Russia... Is Realism to Far?

NeoWhiteWolf · Post by **NeoWhiteWolf** » Tue May 15, 2001 9:53 am

In my Opinion from playing the WW2 Capaign as the germans...ive noticed once 1941 comes around i started playing against the Russians insted of the Brits in Africa....So i fell that they would overwell me at every turn....well its now 7/42 and i have only lost like a 100 men and a few tanks....but some of my ppl have upwards of 50 kills a pop...my army consists of 75mm Long Barrels and 20mm Long Barrels...and my artillery choice is the Rocket Vehicles...The last battle i did was me on one side of a river with no bridge and i was defending....he sent his 4 Barge trucks first to get them ready for his milliuons of soldiers and boom...my 88's took the 4 trucks out so his man were left to face my elite snipers and cross the water....is it me or do the russians need help?

Pack Rat · Post by **Pack Rat** » Tue May 15, 2001 10:35 am

There are certain time periods where one side may have a clear advantage over another side. German crew and troop exp is very good in the beginning of the war and there isn't much that can stand up against their tanks, this will change however. It maybe that your units will be so high in their ratings by the time this happens that it gives you a one sided effect. You might try starting later in the war or playing with the preference buttons.

I've not played too much yet with 5.01. However the games I have played the AI has handed me my head on a stick, I'm not used to this at all

I've been playing June 44 as the Germans and what I'm seeing in 5.01 is a different animal altogether. There are some changes I think I'm seeing, but not sure about, just need to play more and sort it out. So from me I would say the Soviets are just fine, send me the help.

Those that have played me with pbem know I love my Tigers and those Soviets cut through them like a hot knife through butter. In 44 (for those that are still wating for 5.01) there isn't a big shortage of Tiger E's, not a lot of Kings but some, Panthers are plentiful, but the Soviets have the tank power to deal with them all it seems, even to my surprise the Kings. Could be a couple of reasons for this, but like I said I'm still sorting. Version 5.01 is a wonderful surprise to me, even after expecting wonderful things from Matrix.

lnp4668 · Post by **lnp4668** » Tue May 15, 2001 3:59 pm

Richard, you may wants to try user design campaigns. They tend to be better than the randomly generated one. I am having a tough time in the Stallingrad campaign in 1942.

Paul Vebber · Post by **Paul Vebber** » Tue May 15, 2001 4:58 pm

We ahve significantly upped the "unsupressed" hit chances units have - though the Soviets still have problems - its more crucial than ever to get teh initial licks in and casue suppression to as many enemy units as you can. Using MG's to button tanks degrade their hit chances significantly now. Germans peashooters at long range are important to cause suppression! If left with "tactical control" to shoot at the time and consitions of their choosing rather than rush return fire even the Early war Soviets can hand the Germans a bloody nose.

Tigers and KT can know engae from 25 or even 30 hexes if teh vis supports it and have good hit chances with suppression 0. and take atvantage of hilltops in cover (especially rough) where beyond 20 hexes r so if in cover you can blast away 2 or 3 times a turn and not be seen.

[ May 15, 2001: Message edited by: Paul Vebber ]

Pack Rat · Post by **Pack Rat** » Tue May 15, 2001 8:37 pm

Originally posted by Paul Vebber:
Tigers and KT can know engae from 25 or even 30 hexes if teh vis supports it and have good hit chances with suppression 0. and take atvantage of hilltops in cover (especially rough) where beyond 20 hexes r so if in cover you can blast away 2 or 3 times a turn and not be seen.

]

These are some "I think I'm seeing" but not 100% sure yet. I had the heights for my Kings. Side shots seemed more effective on them? When a King was destroyed the King in the same unit near by surpression went up, hard to tell about this one yet? My Tiger E's got higher surpression from artillery fire? I think that one is as should be if so, I always thought it was a bit low before. Seemed like a bit more APCR rounds for the Soviets? Might just be the time period on that one. Special Op fire doesn't mean you'll get a main gun round to fire. Pretty sure about that one. AI choices for the Soviets gave them good top of the line tanks? Seemed like the Soviet tanks even moving at speed spotted my infantry very easily. I don't think they had infantry on board as they were T-70's, maybe the 70's are reconn? In 4.5 I very rarly had an 88 breakdown, I've got them now, but will hold any judgement on this for a while. I very rarly had more than one or two working 88's out of say 8 but they were due to enemy fire not break downs this seems to still be the case and as it should be, in my opinion. Panthers in 4.5 would always break down when run full out, not so now. The maps generated for May/44 are usually wooded, not the best for Tigers to do their worst.

