A Japanese Debacle - Sqz (J) vs. fcharton (A)

[BBfanboy]

Thanks for ferreting that out, Skygge. That is a LOT more than my foggy old memory was giving me! [:D]

[SqzMyLemon]

Great information all around. Seeing the NZ emergency package means an invasion of New Zealand is out.

Skygge, thanks for posting that information. You wouldn't happen to have the Australian emergency package handy? It would be nice to get an idea what I'm offering to Francois on a silver platter. [:D]

I've also thought about what the American CV's might do to threaten my LOC. I'd actually welcome attempts to do so. Possibly drawing the Allied CV's out in defence of Australia is one of my goals.

[Skygge]

Sure...


Australia
Activation area: The Australian mainland one hex South of Brisbane and Tasmania. [1]

Reinforcements triggered:

Unit Arrival Location
44th British Division Cape Town
9th Australian Division Aden
2nd British Para Brigade Cape Town
7th South African Armoured Brigade Cape Town
27th Rhodesian Brigade Cape Town
1st AA Brigade Aden
Natal Mounted Rifles Regiment Cape Town
Reinforcement Convoy:

214 AIF Inf Section 42
24 3" Mortar
24 Bren AAMG (x2)
72 25 Pounder Gun
48 M3A1 Armoured Car
48 Vickers Section
48 Bren Section
108 Brit Inf Section
48 2pdr AT Gun
48 40mm Bofors AA Gun
250 Motorized Support
48 AIF Cmbt Eng
48 Matilde II Tank
24 3.7" Mountain Gun
48 Stuart I Light Tank
48 Kittyhawk IA
48 Vengeance I
12 Catalina IIIA
32 Spitfire Vc Trop
48 Mitchell II

[Skygge]

India
Activation area: The Indian mainland, the trigger line is one hex South of Delhi

Reinforcements triggered:

Unit Arrival Location
XXI Indian Corps Aden
31th Armoured Division Aden
5th Indian Division Aden
6th Indian Division Abadan
8th Indian Division Aden
10th Indian Division Aden
Waziristan Division Karachi
XXI Corps Engineer Battalion Aden
Reinforcement Convoy:

216 Ind Inf Section 42
24 3" Mortar
24 Bren AAMG (x2)
72 25 Pounder Gun
30 Valentine Tank
24 Vickers Section
36 Bren Section
36 4.5" Field Gun
216 Brit Inf Section 43
24 40mm Bofors AA Gun
240 Motorized Support
25 5.25" AA Gun
30 Humber IV
72 Frontier Scouts
72 Hurricane IIa Trop
72 Wellington Ic
36 Vengeance I
24 Catalina I
72 Spitfire VIII
30 Merchant Ship (= Supply Injection)

[SqzMyLemon]

I was setting up China last night and ran into an issue with DBB-B. There is a typo in the editor that makes the garrison at Mukden 2000 instead of 200. I guess it's a simple fix by going into the editor, fixing the typo then saving into the scenario folder. Once that is done we may just exchange dummy turns to make sure everything is ok.

Anyway, this is the third time I've set up China as Japan and feel quite comfortable in the theatre. The reduction in aviation support will have a direct impact on the campaign though. Coordination of effort between ground and limited air forces will be a key to success.

I always concentrate on freeing up combat LCU's from garrison duty to frontline service first. My priority for China remains focused on fuel/oil producing bases first, Sian and Lanchow, and then smaller supply production centres. It will be interesting to see how Francois plays China, and for some reason I believe he's going to try and play aggressively here. I do not let Chinese troops remain active in my rear, ever, so it could be interesting if he tries to flood my LOC's with units.

Next up for me will be planning operations against Borneo, the Celebes, Malaysia and the Philippines. Then air production for a change of pace. The biggest task will be the organization of transport capacity to move five divisions worth of troops plus armour, artillery and support units for sustained operations in Australia. The amount of fuel and supply required will be substantial.

[Skygge]

I've also thought about what the American CV's might do to threaten my LOC. I'd actually welcome attempts to do so. Possibly drawing the Allied CV's out in defence of Australia is one of my goals.

Problem with NZ is that initially the allied has better "eyes" in the sky and can keep their carriers on the other side of the "table" of NZ with lots of retreat options.... and having their DBs fly out of landbases. Fires on carriers a long way from home can be painful.

Australia is another matter ... I think

[SqzMyLemon]

Thanks again Skygge!

