I'm Really Enjoying the New A/C Damage Option

[DWReese]

I'm really enjoying the new A/C damage option.

While I don't know enough as to the parameters as to its creation as of yet, it is really interesting to see it work. I have had numerous fighters be hit in a dog fight and head for home. On occasion, a fire is burning, and efforts are being made to extinguish it. On other occasions, one of the two engines are damaged or even destroyed and the plane has to fly much slower to make it back. When it lands you are advised how long the repairs will take, so that is very realistic, as well.

Overall, this is a really nice option.

Doug

[Rory Noonan]

Yes, I agree. It really adds a huge layer of depth. Thanks again devs!

[Gunner98]

Fantastic feature - Playing through 'Armed Diplomacy', great scenario BTW and first encountered it when trying to shoot down a Chinese SH-5 Harbin. It was off screen as I had just been jumped by a bunch of Migs, heard the bang, thought OK that one is gone - NOT! It took 2 AMRAAMs, 2 Sidewinders and a couple gun shots to take that flying whale down, could almost see the crew fighting for their lives - great job.

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[Phoenix100]

How do you enable aircraft damage in older scenarios? Or is that not possible - does this have to be set up by the scenario designer? I get the box at scenario start, but the crossed out aircraft damage switch isn't clickable.

[Dan109]

you would have to enable it while in ScenarioEdit mode

[Phoenix100]

Got it. Thanks.

[GBS]

I have never tried to edit a scenario before but will try. This is a feature I would want in any scenario I play. Wish some kind sole would put together a "New features for dummies" that gives all the whats and hows.

[Phoenix100]

Beware, maybe. I just tried to edit 'English Jets over Uganda' to allow the new A/C damage feature. In the process, you get warned that if you're switching this on for older scenarios you need to do a 'deep rebuild' of the scenario first. So I did that, selected the prompt for the ini file and, when prompted after the DB rebuild, directed the dialogue to the provided config file for this scenario. Got the message all ok, switched on damage and started playing. Found that the DB images were now messed up in som cases. I assume something about the update to latest DB process messed up the images. Recopied all my images over, but this didn't affect the issue. The issue is for the rebuilt scenario only. ie the images are not messed up (wrong images for certain planes, for example) when I open a different scenario and look in the DB. So, the rebuild process required to switch on damage, for much older scenarios, might have unintended consequences. That's my guess, anyway.

UPDATE: Having loked further at this, I think it's just a fault affecting some older scenarios, inherent to them, somehow. I too think the A/c damage model is really great. Much more immersive.

[Primarchx]

ORIGINAL: Gunner98

Fantastic feature - Playing through 'Armed Diplomacy', great scenario BTW and first encountered it when trying to shoot down a Chinese SH-5 Harbin. It was off screen as I had just been jumped by a bunch of Migs, heard the bang, thought OK that one is gone - NOT! It took 2 AMRAAMs, 2 Sidewinders and a couple gun shots to take that flying whale down, could almost see the crew fighting for their lives - great job.

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Playing the same scen, Gunner. I had to make gun runs on the Harbin as well. The whole shooting match was started by some PLAAF jumping an EP-3 Aries (sound familiar?) in the Taiwan Strait. The Ares was able to dive to the deck after 'evading' two other AAMs and limp home on two engines. Very cool!

[Gunner98]

The whole shooting match was started by some PLAAF jumping an EP-3 Aries (sound familiar?) in the Taiwan Strait.

Very similar - sent a pair of Hornets to 'test the water' and they got jumped - To quote Viper (Tom Skerritt): 'There were bogeys like fireflies all over the sky' [:D]

Got out by diving, one Hornet was damaged and got home about 30% damage and one engine. Together they took down 6. Rushed in 6 Tomcats, 2 from the south 4 from the north - by then is was a mess all over the place. Great scenario .

[JPFisher55]

I too enjoy this feature. It seems that a missile takes out modern fighters most of the time, but in different ways. It's also fun to watch an damaged plane attempt to make it back to base. Most damage seems to take about a day to repair. It is a really neat feature. Thanks devs.

