Rumble in the Southwest witpqs-A vs Andav-J 2011-11-29 to 2017-02-08

[witpqs]

Home Islands west.

[witpqs]

Home Islands east.

[witpqs]

What do you guys think about the prospect of me sending an expeditionary force along this route with an eye toward instigating early Soviet Activation?

[witpqs]

Here is that IJN destroyer TF...

[jwolf]

Is the plan to knock out enough defenders in Manchuria to make the garrison strength too low? Nasty. Sneaky. I like it. [8D] Disclaimer: I have no idea how easy or hard it would be, but you seem to be well in control of the land campaign in China.

On the Soviet HQ "spilling over" I didn't realize it was just for a TOE upgrade or some similar purely administrative function. I'll concede that's not really a violation of neutrality. If it gave you combat bonuses somehow then that would really be out of line IMHO. Although maybe you'll solve the Soviet "neutrality" problem pretty soon anyway. [;)]

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: jwolf

Is the plan to knock out enough defenders in Manchuria to make the garrison strength too low? Nasty. Sneaky. I like it. [8D] Disclaimer: I have no idea how easy or hard it would be, but you seem to be well in control of the land campaign in China.

On the Soviet HQ "spilling over" I didn't realize it was just for a TOE upgrade or some similar purely administrative function. I'll concede that's not really a violation of neutrality. If it gave you combat bonuses somehow then that would really be out of line IMHO. Although maybe you'll solve the Soviet "neutrality" problem pretty soon anyway. [;)]

Ooh - didn't even think about combat bonuses, but that Command HQ is not prepped for anything on Hokkaido anyway so it should not be much (or any???) help. I only noticed that units updated their TOE without me yet sea lifting in a Command HQ, so I went looking.

Is the plan to knock out enough defenders in Manchuria to make the garrison strength too low?

Yes, that's the idea. We've discussed it a couple or three times in the past in this AAR, and it seemed unrealistic given the amount of time it would take to complete. But recent events/advances have shown how hollow the IJN lines on the mainland have become. Maybe that's not true within the Garrison boundaries, and maybe not in Korea either. But I've begun thinking about it again.

[Drakanel]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

What do you guys think about the prospect of me sending an expeditionary force along this route with an eye toward instigating early Soviet Activation?

I'm always in favor of more invasions. Plus you prommised you'd erase every red dot on the map, so you'll have to do it sooner or later, right? [:D]

The question is, which land assets could you commit to this push? Tientsin is heavy urban terrain, it might last for a while in a siege. Also, where would you use those assets if you do NOT send that invasion force? Or do you plan to just march troops from the Shangai zone? Can you do that and still take Shangai et al?

I am supposing here that the game will go on even if you reach 2-1 VP ratio. You are pretty close to that and the shangai pocket will net you a lot of VPs. So I am assuming you think the game will still go on afterwards or something similar. Because if not, I don't know if you can actually activate the russians in time...

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: Drakanel

ORIGINAL: witpqs

What do you guys think about the prospect of me sending an expeditionary force along this route with an eye toward instigating early Soviet Activation?

I'm always in favor of more invasions. Plus you prommised you'd erase every red dot on the map, so you'll have to do it sooner or later, right? [:D]

The question is, which land assets could you commit to this push? Tientsin is heavy urban terrain, it might last for a while in a siege. Also, where would you use those assets if you do NOT send that invasion force? Or do you plan to just march troops from the Shangai zone? Can you do that and still take Shangai et al?

I am supposing here that the game will go on even if you reach 2-1 VP ratio. You are pretty close to that and the shangai pocket will net you a lot of VPs. So I am assuming you think the game will still go on afterwards or something similar. Because if not, I don't know if you can actually activate the russians in time...

The numbers of IJA troops already destroyed and trapped in the Shanghai pocket make me think he has been defending forward. To do that he would have bought out as much of the AV in Manchukuo as he could. I think the area beyond Peiping is an eggshell waiting to be cracked.
That said, 8000 AV is a fair chunk if he can concentrate much of it (minus garrisons in key cities). Didn't you have a Moppo gambit in the works?

[Mike McCreery]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

What do you guys think about the prospect of me sending an expeditionary force along this route with an eye toward instigating early Soviet Activation?

Why not just do an amphibious assault directly onto the Korean coastline? Maybe I am missing something but your opponent could simply block you in Manchuko with the reserve troops there.

