: Command/ImportExport/Scenarios/Chaudron - La Chasse de Sous-marine, 2018.


*** Change Log ***

Beta 4.1 [10/27/2015]
Fixed air unit assign to mission scripts. Unit not found error should finally be solved.

Beta 4 [10/27/2015]
Fixed air mission unassign to mission scripts. Should no longer receive an error when a detroyed unit is unassigned from a mission.
Updated spawn scripts for AI subs. Should spawn around entire patrol zone and no longer congregate in western portion.
French surface/Air and submarine force sides are no longer friendly. Sides will determine neutral/hostile status before engaging.
Removed 6-8 submarine options for player.
Added 2 or 4 AI controlled submarines. Submarines are not visible to the player.
Moved player start zone from Celtic Sea into the Atlantic ocean. Should be less likely to run into AI sonobouy picket line at scenario start.

Beta 3 [10/11/2015]
Added Biologiocs.
Changed air mission scripts. Will now always have units assigned, random roll will determine number of aircraft assigned and active/inactive.
Moved French fighters to naval base outside of Brest.

Beta 2 [09/19/2015]
Added randomized AI controlled air support missions.
Changed player sub spawn script. More likely to get 6-8 subs then 4.
Changed player sub spawn location.

Beta 1: [07/14/2015]
Initial Release.

[AlexGGGG]

I'm getting "this scenario is based on the database which is not available". Which version of the DB is that based on, what should I look for?

[Kushan04]

ORIGINAL: AlexGGGG

I'm getting "this scenario is based on the database which is not available". Which version of the DB is that based on, what should I look for?

What version of the game are you using? The scenario should be using the official v1.08 release, which I think is B678.18.

[Kushan04]

Its been awhile. Updated the first post the Beta 2. Biggest change is adding some AI controlled air AAW patrol missions. Since you are control a sub task force you don't get to share information with them but they may help cut the French ASW assets, assuming they don't get countered by French escorts.

As always comments and suggestions would be welcome. Good Hunting.

Beta 2 [09/19/2015]
Added randomized AI controlled air support missions.
Changed player sub spawn script. More likely to get 6-8 subs then 4.
Changed player sub spawn location.

[AlexGGGG]

Kinda reminds me of shooting fish in a barrel. I'm not done yet though.

[Kushan04]

Thanks AlxGGGGs. It shouldn't be that easy. I'm on a flight tomorrow night, I'll take a look at some of the scripting then. What sub spawn did you get at the start?

Played through a few times myself last night. Think I'm going to up the chance that the Atlantique ASW missions will trigger. Right now its a 50-50. I'll probably make it more towards 75-25. I may also undo the change I made to the player sub spawn and move it back towards an even chance of 4-6-8 subs. 8 seems too much when the ASW missions don't trigger but when the Atlantiques are dropping enough sonobouys you can walk across the bay then 4 seems to little.

[AlexGGGG]

Consider,

1. maybe add biologicals; the sea seems strangely empty of fish.
2. ballistic missile submarines should not be patrolling at 20 knots; even if there were biological contacts, I can easily sort them by speed and see which ones are subs. I suppose you can make some sort of support mission to set them on so they patrol slowly. This will make detection more difficult.
3. Some of the escort subs should probably be set to fire torpedoes at kinematic range; I'm shooting kinematic and they are badly outranged.


I got 6 my subs, 6 target subs, and ASW aircraft is overhead.
So far I lost two of my (both to ASW aircraft) and killed 11 theirs.

[Kushan04]

ORIGINAL: AlexGGGG

Consider,

1. maybe add biologicals; the sea seems strangely empty of fish.
2. ballistic missile submarines should not be patrolling at 20 knots; even if there were biological contacts, I can easily sort them by speed and see which ones are subs. I suppose you can make some sort of support mission to set them on so they patrol slowly. This will make detection more difficult.
3. Some of the escort subs should probably be set to fire torpedoes at kinematic range; I'm shooting kinematic and they are badly outranged.

1. I can do that.

2. This is my mistake, they shouldn't be. Not sure how I missed that actually.

3. Another overlook of mine. I'll adjust it for beta 3.

Thanks.

[AlexGGGG]

In the end,

I lost three of my six subs,
and killed 14 enemy subs, six of which were SSBNs.