[Primarchx]

ORIGINAL: Gunner98

The whole shooting match was started by some PLAAF jumping an EP-3 Aries (sound familiar?) in the Taiwan Strait.

Very similar - sent a pair of Hornets to 'test the water' and they got jumped - To quote Viper (Tom Skerritt): 'There were bogeys like fireflies all over the sky' [:D]

Got out by diving, one Hornet was damaged and got home about 30% damage and one engine. Together they took down 6. Rushed in 6 Tomcats, 2 from the south 4 from the north - by then is was a mess all over the place. Great scenario .

Agreed! Even with modern fighters and a very permissive ROE it can be tricky mixing it up with the 'ancient and venerable Chinese air force'. I was finding MiG-21/J-7s doing hard turns at close range that befuddled the seeker heads on incoming AIM-7Ps. I had to make sure my a/c were descending to get close-range follow up shots with AIM-9s as groups merged then extend on afterburner before re-engaging. Then you have aircraft damage, so you need to take that into consideration. I was letting PLAAF fighters that were limping home alone because I was dealing with more immediate threats. It really rang true to what I know of modern air combat.

[HalfLifeExpert]

Having just finished 'Armed Diplomacy', I agree, the A/C damage system is great! I had one tough Badger that took a lot of punishment (1 Phoenix, 1 Sparrow, 1 Sidewinder and a Vulcan burst) and dodged a number of missiles before finally being killed by a second Sidewinder. This was also great for my score, as you are penalized pretty harshly for losing one aircraft, but on top of the seven that I lost, I also had three that were "mission killed", requiring more time fore repairs than was left in the scenario.

Should this mean that the "Maintenance" feature of Air Ops should me modified so that those planes can be made ready, given enough time, especially with the possibilities of very long scenarios?

[mavfin]

I find it interesting that the first two Sidewinder hits I saw, while they were only 1.23 DPs, the first one hit the cockpit, and the second one didn't kill anyone, but it got both engines, so the crew abandoned the aircraft.

So, while I haven't had a survivor yet, I'm finding it for immersion purposes to get the 'damage reports'.

[mavfin]

While we're talking features...is the detailed gunfire stuff (that we've had forever) only for land/ship guns, or are a/c guns part of this as well?

[Dimitris]

For aircraft too. There's a few accuracy modifiers there.

[Primarchx]

I discovered that AMRAAMs, Sidewinders and Sparrows are not likely to down a bomber with a single hit, Phoenix is much more reliable in that regard. However damage usually sends an a/c back to base so you get a mission kill in most cases.

BTW - How is the RTB decision made? Is it correlated to sustained damage, skill level, etc?

ETA - Found it.

Aircraft are also assigned “damage tolerance” levels before they abort/RTB. For fighter and attack aircraft this is set to 30%, for CAS aircraft 50%, and for all other aircraft to 10%. Once this threshold is exceeded, the aircraft breaks off and attempts to RTB. The player can of course issue an RTB order before this level is exceeded. Damaged aircraft will jettison their heavy stores when RTBing due to damage (regardless of the “Jettison stores under attack” doctrine setting).

[Excroat3]

While playing the "Nightmare" scenario in the CoW campaign one of my F-22s took an AA-2 hit. I could tell by the damage report (gun and radars destroyed, 1 engine damaged) that the missile hit the front port side of the aircraft, destroying the radars and gun, then the fragments were ingested through the engine, damaging it. The aircraft was safely able to make it back to base. Really impressed by this new feature!

[FoxZz]

I was wondering if double engine planes can survive better than single enigne planes in the game, or if engine crits are treated broadly ?

[Gunner98]

Double engine AC are much more survivable. It seems that engine hits are pretty common which makes sense considering the size of them in relation to a standard AC. Have had a couple now fly home on one engine with the other completely packed in, speed drops, and probably a bunch of other things like maneuverability because lame ducks die quickly as well if they are in a fur ball.

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