Unit Readiness Recovery?

[Oberst_Klink]

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

Only the five in the upper right have any supply at all.
That's the way it looks to me.

Yep, Onkel Larry... the others are cut off for sure; hence the black dot(s)... (not the pirate black spot), but... they ain't getting Chop-Suey or fortune cookies for sure.

Klink, Oberst

[Lobster]

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink

ORIGINAL: larryfulkerson

Only the five in the upper right have any supply at all.
That's the way it looks to me.

Yep, Onkel Larry... the others are cut off for sure; hence the black dot(s)... (not the pirate black spot), but... they ain't getting Chop-Suey or fortune cookies for sure.

Klink, Oberst

That, my friend, is what we call a pocket. Zones of control have cut off all supplies. Any unit killed in there will not put any equipment into the replacement bin. They will all be totally destroyed. Best to find a way to get them linked up to the supply net and try to save what you can. Or let them die a glorious death holding up enemy units so others in your army can do what they will.

[SeriousCatNZ]

ORIGINAL: Lobster

That, my friend, is what we call a pocket. Zones of control have cut off all supplies. Any unit killed in there will not put any equipment into the replacement bin. They will all be totally destroyed. Best to find a way to get them linked up to the supply net and try to save what you can. Or let them die a glorious death holding up enemy units so others in your army can do what they will.

[&:] I know what a pocket is, obviously they are totally lost. I'm referring to the units outside of the pocket. Even units within the pocket used to be in supply when they weren't in a pocket but never regained supply status.

[SeriousCatNZ]

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink

OK, be specific; which PRC unit in question?

The units circled in red.

[gbaby]

Still does not look like a problem to me. Your units are only going to get 10 supply per turn, as you stated they are getting.

Now I might be so wrong on this, not knowing the behind the covers of TOAW IV, but in previous versions you would get only 50% supplies as your seeing.

However, with the new extended supply rules, I believe this has been changed to 100% supplies received. Now I "assumed" that meant enabling the new supply rules for extended supply and this would take effect, regardless whether the scenario is using extended supply or not, so even set to 0 (as previous version scenarios would have by default), no extended supply, but you get 100% supply due to having extended supply option enabled.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, which is normal for me. But if it is correct, and you do not have extended supply enabled, you will see what you are getting, 10 per turn (50% of values shown).

On the other hand, I just might be making a fool of myself, again.

[Lobster]

If they are adjacent to a cooperative HQ unit they will get an increase of 50%. Again, it will take time to get your supply level up. It always does. You really need to read the manual concerning all supply considerations.

HQ Bias Effects
The level of resupply possible for a unit increases by
50% if a cooperative Headquarters unit is located
with or adjacent to a unit. See Cooperative Units
(8.6.1)

Also:

Other Supply Considerations
If a unit moved (from one location to another) in
the previous Turn, its Resupply Level is reduced by
33%

And:

9.1.7.5. Supply Consumption Costs
Land Movement consumes 1 supply point per
movement point expended (this is modified by the
Supply Costs of Movement Rate parameter (see
8.5.2)). However, Naval, Embarked, and Air Units
do not expend supply when moving.
Attacking consumes 10 supply points per
combat round. Defending consumes 10 supply
points per combat round. Ranged units directly
assigned to combat consume 10 supply points per
combat round. Ranged units that cooperatively
support at half strength consume 5 supply points
per combat round. Note that if the attacker fails
any of the Assault Ratio checks (see 13.20) then
defender supply costs can drop significantly. Also,
the Naval Attrition Divider scales naval combat
supply costs. Air units set to Air Superiority or
Interdiction missions pay no supply for combat.

[SeriousCatNZ]

The unit I'm looking at has it's unit supply level at 5%, yet the formation report indicates the formation supply is at 75%.

The problem I'm finding with this scenario is that inexplicably, my combat power approaches nil after some threshold is reached. For example, I was blitzing my way through the South Korean and UN forces, then suddenly, my units are all useless at attacking and defending. This literally happened in one turn. The same thing happened to the Chinese. I was blitzing through the UN forces, destroying 2 stacks per turn, then suddenly even though my Chinese units were at health green their attacks became completely ineffective at high odds.