[Skygge]

Next up for me will be planning operations against Borneo, the Celebes,

I find that setting up an Air HQ on Kendari will get you control of all of the Banda Sea when you have flown in some Betties and Zero and from here you can also shut down Ambon and Balikpapan as useful bases for the allied.
- then you can spring on to Timor and Bali under this air umbrella

With Timor in hand the way is open to N.Australia.
With Bali in hand the way is open to East Java.

Other bases in the area I find can wait until I have the extra time and forces.

[mind_messing]

I like the notion of a "bottom-up approach" to taking Australia.

- The first wave lands at Geraldton, takes Perth
- Land the main invasion force around Melbourne
- Take Tasmania as an unsinkable aircraft carrier and supply/fuel dump for the invasion.
- Take New Caledonia & Lord Howe Island as naval search bases.

With Perth and Tasmania, you really limit the opportunities the Allies have to get stuff in to Austrailia.

There's only the east coast (the great southern route is blocked thanks to Japanese Tasmania), so there's not much chance of the Allies getting troops in undetected...

[Yaab]

ORIGINAL: SqzMyLemon

I was setting up China last night and ran into an issue with DBB-B. There is a typo in the editor that makes the garrison at Mukden 2000 instead of 200. I guess it's a simple fix by going into the editor, fixing the typo then saving into the scenario folder. Once that is done we may just exchange dummy turns to make sure everything is ok.

Anyway, this is the third time I've set up China as Japan and feel quite comfortable in the theatre. The reduction in aviation support will have a direct impact on the campaign though. Coordination of effort between ground and limited air forces will be a key to success.

I always concentrate on freeing up combat LCU's from garrison duty to frontline service first. My priority for China remains focused on fuel/oil producing bases first, Sian and Lanchow, and then smaller supply production centres. It will be interesting to see how Francois plays China, and for some reason I believe he's going to try and play aggressively here. I do not let Chinese troops remain active in my rear, ever, so it could be interesting if he tries to flood my LOC's with units.

Next up for me will be planning operations against Borneo, the Celebes, Malaysia and the Philippines. Then air production for a change of pace. The biggest task will be the organization of transport capacity to move five divisions worth of troops plus armour, artillery and support units for sustained operations in Australia. The amount of fuel and supply required will be substantial.

Lanchow is important for Allied player beacuse its fuel feeds big HI factories in Chengtu and Chungking. Sian is a net drag - it directly competes for fuel with Sichuan's HI. To avoid it, in my games, I always disable Sian HI, so the fuel can migrate to Sichuan.

I would focus on cutting out the heart of the KMT troops first which is Changsha. It is the biggest supply generating centre, closest to the frontlines.It can feed tons of KMT troops sitting outside Changsha.

[Skygge]

- The first wave lands at Geraldton, takes Perth
- Land the main invasion force around Melbourne
- Take Tasmania as an unsinkable aircraft carrier and supply/fuel dump for the invasion.
- Take New Caledonia & Lord Howe Island as naval search bases.

That is indeed a daring and intriguing plan with the potiential of being a masterstoke if succesful.

[mind_messing]

ORIGINAL: Skygge

- The first wave lands at Geraldton, takes Perth
- Land the main invasion force around Melbourne
- Take Tasmania as an unsinkable aircraft carrier and supply/fuel dump for the invasion.
- Take New Caledonia & Lord Howe Island as naval search bases.

That is indeed a daring and intriguing plan with the potiential of being a masterstoke if succesful.

I wouldn't go that far. It's what I'd do if I was going "all out".

It has it's problems:
- Logistics, though you could possibly limit most of the issues with troop transport if you clear the Perth-Port Augusta railroad.
- Commitment. It triggers the emergency reinforcements very early.
- Distance. Southern Australia is very, very far from everything else...

[Skygge]

Hence the :

if succesful.

[:)]

If it fails I will be the first to call it an irresponsible adventure.

[:)][:)]

[Lokasenna]

Forget Melbourne as the primary big target. It should be Sydney. Bigger shipyard (which is super useful to you even if you don't expand it), and with Perth/Sydney taken then Melbourne is pretty much no-sale for the Allies. The same is not true for Sydney if Perth/Melbourne are taken - not even if you have Brisbane. You would also need Tasmania and the islands east of Sydney. It's not just about air bubbles, it's about being able to interdict with your superior surface forces in the early war.

