Units data on the UI

[Templer_12]

On the fence. Still collecting information.

Where do if see the AFV data on the UI?
An image about a Tiger data UI sheet, maybe?

[rico21]

If you think that during the Second World War the Strategy was dominated by the Americans, the Operative Art mastered by the Russians and the greatest tacticians were German then this game is for you.
Ps: You do not need armor data if you know you're not attacking a tiger with a T-70 and an elite squad running out to a squad of rookies that have a mg42, are dead men.
It is good to doubt the interest of the game, you will be pleasantly surprised![:)]

[Templer_12]

ORIGINAL: rico21

If you think that during the Second World War the Strategy was dominated by the Americans, the Operative Art mastered by the Russians and the greatest tacticians were German then this game is for you.

Interesting statement.


Tiger vs. T-70
There must be an advantage for the tiger? At least it should be so!

[rico21]

Tiger vs. T-70'UP844
Tiger dead! [:D]

2nd Interesting statement:
France and Germany have one thing in common, they know that we must not invade Russia.[:-][:D]

[Templer_12]

I still don't know if Tigers on the Hunt is a game for me.
The community isn't.

I come here, ask, ask for help and information and all I get is a joker who does not stop talking BS!
That pushes me off.

[idjester]

ORIGINAL: Templer

I still don't know if Tigers on the Hunt is a game for me.
The community isn't.

I come here, ask, ask for help and information and all I get is a joker who does not stop talking BS!
That pushes me off.

Templer... I would recommend you watch some of my videos.. I have tutorials, I have let's plays, and I have how to do's.

That way you can see first hand what you will get with Tigers on the Hunt. What you won't see is AFV data on the UI...

The game is ment to be played fast and loose, not bogged down with the fine data. If you are looking for charts, and data, and information then this might not be the game for you.

But before you leave, at least check out some TOTH videos and see what you think as you can see live what its like.

Hope this helps.

PS... there are tons of players here to help you, if you don't get any answer please feel free to PM with any questions you have and I would be happy to answer them.

[Gerry4321]

Templer, check out the ASL mod. There is ASL-like firepower, armor factors, etc. on those counters. Ask questions always if you have any.

[Templer_12]

Idjester, Gerry, thank you.

I have never heard about ASL before.
Tactical games are not among my favorite games.

Idjester
I spent the last days with watching your videos and I like what I see. I especially like fighting in Stalingrad and on German soil, in Berlin.

To my input question: So in Tiges on the Hunt there are no units data sheets on the UI?
Well, I can live with that. [;)]

Still important for me would be whether the combat strength of the tanks at least roughly modulated.
So again: in the encounter Tiger vs. T-70, the T-70 should be in trouble.
If not, that would mean that the various tank counter are just cosmetics. [:(]

[Paullus]

Templer the T-70 will be in big problem. Peter has worked hard on modelling different tanks strengths. He is working on a probability chart to implement into the game were you can have shown the effect firing on different tanks. It will be done as his next Update project.

[Paullus]

As for Stalingrad and Berlin both Peter and I have a big interest in these battlefields and do have tons of information. This might very well end up in a or several special DLCs. Right now I'm working on where to go next after the Kursk DLC. Death of the Leaping Horseman perhaps? No decisions made yet.

[UP844]

Tanks are very accurately modelled, even though their characteristics are not listed in detail in the tables.

As far as I have been able to ascertain after countless hours of playing ToTH, the following has been modelled, even though it is not mentioned anywhere:

> different gun types (even if both a StuG IIIB and a JgPz IV have their Main Armament listed as 75mm, the former is a 75/24 infantry support gun and the latter is a 75/70, much more accurate and deadlier)

> different armor rating: there is a lot of difference between a PzIV D and a PzIV H

> vehicle size: this is not indicated anywhere in the manuals, but I carried out some fire tests and some vehicles (e.g. StuGs) are harder to hit than others (e.g. Panthers, Shermans or Tiger IIs)

> mechanical reliability: some vehicles risk immobilisation when they start their engine, and early Panthers sometimes self-ignite (too many when I play Germans, too few when I play the Allies).

I am collecting all this information in a kind of "Vehicle Guide", but it is still in a very rough format.

A single T-70 will have a very hard time fighting a Tiger. The only way I think it can kill it is through a rear shot at very close range, but just surviving to fire that shot will be an epic feat by itself. On the other hand, very few tanks can deal with a Tiger on a one-on-one: Sherman Fireflies, Achilles & M36 TDs, Pershings, IS-2s and SU-100s).

@Peter: wouldn't it be possible to differentiate the string reporting MA type in the unit window, so that the player has a better idea of the weapon he is using? Not everyone out there is an old ASL grognard or a WW2 tank expert: the gun of a T-34 m40 and that of a Sherman Firefly, are both listed as "MA: 76mm", but are very different items [;)].

[Gerry4321]

Great post UP844. I would really like to see these gun details too.

[Rosseau]

Probably repeating myself - at my age it's typical. But Tigers is probably the only game I have that does not tell me hit percentages, etc. etc. For this reason - the tension and uncertainty - I like it. But for others could be an issue, but it is being addressed on some level.

[Missouri_Rebel]

Templer, none of my business but rico, while having some fun, does make good points in that the various units do matter along with the situations at the time.

