Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side

[Lowpe]

Where are your fight bombers? They should be providing deep defense to important bases like Shanghai now, I think. Your goal should be no free lunch to Allied deep strategic strikes.

Even float fighters work decently at disrupting the attacks.

[John 3rd]

OK. The Japanese are developing a semi-fiendish plan to work on the defeat of another Allied Field Army.

I've been doing a bit of misleading with my Noble Opponent regarding southern Burma and the Japanese disaster there. Will detail after I run this turn. Have decided that this 'disaster' is an opportunity. The Japanese are going to totally FLEE into northern Thailand. Of course...this is because of the amazing and powerful Allied forces. RIGHT? NOT! Have a germ of an idea and will get to it after I watch our May 10th turn.

Tune back in in about an hour.

[John 3rd]

May 10, 1944

Holy CATS. The Allies work to take command of the air over Manila.

The Japanese put over 150 Fighters into the sky...

[John 3rd]

...and the exchange is nearly 1-1 over Manila. Course the Allies SWEEP with a total of 14-16 Fighter Squadrons followed by over 150 B-24 and B-29 Bombers.

The attack is nearly flawless as the ALL the damned fighters sweep PRIOR to the bombers coming in. If anyone could EVER teach me that trick I would really like to learn. My stupid bombers tend to die in droves and THEN the fighters appear!

Anyone know my pain here?!!

[John 3rd]

Here are the specific losses for the day (including Burma):

[John 3rd]

May 10, 1944
Burma-Thai Gambit

The decision process is based on WHERE can we hit the Allies causing damage but still be able to do this while minimizing risk?

I cannot fight the Allies anywhere at sea due to there bringing overwhelming bombardment power to the table. Dan just sets his sights on--say Okinawa--brings the maximum available troops, bombs and bombards it to all Hell and then takes the base. While it might take a bit of time, the decision is certain.

This thinking rules out fighting on land here. We'll reinforce the bases, strengthen them, and delay the enemy as much as possible. Can only delay and not win. Very simple.

OK.

What do we do?

Burma is in full retreat. I have been bellyaching to Dan over the last two turns about my troops not moving out by rail from Rangoon PRIOR to his army arriving. While somewhat true--I had two Brigades sit at the tracks for TWO days prior to his troops arriving and stopping rail movement--this has been a smokescreen to make things LOOK far worse then they are.

Am going to fight and fall back on Moulmein while evacuating anything possible. In particular we want Base Forces and Engineers moved out as well as a few Inf units so they can rebuild in Bangkok.

While falling back I shall lament on the terrible Gods of Fate and how this really blows up the situation but the theatre is really secondary now so it doesn't really matter. Terrible. I will play act and attempt to lure him into a false sense of security.

The reality is that I plan to lure him into the jungle south and east of Moulmein while all the while preparing a counter-stroke. Five days ago I gave orders for the 2 full strength ID in Soerbaja to shift prep to Moulmein. Same goes for two ID in Tokyo. A fifth ID got the orders in Shanghai. It is about to be bought out for deployment. Add in 4 TK Reg, a full TK Division and one has the making of a serious bellyache for the Allies.

The goal will be the destruction of all Allied forces south/east of Moulmein.

Obviously this will take time. Need Prep to get to at least 50% before pulling the trigger. Also need to move the units to Singers. He'll have lots of airpower and that is why I want to land at Moulmein where I can move into the jungle ASAP. Notes have been made regarding the use of 4EB and bases that I intend to discuss with my next opponent. Their power is simply frightening. We'll have to get away from the base quickly.

The Japanese will do their best to keep Rangoon, Pegu, and Moulmein's AF damaged so Forts won't grow quickly.

I know that this doesn't blunt the main Allied attack but I don't truly see much choice for options presently. Need a victory that gains Victory Points and forces his troops pools to be drawn upon. This appears to be a good option...

Expect a bunch of naysayers so have at it, provide thoughts, suggestions, and IDEAS!


The landing will be covered by every heavy ships and as many CVs as possible. Already have the 3 CV and 4 CVL down there and they should be enough to protect the invasion TFs. LBA will also be used to provide cover.

EDIT: This Operation requires an anvil for the Allies to hit. Three full strength Brigades will be delivered to Bangkok in about 2-3 days. Thy will move north and work to slow/retard the Allied advance.