Unless you can slip past him into Korea and cause him to draw down his reserves how will you create the soviet activation?

[witpqs]

1945 March 09

The Empire captured:


The Allies captured:
Timoeka is occupied by the Allies
Allied forces CAPTURE Soochow !!!

There were Imperial amphibious or airborne operations at:


There were Allied amphibious or airborne operations at:
Damar

Imperial Naval Bombardments


Allied Naval Bombardments:
Allied Ships Bombarding enemy troops at Guiuan


Our subs are conducting secret activities. And early warning is always good.

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ASW attack near Nakadori-jima at 101,56

Japanese Ships
DD Nagatsuki

Allied Ships
SS Pickerel, hits 5

SS Pickerel launches 2 torpedoes at DD Nagatsuki
Pickerel diving deep ....
DD Nagatsuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Nagatsuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Nagatsuki attacking submerged sub ....
DD Nagatsuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Nagatsuki fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub


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The DD duo cost us a PT but was rebuffed.

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Night Time Surface Combat, near Ningpo at 92,56, Range 4,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Shimozuki
DD Nagatsuki

Allied Ships
PT-183
PT-184
PT-185
PT-186
PT-187
PT-188, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
PT-189
PT-190
PT-191
PT-196
PT-219
PT-220

Reduced sighting due to 17% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Overcast Conditions and 17% moonlight: 2,000 yards
Range closes to 24,000 yards...
Range closes to 18,000 yards...
Range closes to 12,000 yards...
Range closes to 8,000 yards...
Range closes to 6,000 yards...
Range closes to 4,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 4,000 yards
DD Nagatsuki engages PT-220 at 4,000 yards
DD Shimozuki engages PT-220 at 4,000 yards
PT-196 engages DD Nagatsuki at 4,000 yards
PT-188 sunk by DD Shimozuki at 4,000 yards
PT-187 engages DD Shimozuki at 4,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
DD Nagatsuki engages PT-220 at 2,000 yards
DD Shimozuki engages PT-219 at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 4,000 yards
DD Shimozuki engages PT-220 at 4,000 yards
DD Nagatsuki engages PT-185 at 4,000 yards
DD Shimozuki engages PT-220 at 4,000 yards
DD Shimozuki engages PT-184 at 4,000 yards
Range increases to 6,000 yards
PT-220 engages DD Nagatsuki at 6,000 yards
DD Shimozuki engages PT-186 at 6,000 yards
Range increases to 10,000 yards
DD Nagatsuki engages PT-220 at 10,000 yards
DD Nagatsuki engages PT-189 at 10,000 yards
DD Shimozuki engages PT-186 at 10,000 yards
Task forces break off...


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On the other side of (much shrunken) Empire, it looks like they were heading for Hokkaido instead of eastward as I thought.

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Night Time Surface Combat, near Ominato at 120,56, Range 8,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Ume, Shell hits 2, on fire
DD Sugi, Shell hits 10, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Sakura
DD Hatakaze
DD Tanigiri, Shell hits 1

Allied Ships
DD Samuel Moore, Shell hits 2
DD Smalley
DD Jarvis
DD Gridley
DD Maury, Shell hits 1
DD Beatty II

