General Goofy Does Barbarossa

[ernieschwitz]

Action points are the "time units" available to each unit. They can be used to move and attack, basically. There are Zone's of control as far as I recall, they hinder units movement, making it cost more to enter zones of control. The 15 is most likely a Action Point additional cost, to enter the hex, the combat causing it.

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: Jagdtiger14

The 15 under the 12th and 32nd INF represents stacking limit points?...if so, then you still have 15 points worth to move into that hex?

Action points: Each army group gets these?...and how is it determined how many and is there any way to increase them? I assume they are used for attacks only? So you can still move around?

I assume there is no ZOC in this game? I think the panzers are better off being used north - north of the Neimen river...perhaps with the view of eventually turning east and around the forest towards Kaunas, and/or punching north into open terrain threatening the Soviets near the Baltic?

I would focus on the Soviet 202 MOT and 125 INF and see how they retreat and how the Soviets try to deal with that threat.

warspite1

The numbers are additional Action Points it costs to enter those hexes. Zone of Control also costs additional points.

Each unit gets Action Points at the start of the turn. Typically I have seen 100 (more for Panzer units). These are expended by movement and fighting.

Yes, I am veering toward heading north - trouble is I get no second chances on movement. If I screw up then.....

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: Speedy

Thanks for this. A really good read and another week or 2 of me reading these will put me in the position of knowing whether to take the plunge and buy this!

warspite1

Thank-you. Its fun so far! I may change my mind when I do something stooopid with my precious panzers [;)]

[Jagdtiger14]

Oh, ok...I think you did mention that about movement...my bad.

I think moving north is the most logical since you can get a bonus (2 adjacent sides), clear terrain, no river, freedom of movement beyond. The alternative is punching your way 1 hex at a time towards K-town, and then having to deal with the river and urban area. On the other hand you could spend points to violate the AGC line (or perhaps have AGC do some work for you in that area (attacking 84 MOT and 5INF)) and not have to worry about it.

I think going north with the panzers is best...gives you more options, more threatening to the enemy.

[warspite1]

June 22 1941
Army Group North

Sorry, what was I saying about doing something Stoopid??

von Leeb moved an Infantry Division over the Nieman - the cost of which, in Zone of Control, expended all AP's....

He then ordered elements of XLI Panzer Corps (6th Panzer and 36th Motorised Divisions) to the same hex and I pressed the wrong button - inadvertently starting battle against the Soviet 125th Rifle and 202nd Tank Divisions....

Fortunately the result went in favour of the Germans but that could have been disaster!

The Soviets retreat and I advance into the vacated hex with the attacking Panzer spearhead units. Note the movement cost is free for attacking units.

[warspite1]

June 22nd 1941
Army Group North

Having buckled under the attack by the vaunted panzers, the Soviet retreat has left Lt.General Sobennikov's 8th Army HQ under threat.

In order to try and exploit this, von Leeb gathers together an adhoc force of three divisions - 1st Panzer from the XLI Panzer Corps, 3rd Motorised from the LVI Panzer Corps and the Corps reserve, the 3rd SS Motorised.

[warspite1]

June 22nd 1941
Army Group North

The attack is a success and the Soviets once more find themselves in retreat. von Leeb orders the 8th Panzer Division north to exploit the breakthrough and the arrival of this unit gives Army Group North a six-division strong armoured force that, next turn, has the choice of moving north or heading southwest toward Kaunas.

I better read up on Logistics! - although will cover this after I have done AGC and AGS.

[ChuckBerger]

ORIGINAL: zakblood

5.2.10. Concentric attacks, Attacking from multiple hex sides provides combat bonuses. The more directions that a defender is forced to deal with the easier they are to overcome. Concentric bonuses are halved when units are from different HQ's are involved.



copied part from the manual[&o]

I've often thought that bonuses for attacking from multiple sides in most wargames are overdone.

Clearly there are advantages at a tactical level, in many cases, from encircling your enemy and attacking from multiple sides - eg, enemy cover is reduced or negated, rear area stuff like artillery can be targeted, etc.