[JohnDillworth]

As to the fighter sweeps coming in before the bombers. I have not figured it out. It seems to be a complete crap shoot. It was just as likely his bombers would have come in first. It might be just my imagination, but the only thing I have seen work, and this might be a complete coincidence, is if all the fighters are under the same HQ and that self same HQ is in range of all the fighters AND fatigue is super low on he sweeping groups. The theory is that every one is rested and on the same page. If you use the same groups and plan the next day it usually is much less coordinated. Again, this is just an informal observation so experimentation before implementation

[Panther Bait]

Regarding the sweeps/bomber timing, it probably helped that they were all coming from 1 or 2 bases (assuming they all came from Naga or Legaspi).

Regarding the trap in Burma, won't prepping 10+ major ground units to Moulmein trigger a ton of SigInt hits for the Allies? Can you really catch him by surprise there? Plus he'll have Rangoon/Pegu airfields and air search up by then, I would think. Sounds like a gamble, not a risk.

Could you drop them at the Port Hex SW of Tavoy (assuming it's still yours or Tavoy if he doesn't go there first) instead and march up the grey road? Less effective trap maybe unless he was deep in the jungle, but more likely to get the troops in place intact? Plus if it's still yours, there's no need to prep them all for the same base, diffusing the SigInt potential.

Mike

[Lowpe]

I will be watching carefully...gotta love a Japan that conducts offensive operations in 44.

Go gettem tiger!

Forgot to mention I think it is a mistake, but what do I know -- I invaded Hollywood.[:D]

[Chickenboy]

Like you say-Burma is a backwater fen. Committing 5 IDs plus a bunch of armor there on the periphery of your empire makes zero sense to me. I'd rather put those 5 IDs and tanks and artillery and supply and...on Luzon or the Philippines to push Dan back there.

Even *IF* you are successful in landing these troops in a suprise manuever, now you've got to worry about an element of them being caught in a pincer move should his southern forces reverse their course to reconnect with freshly committed northern Allied forces.

Trudging through the thick jungle makes his now defensive value very formidable as well. Assault parity will not avail you, you've got to bring several multiples to the party-an uncertain proposition at the extreme edge of the fight.

You being bogged down and immobile in Burma / N. Thailand while he moves closer and closer to the home islands plays into his hand too. A static front there with large numbers of freshly committed Japanese troops would be a boon.

A recommitted Burmese 'adventure' is a dangerous misallocation of scarce IDs and-especially-tanks. Ignore the 'bread and circuses' calls. This is a bad idea.

Hope I've served my intended 'hater' role adequately. [;)][:'(][:D]

[JohnDillworth]

Forgot to mention I think it is a mistake, but what do I know -- I invaded Hollywood.

That really should have worked out better. Who builds forts on the West Coast like that? honestly

[adarbrauner]

As Chickenboy has put, you either try this risk-gamble, or you committ resources to the prolongued struggle around Philippines.

The choice on you.

I trust your intuition and judgement.

[Grfin Zeppelin]

Have you ever posted a picture from you here ? I need proof that you are not a Klingon asap.

[John 3rd]

Qapla’

There is definitely a Klingon warrior's heart in this house...

[John 3rd]

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

Like you say-Burma is a backwater fen. Committing 5 IDs plus a bunch of armor there on the periphery of your empire makes zero sense to me. I'd rather put those 5 IDs and tanks and artillery and supply and...on Luzon or the Philippines to push Dan back there.

Even *IF* you are successful in landing these troops in a suprise manuever, now you've got to worry about an element of them being caught in a pincer move should his southern forces reverse their course to reconnect with freshly committed northern Allied forces.

Trudging through the thick jungle makes his now defensive value very formidable as well. Assault parity will not avail you, you've got to bring several multiples to the party-an uncertain proposition at the extreme edge of the fight.

You being bogged down and immobile in Burma / N. Thailand while he moves closer and closer to the home islands plays into his hand too. A static front there with large numbers of freshly committed Japanese troops would be a boon.

A recommitted Burmese 'adventure' is a dangerous misallocation of scarce IDs and-especially-tanks. Ignore the 'bread and circuses' calls. This is a bad idea.

