Chaos(SHC) vs Pelton-T131- Game Over-Soviet victory.

[STEF78]

I would do the opposite.

Hammering him in open ground and forcing him to evacuate salliants in the center.

Your aim is to adavnce faster than he can dig in. Once you reach level 1 or 0 forts, it's almost over for him and he will have to give ground.

[chaos45]

Terrain in the center favors defense, and its where almost all his SS units are so they are very hard to shift.

Easier for me to shift my armor to exploit weak points in the south.

I will say his Germans are champion diggers every time he falls back they are in lvl 1 or 2 forts. An usually the line behind the frontline is at least lvl 1.....its why to get a big push it takes everything that huge blob of troops has.

As I have to breach 2 lines of forts to get to any easy attacks that I can shift with hasty assaults or single stack attacks.

[chaos45]

Into August 1943- sees a determined German effort to Hold the Oskol River---and extremely bloody fighting all of July into August. Average losses per week seem to be 50-60k Axis to 100-110k Soviets.

Mass of Soviet units and bloody attritional fighting seem to be taking a toll on the German Army though as ground is also being lost in the center with Vyazma retaken turn 110 if I remember right.

As to Soviet OOB only growing- my OOB has stagnated if not slightly reduced already from the heavy fighting this summer as I predicted. Disbanded half of the red airforce airbases and a ton of fighter regiments + all the level bomber regiments provided much need infantry replacements to keep the heavy attritional combat going.

Manpower pool has been zero each turn for months now aside from when I disband units, armaments pool is growing quickly due to a lack of men to arm lol.

Once we get into september will post some august screens- fighting all along the front with axis forces losing ground, however again its extremely bloody for both sides as I intended.

By far July/August 1943 have been the bloodiest months of the war to date for both sides. As the losses are almost all combat/attritional related and no surrenders.

[chaos45]

Emailed Pelton and Moreaval---- because a bunch of strangeness just happened for T113- almost all of my army HQs were suddenly moved out of command range of their respective armies. No breakthroughs to re-locate them at all they just mysteriously moved far to the rear for some reason.

At first going north to south I was like no big deal and just moved them back as I thought maybe I made a mistake...then when i got to the south and saw all of my tank army HQs now out of range I see a major issue----either a huge game bug or some kind of fishy business going on.

I have screenshots from T112 that show my HQ positions in the south and suddenly at my T113 they are in different positions and no German breakthroughs to account for it.....

[chaos45]

Far north general pressure all along leningrad front.

[chaos45]

Center- more pressure- also notice no HQs in my rear cities- yet on T113 most of my Kallinin front Army HQs had been moved to Torzhok and Kalinin for some reason. Just moved them back and didnt think anything of it until I saw further issues as I went south.

[chaos45]

South- massive pushes here and noticed again almost all my units are close to the frontline- I do have some T113 screens prior to me moving all my units to back up this issue. Notice again my units are all close to the frontline aside from some airbases.

[chaos45]

Close up of a big push and more specific HQ locations.

[chaos45]

Here is a screen from T113--- as you can see suddenly army HQs are all deployed far to the rear- thus costing me trucks in supply and loss of MPs on units. As you can see from T112 I had no units in the city and back by the river. Yet now all my army HQs are suddenly sitting back there....

[chaos45]

T113- same issue here- suddenly all of my tank army HQs supporting this drive are re-located far to the rear and out of command range.....either really strange AI bug or someone manipulating the game via and editor type mode. Moreaval says he has had this complaint only once before about 2 years ago----this to me doesnt support a bug issue, but maybe it is.

You can see in the previous picture no HQs in mistki and now 3 of my tank army HQs are located in Mistki and 1st GTA HQ was reloacted to sverdolsk......all out of command range of their respective Corps.

[chaos45]

This cheat or bug whatever it is suddenly crushed my MP and ability to follow-up on the Germans retreat during T113 as you can easily see my tank corps MPs crashed since out of command- previously 40+ was common as Im doing very well on trucks.

[M60A3TTS]

This sounds similar to a bug that Michael T. reported long ago in his AAR against Pelton. But it's been a while so that thread no longer appears on the forum. You may want to send a PM to him about it. I don't recall that a cause was ever found.