Reduced sighting due to 17% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Overcast Conditions and 17% moonlight: 5,000 yards
Range closes to 24,000 yards...
Range closes to 18,000 yards...
Range closes to 12,000 yards...
Range closes to 8,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 8,000 yards
DD Maury engages DD Tanigiri at 8,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Maury at 8,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Smalley at 8,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Samuel Moore at 8,000 yards
Range closes to 4,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Beatty II at 4,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Gridley at 4,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Gridley at 4,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Samuel Moore at 4,000 yards
Range increases to 5,000 yards
DD Beatty II engages DD Tanigiri at 5,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Jarvis at 5,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Gridley at 5,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Jarvis at 5,000 yards
Range closes to 4,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Maury at 4,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Maury at 4,000 yards
DD Gridley engages DD Sakura at 4,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Jarvis at 4,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Smalley at 4,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Samuel Moore at 4,000 yards
Range increases to 6,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Beatty II at 6,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Maury at 6,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Gridley at 6,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Smalley at 6,000 yards
Range increases to 10,000 yards
DD Beatty II engages DD Sugi at 10,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Maury at 10,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Gridley at 10,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Jarvis at 10,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Smalley at 10,000 yards
Range closes to 9,000 yards
DD Beatty II engages DD Tanigiri at 9,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Maury at 9,000 yards
DD Maury engages DD Sugi at 9,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Samuel Moore at 9,000 yards
Range increases to 11,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Tanigiri at 11,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Maury at 11,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Gridley at 11,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Jarvis at 11,000 yards
DD Smalley engages DD Ume at 11,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Samuel Moore at 11,000 yards
Range closes to 9,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Beatty II at 9,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Beatty II at 9,000 yards
DD Smalley engages DD Sakura at 9,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Smalley at 9,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Smalley at 9,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Samuel Moore at 9,000 yards
Range increases to 10,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Beatty II at 10,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Jarvis at 10,000 yards
DD Gridley engages DD Sakura at 10,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Jarvis at 10,000 yards
DD Maury engages DD Ume at 10,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Sugi at 10,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Samuel Moore at 8,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Beatty II at 8,000 yards
DD Gridley engages DD Sakura at 8,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Gridley at 8,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Maury at 8,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Samuel Moore at 8,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Maury at 8,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Gridley at 8,000 yards
DD Jarvis engages DD Sugi at 8,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Smalley at 8,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Sugi at 8,000 yards
Range increases to 9,000 yards
DD Maury engages DD Tanigiri at 9,000 yards
DD Maury engages DD Hatakaze at 9,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Gridley at 9,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Gridley at 9,000 yards
DD Smalley engages DD Tanigiri at 9,000 yards
Range increases to 10,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Maury at 10,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Maury at 10,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Gridley at 10,000 yards
DD Maury engages DD Sugi at 10,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Smalley at 10,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Samuel Moore at 10,000 yards
Range increases to 15,000 yards
DD Tanigiri engages DD Maury at 15,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Maury at 15,000 yards
DD Sugi engages DD Gridley at 15,000 yards
DD Gridley engages DD Sugi at 15,000 yards
DD Smalley engages DD Ume at 15,000 yards
Task forces break off...


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Day Time Surface Combat, near Sendai at 118,58, Range 12,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Ume, Shell hits 6, on fire, heavy damage
DD Sakura, Shell hits 4, on fire
DD Hatakaze, Shell hits 2, on fire

Allied Ships
DD Samuel Moore, Shell hits 2
DD Smalley
DD Jarvis
DD Gridley
DD Maury, Shell hits 1
DD Beatty II

Maximum visibility in Overcast Conditions: 20,000 yards
Range closes to 24,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese radar detects Allied task force at 24,000 yards
Range closes to 18,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 18,000 yards
Range closes to 12,000 yards...
DD Sakura engages DD Beatty II at 12,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Beatty II at 12,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Gridley at 12,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Smalley at 12,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Samuel Moore at 12,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Hatakaze at 8,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Gridley at 8,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Jarvis at 8,000 yards
DD Smalley engages DD Hatakaze at 8,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Samuel Moore at 8,000 yards
Range closes to 6,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Samuel Moore at 6,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Maury at 6,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Gridley at 6,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Jarvis at 6,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Smalley at 6,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Ume at 6,000 yards
Range increases to 8,000 yards
DD Beatty II engages DD Ume at 8,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Maury at 8,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Samuel Moore at 8,000 yards
DD Jarvis engages DD Sakura at 8,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Smalley at 8,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Hatakaze at 8,000 yards
Range increases to 9,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Maury at 9,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Gridley at 9,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Jarvis at 9,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Smalley at 9,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Hatakaze at 9,000 yards
Range increases to 12,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Samuel Moore at 12,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Sakura at 12,000 yards
DD Jarvis engages DD Sakura at 12,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Smalley at 12,000 yards
Japanese TF attempts to disengage
DD Hatakaze engages DD Gridley at 12,000 yards
DD Maury engages DD Sakura at 12,000 yards
DD Gridley engages DD Sakura at 12,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Jarvis at 12,000 yards
DD Smalley engages DD Ume at 12,000 yards
Range closes to 11,000 yards
DD Beatty II engages DD Hatakaze at 11,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Jarvis at 11,000 yards
DD Gridley engages DD Ume at 11,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Jarvis at 11,000 yards
DD Smalley engages DD Hatakaze at 11,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Samuel Moore at 11,000 yards
Range closes to 9,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Hatakaze at 9,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Maury at 9,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Gridley at 9,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Jarvis at 9,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Smalley at 9,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Ume at 9,000 yards
Range increases to 10,000 yards
DD Beatty II engages DD Hatakaze at 10,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Gridley at 10,000 yards
DD Ume engages DD Smalley at 10,000 yards
DD Sakura engages DD Samuel Moore at 10,000 yards
Range increases to 13,000 yards
DD Hatakaze engages DD Gridley at 13,000 yards
DD Maury engages DD Sakura at 13,000 yards
DD Maury engages DD Ume at 13,000 yards
DD Jarvis engages DD Hatakaze at 13,000 yards
DD Smalley engages DD Ume at 13,000 yards
DD Samuel Moore engages DD Ume at 13,000 yards
Range increases to 14,000 yards
DD Gridley engages DD Hatakaze at 14,000 yards
DD Gridley engages DD Sakura at 14,000 yards
DD Smalley engages DD Sakura at 14,000 yards
Task forces break off...