[SqzMyLemon]

It's very interesting to see the different opinions and approaches on what could/should be done. I've noticed a few comments are beginning to expand the list of bases that need to be captured and I see a lot of force dispersal and losing of focus on the primary targets as a result.

I have a plan in mind and will disclose the details once the game begins. Essentially, without Sydney and Melbourne contested and isolated from reinforcement as quickly as possible, the likelihood of success is minimal. Capturing Perth first in no way isolates either Sydney or Melbourne, nor does Tasmania really. Yes, they do contribute to preventing supply and reinforcement of Australia proper, but I don't think they should be considered as primary objectives at this stage. Securing of Lord Howe Island and New Caledonia to protect the flank and perform a search function is needed, but not at the expense of the primary goal. Without Sydney this operation will fail. Without Melbourne this operation will fail. Everything I do must contribute to the quick isolation and capture of these two bases, because if I don't, nothing else matters. If neither of these bases falls Plan B is complete withdrawal. Enough doom and gloom [:D]. First isolate Sydney and Melbourne by air, ground and sea, then everything else should fall into place. If I have additional forces available, I most certainly will address other secondary targets if the opportunity presents itself.

Good stuff. I'm enjoying the discussion and glad people are engaged. I don't mean to discount or disparage anyone's comments. I have a plan, but will certainly factor in what others bring to the table.

[SqzMyLemon]

As I was working on the first turn it occurred to me, maybe I should look at what I'm getting into with a proposed invasion of Australia. I'm not one to usually do this, but I fired up the Allied side and looked at Australia's starting OOB. I was shocked seeing only 2422 AV in total, including New Guinea and Tasmania. This total does not include Malaya or Australian 6th and 7th Divisions which eventually arrive at Aden. I can't put it any other way, Australia seems quite weak with most units only having 30 experience.

If I can surprise Francois with an unorthodox plan and bring enough, fast enough, I just might have a chance. Much will depend on how he reacts, and I get a sense that he's the kind of person that doesn't scare easily. It could develop into quite a fight.

On another note. With the low AV totals and lack of forts at some key positions, I definitely think some secondary objectives are much more attainable than I first thought possible. Some objectives could be added to Phase I after all.

[Yaab]

An interesting thing about Oz. While LI industry has heavy presence in Sydney/Newcastle/Kembla, the Resources needed for its operations are scattered in several outlying bases. If you go for the LI bases, but do not cut them from Resources, then you may fail in your conquest of Oz.

[SqzMyLemon]

ORIGINAL: Yaab

An interesting thing about Oz. While LI industry has heavy presence in Sydney/Newcastle/Kembla, the Resources needed for its operations are scattered in several outlying bases. If you go for the LI bases, but do not cut them from Resources, then you may fail in your conquest of Oz.

That's a good point Yaab. I plan on capturing Kembla and Newcastle immediately prior to investing Sydney. I can't remember the name of the base further inland from Sydney, but I plan to capture that base with paratroops if possible. That will block any rail movement of resources into Sydney. Melbourne will be trickier to isolate.

[SqzMyLemon]

I'm going to have the first turn wrapped up by the weekend and send it off to Francois. We are in no hurry to start, but after awhile I get 1st turn fatigue and just want to be done with it. I'm nearing that point.

We'll be playing a non-historic first turn so Force Z will be an initial concern.

A first for me in this game is tinkering with a few of the warp TF's. I've never liked the initial dispositions of many of the TF's and may add/remove some ship types and redirect a few TF's to positions that better reflect my overall plan. So another first for me will be testing the turn to see the results of my tinkering.

There will be a full Pearl Harbor strike with CV Kaga remaining with KB. I will set all A6M2's to either escort or CAP as none will be set to strafe. I ran a few Pearl Harbor raids previously and the Zero losses to FLAK were insane with 26 being shot down. No thanks. I've never performed a second day of strikes against Pearl Harbor, and definitely will not risk further aircraft and pilot loss to FLAK.

We discussed Manila and I asked for a second port strike to be allowed, but only by LBA. I'm not trying for a double knockout, but I want the flexibility to target a few of the ships and submarines based at Manila. Clark Field will still be targeted as well. I've done this in the past and it's usually only a few ships/subs that get hit. Francois does not have any objections.

There will be no Mersing landing or deep penetrating warp TF invasions on turn one.

[Chickenboy]

ORIGINAL: SqzMyLemon
There will be no Mersing landing or deep penetrating warp TF invasions on turn one.

You big baby. [:'(]