[Bozo_the_Clown]

This ain't no bug. [;)]

[chaos45]

Did the turn will keep an eye out in the future for mysterious re-locations of my HQs.

Not much happened in t113 since most of my mech fomations tanked on MPs from lack of HQ support.

I did get across the river at leningrad finally so the finns downfall should be before the end of 1943.

If it is an AI auto relocate bug it needs to be found and dealt with because in a close game it could cause one side to lose a complete turn of movement in effect.

Only thing from T113- Pelton launched 12 attacks against 6 of my tank corps in the 3 hexes across the river and only succeeded in pushing 2 of them back. The commander was immediately promoted by E-Stalin lol. Many medals were given out [8D]

[loki100]

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

This sounds similar to a bug that Michael T. reported long ago in his AAR against Pelton. But it's been a while so that thread no longer appears on the forum. You may want to send a PM to him about it. I don't recall that a cause was ever found.

aye was that the AAR where his sappers kept on being removed from the corps and relocated to Stavka? If I recall they gave up soon after ... with some illwill between them?

[BrianG]

Oh no.

Not the dreaded displace hq bug.

Really not a fun one.

And thought gone and fixed.

[:(]

[ericv]

I found Michael T vs Peltons game with the search engine. sadly i can't post a link to it as i have not enough posts yet.

If you can't find it :
I found that AAR using searching for 'pelton' : 'less precise match'
searching in 'Topics and Replies,
Search terms found in 'subject or Body'
Time filter 'All Topics'

Name of the Forumpost: "Razing the Reich"


MichaelT's problems:

displacing HQ's : around 15 army HQ
disbanding HQ's : 1 front and 2 front air hq's
Airforce to National Reserve : around 100 Regiments
Sapper units removed from Corps : around 300 removed over several turns


In MichaelT's Tech support post regarding this issue 821Bobo, also playing Pelton, reported the same issue..

just stating the plain for all to see fact that all 3 games were against Pelton, just my two cents.. back to the shadows playing the AI

[M60A3TTS]

Thanks ericv. Let's not start the conspiracy theories just yet.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3254415

[Peltonx]

ORIGINAL: loki100

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

This sounds similar to a bug that Michael T. reported long ago in his AAR against Pelton. But it's been a while so that thread no longer appears on the forum. You may want to send a PM to him about it. I don't recall that a cause was ever found.

aye was that the AAR where his sappers kept on being removed from the corps and relocated to Stavka? If I recall they gave up soon after ... with some illwill between them?

No

I have His email we chit chat from time to time.

I give him the win, bug or no bug he was winning.

Same goes here Chaos has this game won and I have zero issue calling the game for him if this game gets bugged out.

Also a possible bug on German side, which morveal is looking into.

[chaos45]

My understanding is there is a bug with 1939 german squads converting to 1943 german squads and so instead of converting the game was having the German side just build new 1943 squads and thus sucking up alot of armaments.

Dont see how this game breaking- painful for abit yes...but no worse than the 40,000 squads worth of armaments I had sitting wasted in the pools as the Soviets until this patch.

So right now pending them fixing it game is on hold. If Pelton wants to continue once its fixed Im fine with continuing as I see this as a very small issue that really has had no major effect on the game as of yet, and definitely no worse that massive nerfs the bugs hit my side with.

Early in the game- again almost 40,000 soviets squads worth of armaments doing nothing- finally actually fixed this patch
New patch- 1-2 months AP had to be used to change over all the cav corps commanders/re-locate units to new HQs
-Morale bug dropped all of my key assault Corps morale and thus cost me maybe around 15-20% total CV on my army- as all but 3 of my corps were dropped to NM levels.
-massive nerf to almost uselessness of the red airforce this patch
-most recent auto re-locating out of command distance of all of my key attacking armies.

Pelton seems to think this small patch which kept 60,000 men in his manpower pool and dropped his armaments to 0 was game breaking----I disagree compared to what I have had to deal with so far.

His army is still stronger than historical and still holding more ground than historical yet the game is broken because he has 60k men sitting in the manpower pool----IDK seems very small in the grand scheme of this game.