I made a mistake by sending away one of my subs when it ran out of torpedoes. I thought enemy would have one less target, but it turned out I had sent away a good sensor platform.

[Kushan04]

Updated to Beta 3. Changes since Beta 2:

Added Biologics.
Changed air mission scripts. Will now always have units assigned, random roll will determine number of aircraft assigned and active/inactive.
Moved French fighters to naval base outside of Brest.

[AaronWallace]

ORIGINAL: Kushan

ORIGINAL: AlexGGGG

I'm getting "this scenario is based on the database which is not available". Which version of the DB is that based on, what should I look for?

What version of the game are you using? The scenario should be using the official v1.08 release, which I think is B678.18.

I am running 678.18, and I am still getting this error, any next steps?

Thanks, Aaron.

[mikkey]

Aaron, try CMANO v1.09 Release Candidate 11 (Build 746)

[AaronWallace]

ORIGINAL: mikkey

Aaron, try CMANO v1.09 Release Candidate 11 (Build 746)

Fixed, Thanks!

[mikkey]

You're welcome, enjoy it.

[ultradave]

Well, my submarine tactics obviously need work. I did sink Le Triomphent, but along the way lost 5 VIRGINIA class subs. Not good. Not good at all. 3 of them were done in when sonobouys started splashing around them as the were creeping at 5 kts deep looking for French subs. I also got off a 2 torpedo salvo at a Suffren class attack sub but he shot first from longer range and I lost my sub while not sinking the SSN. Game over as all my subs were toast.

Tough one. I'll have to try this again and try some different ideas. I thought I pretty much knew what I was doing but obviously I don't. What do I know though. I used to design them, not ride them

Thanks though. I've read all of Larry Bonds books. It's been a while so I don't remember details.

[Kushan04]

Thanks for the feedback ultradave. Getting the balancing right on this one is tricky because of all the randomness. I've had games like yours where I get 4-6 subs and enough ASW aircraft you could walk across the sonobouys. But I've also had the opposite where I get fighters, the AI doesn't, and my friendly fighters make short work of the Atlanitques.

What I'll probably do is turn off 1/3 rule and set the mission to only have 2-4 aircraft up at a time, with the rest, if any are assigned, as a reserve. Right now there is a minimum aircraft but 1/3 rule is active.

I'm also toying with the idea of making the patrol box bigger, probably stretch it a bit farther into the Atalanic. I'd up the scenario length if I did that but that would thin out the sonobouys a bit more since they would not be so concentrated.

Look forward to hearing how your second attempt goes.

[ultradave]

Hmm. It seemed that I got 7 subs, one E3c, and no other aircraft. The sonobuoys were all French and there was nothing I could do about them. Luck of the draw it seems. I"ll try another and see what happens.

[Kushan04]

Noticed a small over site on my part, make sure to turn on Kinematic firing for torpedoes under the ROE. That should help with them firing from longer ranges assuming you see them first.

ORIGINAL: ultradave
Hmm. It seemed that I got 7 subs, one E3c, and no other aircraft. The sonobuoys were all French and there was nothing I could do about them. Luck of the draw it seems. I"ll try another and see what happens.

Every 3 hours there is a math.random roll to determine the active/inactive status of the allied fighters and french fighters and ASW aircraft. The roll will also re-roll how many aircraft are assigned to their respective missions.

[ultradave]

Not having any better luck second go-round. I started with 4 VIRGINIA class. Right at the start there was what appeared to be a good sized air action between Typhoons and Rafales over the Bay of Biscay. I'm at 18 hrs to go and my subs have all been creeping at 5 knots deep and 2 of them have had sonobuoys dropped right on top of them followed by torpedoes. 2 subs down and the only contacts I've had are sonobuoys so far. Just had one dropped right behind one of my remaining subs. <grrr>

Edit after finishing second run: I must be getting really bad draws. My third sub got sonobuoy torpedoed. The fourth one finished the scenario after evading a string of 3 sonobuoys without being shot at, but also not finding anything. No contacts by any of the subs during the scenario.

I need to try again (maybe a couple more times) to see what pops up.

Don't take this as any criticism. I like the premise. Just need to accomplish something other than funerals for US Navy submariners.

[Kushan04]

What depth are you running your subs at ultradave?