At an operational level, though, much of the advantage of encirclement is about disruption and cutting off supply, not a direct tactical benefit. The actual battle effects of attacking an enemy in a salient or encirclement are much more situational. In many cases, the defender's benefit in terms of having interior lines can counteract some or all of the attacker's benefit in attacking from multiple directions. Indeed, in some cases (eg Bastogne), the defender sitting on a major transport hub is in a far better position, vis-a-vis the attacker which has great difficulty coordinating attacks and moving troops around.

There are a great many instances where encircled troops held out for long periods (Demyansk, Bastogne, Budapest, Breslau, etc.) provided they had a good concentric defence prepared and adequate supplies. In these cases, attackers had no real benefit from surrounding a tough, dug-in opponent, especially in urban terrain. And there are many more cases of defenders holding salients successfully.

Most wargames produce a situation of very straight front lines, but in reality front lines were often heavily indented with salients. There's a reason for that: a salient properly defended and supplied can offer good interior lines, allowing a defender to switch troops around easily as needed, and also providing a potential jumping off point for future offensives.

I think it should be possible to negate or reduce the effect of the multiplier for concentric attacks. For instance, there should be a max 20% multiplier for attacks into urban terrain. Otherwise the game, like many wargames, does not accurately allow or lead to situations like Demyansk, or the double salients that developed around kursk in 1943, etc etc.

[zakblood]

I think it should be possible to negate or reduce the effect of the multiplier for concentric attacks. For instance, there should be a max 20% multiplier for attacks into urban terrain. Otherwise the game, like many wargames, does not accurately allow or lead to situations like Demyansk, or the double salients that developed around kursk in 1943, etc etc.

that's what it about says tbh in the second picture to the right, attack and defend costs in urban / cities etc

[warspite1]

Before proceeding with the first turn I have just noticed there is an extra zoom level, achieved through clicking on the magnifying glass. For 'oldies' like me whose eyesight is not what it once was, I cannot stress how important these zoom levels are.

QUESTION: However, in activating this, I can only see the top unit in a stack. Is there any way to scroll through (e.g. in Matrix World In Flames there is a 'next unit' button for this purpose) so that I can readily see each unit in the hex?

In viewing in this way I see a large number below the NATO symbol. This must be the Power Number (being discussed in the main forum). This is useful at-a-glance info and here is the explanation of it from lancer:

The Power Rating is a consolidated combat value that adjust straight combat power by readiness, experience and morale.

It allows you to compare units on a roughly equivalent basis.

Before initiating combat it's sometimes a good idea to press '1' to show the power ratings and check what you're up against. Press '2' to return to normal.

You can see it displayed in the Unit Info Display (bottom) under the 'Unit Details' tab at the top of the 'Stats' section.

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Before proceeding with the first turn I have just noticed there is an extra zoom level, achieved through clicking on the magnifying glass. For 'oldies' like me whose eyesight is not what it once was, I cannot stress how important these zoom levels are.

QUESTION: However, in activating this, I can only see the top unit in a stack. Is there any way to scroll through (e.g. in Matrix World In Flames there is a 'next unit' button for this purpose) so that I can readily see each unit in the hex?

In viewing in this way I see a large number below the NATO symbol. This must be the Power Number (being discussed in the main forum). This is useful at-a-glance info and here is the explanation of it from lancer:

The Power Rating is a consolidated combat value that adjust straight combat power by readiness, experience and morale.

It allows you to compare units on a roughly equivalent basis.

Before initiating combat it's sometimes a good idea to press '1' to show the power ratings and check what you're up against. Press '2' to return to normal.

You can see it displayed in the Unit Info Display (bottom) under the 'Unit Details' tab at the top of the 'Stats' section.

At the left hand bottom of your screen, you can click on each unit. Probably an easier way, but that's what I do.

Ahhhh..... the < > keys

[warspite1]

Sure. It would have been a nice touch if in so doing, the unit changed on the map too - but hardly a major issue. The Power Number is still readily accessible.