In no way am I complaining. I like the general feel of 5.01 very much. It's just that a lot is happening, more so than 4.5 in many ways and I still need to play more.

murx · Post by **murx** » Tue May 15, 2001 9:00 pm

Agreed, the recon ability for the AI is sometimes very good - esp. compared to having a recon scout car 2 consecutive turns unsupressed in a hex with an AI 81mm and not spotting that unit ... but one could still tell it was there ...
murx

panda124c · Post by **panda124c** » Tue May 15, 2001 11:00 pm

It sounds like the AI still does not know how to use smoke. You never approach a river crossing without smoking the launching and landing area plus each side.

victorhauser · Post by **victorhauser** » Tue May 15, 2001 11:16 pm

Also, as I noted in another thread, Soviet units (of all types) seem to go berserk very very very very very frequently in v5.01.

This can cause serious problems to Axis players who think they have suppressed and/or damaged them enough to advance, only to discover them ready and suppression Zero (even when they were routing just a moment ago).

NeoWhiteWolf · Post by **NeoWhiteWolf** » Wed May 16, 2001 1:12 am

Ive seen the russians use smoke on the rivers it just my AT Squads are at this time elite so no barge could get across...and im going to try the stalingrad ....im happy to get my ass kicked....i just hate losing heroes......

Paul Vebber · Post by **Paul Vebber** » Wed May 16, 2001 1:12 am

Soviets in defend scenarios will respond to fire with unpinning a lot, that is intentional to simulate the tenacity with which they defended places like Stalingrad. "Berserk" occurs in melee fairly rarley and means the unit gets a "bonus" morale check if it fails the first one and would normally cower (and usually surrender).

The suppression for a "nearby kill" is back, as is somewhat higher suppression form artillery. Soviet APCR might be a litle more plentiful but is still typically a handful of rounds and often is reduced to 0 with reduced ammo on. Side shots hit that thinner armor - its now sloped appropriately in ver 5.01 so in 5.0 they were a bit extra vulnerable...

Special Opfire will often result in the MG firing if you have the coax MG turned on, turn off teh coax MG and you will get more Main gun special opfire. The AI doesn't know this so its a way to moderate some of the cries of "too much" special opfire from the AI. MG fire will now button you more easily and buttoned status is a big reduction in hit chance.

Recon tanks do spot infantry pretty well, but non-recon tanks are pretty poor particularly to the sides and rear and if buttoned.

Despite popular belief, the AI doesn't cheat in spoting or arty fire, it follows teh same rules you do and you never get to see all the times it FAILS itsspotting rolls, but of course everyione remembers when it gets lucky

Nikademus · Post by **Nikademus** » Wed May 16, 2001 1:37 am

well in my humble opinion as both an amatuer historian as well as a wargamer, you can NEVER have too much realism, at least in terms of combat ability of weapons or fighting prowess of the troops (An exception to this would be 'real time' games that do such a good job putting you in the role of rear area commander that you get no info and are bored and frustrated :p )

Random generated scenerios in 39 - 42 will probably always be easy meat for you if your the Germans. The 'overall' state of the Red Army during those years was nothing short of pitiful, due mainly to the Purges.

I've found that the designer scenerios can be VERY challenging. Especially as the experience and moral ratings, whether for game balance or due to historical, tend to be higher.

Found that out to my cost in my current scenerio (Disaster at Dene?(something)) 1941.

Not only am i facing a large foward element of a full Mech corp (mucho tanks) but their experience ratings are also quite good (for the Russian.....mid to high 70's, even some 80's for some of the best units)

I lost quite a few tanks thinking they were "safe" parked at medium to long range as i made the unfortunate (ass)umption that i was facing raw recruits and greenies in the 40's or 50's (maybe even a few 30's!!)

A few turns later with some of my panzers burning i realized i had a fight on my hands
:rolleyes:

Want a good challenge in random? take an Italian corp group to Russia. Now THERE's a fun time