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The PT on PT combat at Hirosaki/Aomori were inconclusive. More air raids on our ASW DDs: they are getting to be a pretty good rope-a-dope!

China.

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Ground combat at 74,41 (near Chengtu)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 12215 troops, 20 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 509

Defending force 2090 troops, 8 guns, 4 vehicles, Assault Value = 12

Allied adjusted assault: 283

Japanese adjusted defense: 5

Allied assault odds: 56 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), disruption(-), fatigue(-)
supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
69 casualties reported
Squads: 8 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
20th Chinese Corps
70th Chinese/C Corps
23rd Group Army
X' Force
6th War Area
29th Group Army

Defending units:
RGC Capital Brigade


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Ground combat at Soochow (92,54)

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 24702 troops, 404 guns, 261 vehicles, Assault Value = 748

Defending force 5826 troops, 52 guns, 39 vehicles, Assault Value = 117

Allied adjusted assault: 483

Japanese adjusted defense: 42

Allied assault odds: 11 to 1 (fort level 1)

Allied forces CAPTURE Soochow !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: disruption(-), preparation(-)
Attacker: shock(+), disruption(-), fatigue(-)

Japanese ground losses:
2252 casualties reported
Squads: 84 destroyed, 3 disabled
Non Combat: 158 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 9 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 38 (38 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Vehicles lost 41 (41 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units retreated 3
Units destroyed 1

Allied ground losses:
106 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 14 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Defeated Japanese Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
32nd Infantry Division
96th Infantry Division

Defending units:
24th RGC Temp. Division
Shanghai SNLF
17th/C Division
11th Army


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Slow, slow, slow in the Philippines.

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Ground combat at Guiuan (82,85)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 1267 troops, 17 guns, 11 vehicles, Assault Value = 44

Defending force 1142 troops, 8 guns, 1 vehicles, Assault Value = 18

Allied adjusted assault: 8

Japanese adjusted defense: 7

Allied assault odds: 1 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(-), preparation(-), morale(-)
experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker: leaders(-), fatigue(-)

Japanese ground losses:
24 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Allied ground losses:
14 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
NG Vol Rifles Battalion

Defending units:
2nd Indpt SNLF Coy
79th JAAF AF Bn


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We got some hits on all strategic industry targets today. Same orders tomorrow.

Air losses.

[witpqs]

China west.

[witpqs]

China east.

[witpqs]

Philippines.

[witpqs]

Home Islands west.

[witpqs]

Home Islands east. That Imperial convoy relying on Soviet neutrality is 2x PC and 7x ships total and heading west. We are dispatching a CL TF to intercept.

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: Wargmr

ORIGINAL: witpqs

What do you guys think about the prospect of me sending an expeditionary force along this route with an eye toward instigating early Soviet Activation?

Why not just do an amphibious assault directly onto the Korean coastline? Maybe I am missing something but your opponent could simply block you in Manchuko with the reserve troops there.

Unless you can slip past him into Korea and cause him to draw down his reserves how will you create the soviet activation?

Preparation time, landing difficulties, fleet support, and so on. Besides, going straight into Korea might not pull the garrison and release the Soviets.

I should add a direct answer to your 'how' question: by destroying Imperial troops in open terrain.

[Mike McCreery]

It really depends upon the amount of troops in the bases on the east coast of China like Tinian, Suchow, Haichow, Tsingtao, etc. If one is relatively light and bombers are within range they can make a real mess of troops to be followed on with paratroops.