EDIT: Seen your edit but do not see that this does anything?

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Sure. It would have been a nice touch if in so doing, the unit changed on the map too - but hardly a major issue. The Power Number is still readily accessible.

EDIT: Seen your edit but do not see that this does anything?

I never used the keyboard, I just click each unit to look at it or move it

[Templer_12]

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Before proceeding with the first turn I have just noticed there is an extra zoom level, achieved through clicking on the magnifying glass. For 'oldies' like me whose eyesight is not what it once was, I cannot stress how important these zoom levels are.

QUESTION: However, in activating this, I can only see the top unit in a stack. Is there any way to scroll through (e.g. in Matrix World In Flames there is a 'next unit' button for this purpose) so that I can readily see each unit in the hex?

In viewing in this way I see a large number below the NATO symbol. This must be the Power Number (being discussed in the main forum). This is useful at-a-glance info and here is the explanation of it from lancer:

The Power Rating is a consolidated combat value that adjust straight combat power by readiness, experience and morale.

It allows you to compare units on a roughly equivalent basis.

Before initiating combat it's sometimes a good idea to press '1' to show the power ratings and check what you're up against. Press '2' to return to normal.

You can see it displayed in the Unit Info Display (bottom) under the 'Unit Details' tab at the top of the 'Stats' section.

At the left hand bottom of your screen, you can click on each unit. Probably an easier way, but that's what I do.

Ahhhh..... the < > keys

You can also left click direct thru the counter stack on the map.

[Vic]

Or click the buttom right of the zoom in button and left of the supply layer button to have the medium sized counters displayed side by side on the big hexes.

Its my personal favorite display mode.

Edit: See that you already knew that.

best,
Vic

[warspite1]

22nd June 1941
Army Group Centre

Onto Field Marshal Fedor von Bock’s Army Group Centre now. Wow. Where do I begin with this!?

Out comes Osprey’s again as I want to check the divisional units. Looks like one division of the reserve is included in one of the four armies and I do not know where the reserve is. Perhaps this will become clear, but the four armies themselves seem in order.

The obvious goal is to bag as many enemy formations within the Bialystok salient as possible – without being too greedy and risking too many getting away – or worse, getting my units surrounded. What to attack where with whom??

[warspite1]

22nd June 1941
Army Group Centre

von Bock decides to kick-off the action right on the northern boundary with AGN. First into action is the 3rd Panzer Gruppe. The two divisions of General Ruoff's V Corps are ordered to attack the exposed Soviet 56th Rifle Divison. General Weikersthal's 35th Infantry Division occupy the high ground to the south of the Soviet unit in order to add a 10% bonus to the attack.

The Soviets are forced to retreat and the 5th Infantry advance into the vacated hex.

[warspite1]

22nd June 1941
Army Group Centre

To follow this up General Foerster's VI Corps - also consisting of only two divisions (6th and 26th) position two attack - hopefully in conjunction with V Corps (if I have enough Action Points left).

Damn - I misjudged it and cannot make both attacks....

von Bock therefore orders the attack against the 27th Rifle Division only, and this unit is sent into retreat.

[warspite1]

22nd June 1941
Army Group Centre

von Bock now switches attention to the 2nd Panzer Gruppe.

Ideally I want my units to attack with their Corps units. However, where this means losing Action Points I think this is a less than optimal plan.

I am pleased to see the three divisions of General Schroth's XII Corps are all stacked together and two of these are ordered to attack the 6th Rifle Division. The plan will be to create a wedge between the units around Bialystok and Brest-Litovsk - and then create pockets around each.

[warspite1]

22nd June 1941
Army Group Centre

Field Marshal von Kluge's 4th Army are now brought into play in order to widen the breach created by 2nd Panzer Gruppe. The Soviet 6th Cavalry Division are to be targeted.

The 137th and 263rd Infantry Division of General Geyer's IX Corps are assigned this task and send the Soviets heading east in retreat.