Hope I've served my intended 'hater' role adequately. [;)][:'(][:D]

OK. 'Hater' has made good comments that I have rolled around in my head for several weeks.

A commitment of all this force into Luzon would accomplish what--exactly? He has 55+ units at Legaspi and Naga. If I advance down the road from Lucena, I am open to nightly bombardments and lots of air assaults. Those are open hexes as well. What shape would those troops be in once they reached a base that certainly has high Forts and near infinite supply? Seems like a snowball's chance in Hell to me...

Is there an angle that I am not seeing here? Serious question.

PS Chickieboy: PLEASE keep up your commentary. It is ALWAYS welcome.

[John 3rd]

If you look at this force commitment to other locations, like Formosa, there is no guarantee that he will land there. Then those troops simply sit there and whither. Seems like a 'no go' to me.

Want the opportunity to find a location that offers a chance of victory. Yep--in 1944. Think of everything that was said with the Sumatra Campaign and then the more recent Celebes Campaign. Can't do it. Won't work. CRAZY! It did work and those were significant ground victories.

The three options I see are as follows:
1. Burma--Thailand
2. Luzon
3. The earlier ideas Posted on taking the base of his salient at Gove--Merauke--Bobo and vicinity.

I'll take comments on any and all of these ideas.

[Lowpe]

Stuffing Bataan, Manila, Clark and some of the other great terrain bases in northern Luzon will slow down the Allies and threaten his rear areas making him spend time and assets in taking them.

You are buying time. Time to build better fighters. Time to build better forts around the HI. Time to keep producing supplies. Time for more troops to arrive to defend the HI.

You are fighting defensively in x2 or x3 terrain. Plus bleeding the Allied planes.

If you abandon Luzon, and let it fall quickly then the next move is Formosa, the Chinese Coast, or worse. Luzon is one of the best places for Japan to slug it out with the Allies.

[John 3rd]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Stuffing Bataan, Manila, Clark and some of the other great terrain bases in northern Luzon will slow down the Allies and threaten his rear areas making him spend time and assets in taking them.

You are buying time. Time to build better fighters. Time to build better forts around the HI. Time to keep producing supplies. Time for more troops to arrive to defend the HI.

You are fighting defensively in x2 or x3 terrain. Plus bleeding the Allied planes.

If you abandon Luzon, and let it fall quickly then the next move is Formosa, the Chinese Coast, or worse. Luzon is one of the best places for Japan to slug it out with the Allies.

Good thoughts.

As a side note, I am worried about him moving to take bases on the Chinese Coast. I am presently moving Engineer Regiments, Brigades, and several Divisions to possible landing sites all along the coastline. Forts are at least 3 presently at all these sites. I want AV to be around 500 at each location.

[Lowpe]

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

If you look at this force commitment to other locations, like Formosa, there is no guarantee that he will land there. Then those troops simply sit there and whither. Seems like a 'no go' to me.

Want the opportunity to find a location that offers a chance of victory. Yep--in 1944. Think of everything that was said with the Sumatra Campaign and then the more recent Celebes Campaign. Can't do it. Won't work. CRAZY! It did work and those were significant ground victories.

The three options I see are as follows:
1. Burma--Thailand
2. Luzon
3. The earlier ideas Posted on taking the base of his salient at Gove--Merauke--Bobo and vicinity.

I'll take comments on any and all of these ideas.

Well, #1 Burma-Thailand is meaningless if the Allies land at Haiphong for example (which happened to me).[:(] Or Pakhoi. Samah and Formosa should be bastions with tons of supply and huge airbases ready to bleed the Allies.

#2 I mentioned in my previous post. Although, if you haven't prepared to fight for Luzon for quite a while, it is probably too late as you lack the forts and supply and aviation support and AA and mines and shore guns.

#3. If you can attack his supply line and bleed it...go for it.

[ny59giants]

OK, Jeb Stuart, get OFF your damn horse!! [:-][:-]

No adventure in Burma. It would be like your landing in India in your epic game vs Dan back in old WITP days when I rescued your economy. Useless, but it had you doing something.

ANY operations or placement of these troops has to protect your economy and/or the Home Islands. Explain to the General Staff (me and others) how an adventure in the southern DEI would serve that purpose?? Placing or using them where you could be subject to intense bombardment from his Navy will not help unless behind massive forts (5 or larger).