It is already mid march so you got a little more than 120 days before activation. Just getting to Tientsin will take 2 weeks to 30 days. Once there you face a dilemma about how to take either Peiping or Tientsin in heavy urban terrain or not have a supply line. From there it is more than 2 weeks to the border of Korea just marching. So you are at 2-3 months already.

If you managed to take Tsingtao or the base to the east of there you might be able to make a staging area for an assault on Chinnampo or the base to the southwest.

Again, I have not been following the AAR closely and have no idea about force distributions. A direct assault on the beaches of Korea or a supported assault from one of the bases on the west coast of the yellow sea would likely be faster but obviously face more risk. It also depends upon how many carrier assets you have and whether you can divert some for protection of surface fleets.

If you do take something on the coast of Korea he still has to try to take it back, possibly resulting in the results you want.

[crsutton]

ORIGINAL: Wargmr

ORIGINAL: witpqs

What do you guys think about the prospect of me sending an expeditionary force along this route with an eye toward instigating early Soviet Activation?

Why not just do an amphibious assault directly onto the Korean coastline? Maybe I am missing something but your opponent could simply block you in Manchuko with the reserve troops there.

Unless you can slip past him into Korea and cause him to draw down his reserves how will you create the soviet activation?

Well, it is a good route. I took Korea with the Allies in 1945 and it really did not matter if the Soviet activate or not. If you hold those bases in Korea then there is little Japan can do to resist Allied bombers. I think if you can do it, the game will probably be over about the time the Soviets would activate anyways. or sooner.

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: Wargmr

It really depends upon the amount of troops in the bases on the east coast of China like Tinian, Suchow, Haichow, Tsingtao, etc. If one is relatively light and bombers are within range they can make a real mess of troops to be followed on with paratroops.

It is already mid march so you got a little more than 120 days before activation. Just getting to Tientsin will take 2 weeks to 30 days. Once there you face a dilemma about how to take either Peiping or Tientsin in heavy urban terrain or not have a supply line. From there it is more than 2 weeks to the border of Korea just marching. So you are at 2-3 months already.

If you managed to take Tsingtao or the base to the east of there you might be able to make a staging area for an assault on Chinnampo or the base to the southwest.

Again, I have not been following the AAR closely and have no idea about force distributions. A direct assault on the beaches of Korea or a supported assault from one of the bases on the west coast of the yellow sea would likely be faster but obviously face more risk. It also depends upon how many carrier assets you have and whether you can divert some for protection of surface fleets.

If you do take something on the coast of Korea he still has to try to take it back, possibly resulting in the results you want.

I think most (all?) of the carriers will be busy covering the additional invasions of the Home Islands. I don't know the required Japanese garrison of Tientsin so I'm not sure what might be there, but I think it might be modest. Yeah, land travel time is a looming obstacle now. Damned laws of physics.

OK. Maybe "stick with plan A" and use the Allied forces in China to reinforce one or more of the Home Island invasions.

[Mike McCreery]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

ORIGINAL: Wargmr

It really depends upon the amount of troops in the bases on the east coast of China like Tinian, Suchow, Haichow, Tsingtao, etc. If one is relatively light and bombers are within range they can make a real mess of troops to be followed on with paratroops.

It is already mid march so you got a little more than 120 days before activation. Just getting to Tientsin will take 2 weeks to 30 days. Once there you face a dilemma about how to take either Peiping or Tientsin in heavy urban terrain or not have a supply line. From there it is more than 2 weeks to the border of Korea just marching. So you are at 2-3 months already.

If you managed to take Tsingtao or the base to the east of there you might be able to make a staging area for an assault on Chinnampo or the base to the southwest.

Again, I have not been following the AAR closely and have no idea about force distributions. A direct assault on the beaches of Korea or a supported assault from one of the bases on the west coast of the yellow sea would likely be faster but obviously face more risk. It also depends upon how many carrier assets you have and whether you can divert some for protection of surface fleets.

If you do take something on the coast of Korea he still has to try to take it back, possibly resulting in the results you want.

I think most (all?) of the carriers will be busy covering the additional invasions of the Home Islands. I don't know the required Japanese garrison of Tientsin so I'm not sure what might be there, but I think it might be modest. Yeah, land travel time is a looming obstacle now. Damned laws of physics.

OK. Maybe "stick with plan A" and use the Allied forces in China to reinforce one or more of the Home Island invasions.

The fastest way to win the game still seems to be getting bombers into position and then sacking the home islands rather than invasion. Maybe I will try that sometime :]