Toth is not polished and bleeding edge as far as UI's are concerned but it is certainly functional. The gameplay itself is excellent though and all of the great scenarios shipped with the game and those made by some great community members makes this game a great value. Many of those fine scenarios are in fact made and submitted by rico. TotH's distinct phases offer a ton of strategy throughout the turn and to ASL players such as myself, it offers the closest thing to that system that Ive found. It is a tactical game in the end though so if those aren't your type of game then your mileage may vary.

[dox44]

jumping in its none of my business either but an excellent post MR.

[jhdeerslayer]

ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel

Templer, none of my business but rico, while having some fun, does make good points in that the various units do matter along with the situations at the time.

Toth is not polished and bleeding edge as far as UI's are concerned but it is certainly functional. The gameplay itself is excellent though and all of the great scenarios shipped with the game and those made by some great community members makes this game a great value. Many of those fine scenarios are in fact made and submitted by rico. TotH's distinct phases offer a ton of strategy throughout the turn and to ASL players such as myself, it offers the closest thing to that system that Ive found. It is a tactical game in the end though so if those aren't your type of game then your mileage may vary.

+1

[UP844]

If you are interested, here is a very rough draft of the expanded AFV list for ToTH. Suggestions and advice are welcome.

[Big Ivan]

ORIGINAL: UP844

If you are interested, here is a very rough draft of the expanded AFV list for ToTH. Suggestions and advice are welcome.

UP844,

That's a very useful tool and thanks for sharing. I particularly like the date reference for each AFV.
Currently the game engine doesn't seem to take that into account when designing but that's probably
an easy fix for Peter going forward.

Thanks again![:)]

[Peter Fisla]

ORIGINAL: UP844

Tanks are very accurately modelled, even though their characteristics are not listed in detail in the tables.

As far as I have been able to ascertain after countless hours of playing ToTH, the following has been modelled, even though it is not mentioned anywhere:

> different gun types (even if both a StuG IIIB and a JgPz IV have their Main Armament listed as 75mm, the former is a 75/24 infantry support gun and the latter is a 75/70, much more accurate and deadlier)

> different armor rating: there is a lot of difference between a PzIV D and a PzIV H

> vehicle size: this is not indicated anywhere in the manuals, but I carried out some fire tests and some vehicles (e.g. StuGs) are harder to hit than others (e.g. Panthers, Shermans or Tiger IIs)

> mechanical reliability: some vehicles risk immobilisation when they start their engine, and early Panthers sometimes self-ignite (too many when I play Germans, too few when I play the Allies).

I am collecting all this information in a kind of "Vehicle Guide", but it is still in a very rough format.

A single T-70 will have a very hard time fighting a Tiger. The only way I think it can kill it is through a rear shot at very close range, but just surviving to fire that shot will be an epic feat by itself. On the other hand, very few tanks can deal with a Tiger on a one-on-one: Sherman Fireflies, Achilles & M36 TDs, Pershings, IS-2s and SU-100s).

@Peter: wouldn't it be possible to differentiate the string reporting MA type in the unit window, so that the player has a better idea of the weapon he is using? Not everyone out there is an old ASL grognard or a WW2 tank expert: the gun of a T-34 m40 and that of a Sherman Firefly, are both listed as "MA: 76mm", but are very different items [;)].

In Addition:

1) is the AFV open topped or not (example US M10 Tank Destroyer) - Mortars can take out open topped vehicles

2) If AFV has a turret or not, does the turret rotate fast/slow/one man turret (early T-34)

3) Special Ammunition (randomly assigned)

4) Does an AFV have a radio

5) Stall, example Panther and JagdPanther can sometimes stall (meaning an AFV can loose a number of movement points before it can even move)

[UP844]

The data is still incomplete: by way of example, I discovered that SU-100s also have limited HE the hard way (i.e. attempting to preventing a PSK-armed squad from killing me ). I suppose all TD-class AFVs have limited HE ammo (it's not their role), even though an M18 Hellcat surprised me by firing HE six times (maybe I was extremely lucky with ammo depletion die rolls)

I'm thinking about adding two extra columns "turret type" and "radio-equipped".

A couple clarification for those who never heard about ASL (these will be added to the document in the next draft):

- Movement Points in red indicate the AFV is subject to Mechanical Reliability check any time it starts its engine;

- Gun name format in the tables is <calibre+barrel length suffix>. The latter may be "*", "none", "L", "LL", with the following meaning:

"*" = short-barrelled (less than 25 calibres long), low-velocity guns. MTR, INF and most ART fall into this category. Usually not very good at piercing armor, unless they have HEAT (hollow charge) rounds available. Typical example: German 75* mounted on early PzIVs and StuGs.

"none" = medium-barrelled (25 to 40 calibres long),medium velocity guns. Some ART and some tank guns. General purpose guns, adequate for AT fire until 1942-43: Typical example: American 75 mounted on Shermans.

"L" = long-barrelled (40 to 54 calibres long), high velocity guns. Most AT, AA and AFV guns. Generally effective against any target (in the appropriate time frame - a German 37L can deal with BT-5s but will be useless against IS-2s, even though it will score many hits). Typical example: Russian 85L mounted on T-34/85, SU-85.

"LL" = very long-barrelled (55+ calibres long), very high velocity guns. A few AT and AFV guns. Usually deadly against any target save for some extra-heavy tanks. Typical example: British 76LL mounted on Sherman Firefly.

Some other general rules:

The accuracy and penetrating power of small-calibre guns decreases faster at long ranges;
Higher muzzle velocity also implies better accuracy at long range: a 75LL is much more accurate than a 75 (don't engage in long range duels with Panthers if you all you have are 75mm-armed Shermans)