Why is this happening?

I'd be particularly interested in hearing about others' experiences with the same scenario, especially in replicating the initial North Korean advance to the Pusan perimeter, the UN push back, then the UN 'bug-out' from the Yalu River and Chosin Reservoir.

[larryfulkerson]

Korea 50-51 you say? I'll take a look under the hood and see what I can find out
and give you a full report.

[larryfulkerson]

I thought I'd play as the Communists against the computer and right off the bat I've found a terrible problem:
The railroad destruction chance is 100% so everytime you step on an enemy rail you break it and the auto rail
repair chance is 1% which means it isn't going to happen, don't count on it. And from what I can tell there's
no NKPR RR engineers so there's not a whole lot of rail getting fixed and if you don't have the game option for
"high supply" ON then you're probably running out of supply really really fast. Lemme push some units around
and see what else I can find.

[larryfulkerson]

Another thing I've found is that there aren't a whole lot of trucks assigned to these units. Even if they dig in at the
end of the turn to lend their trucks to the higher HQ to use to enhance the supply flow, they aren't going to make a lot
of difference. Flow of supply is probably enhanced very little. This is the first turn and the interdiction amount and
the enhance of supply hasn't ( probably ) been calculated yet. Or if there are numbers showing they are probably wildly
inaccurate.

I'll push some more units around and see what else I can find.

[larryfulkerson]

The supply level looks just about normal and adequate at game start.

[larryfulkerson]

I found a unit that starts the game out of supply but his readings are in the green so I'm going to attack with him
anyway. He's going to help open an LOC for himself.

[Oberst_Klink]

ORIGINAL: gbaby

Still does not look like a problem to me. Your units are only going to get 10 supply per turn, as you stated they are getting.

Now I might be so wrong on this, not knowing the behind the covers of TOAW IV, but in previous versions you would get only 50% supplies as your seeing.

However, with the new extended supply rules, I believe this has been changed to 100% supplies received. Now I "assumed" that meant enabling the new supply rules for extended supply and this would take effect, regardless whether the scenario is using extended supply or not, so even set to 0 (as previous version scenarios would have by default), no extended supply, but you get 100% supply due to having extended supply option enabled.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, which is normal for me. But if it is correct, and you do not have extended supply enabled, you will see what you are getting, 10 per turn (50% of values shown).

On the other hand, I just might be making a fool of myself, again.

You meant this as well -

Limit removed on Unit Supply Recovery per Turn: Increased from 50 to 150. So, if the location is lush enough, a fully depleted unit can recover full supply in a single turn.

As for readiness, and Meyer1 already mentioned it - Readiness only increases when the supply stock of a unit is higher than 33 (remember, readiness never goes below 33%). That seems to be the crux of the matter.

Klink, Oberst

[larryfulkerson]

Okay, on turn two we're starting to get into the single digits of supply.

[Lobster]

Given the state of North Korea it's not surprising they run out of supply quickly. You can fudge with the scenario to make it play to your specifications but then it may no longer be realistic in real world terms but rather a 'what if North Korea weren't isolated?' scenario. They would most certainly run out of their own food quickly. But I think the scenario designer should give a limited time high value supply hes in Seoul upon capture. Or do they? Perhaps more limited time supply hexes at various other places in South Korea as the NK moves through the richer south and loots, as they most certainly will.

[gbaby]

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink

You meant this as well -

Limit removed on Unit Supply Recovery per Turn: Increased from 50 to 150. So, if the location is lush enough, a fully depleted unit can recover full supply in a single turn.

As for readiness, and Meyer1 already mentioned it - Readiness only increases when the supply stock of a unit is higher than 33 (remember, readiness never goes below 33%). That seems to be the crux of the matter.

Klink, Oberst

Thanks Oberst_Klink. Sometimes the supply rules just boggle the mind, though play wise, they work in a way that is logical.

But this situation SeriousCatNZ is describing is really bizaar. Almost as if the scenario was designed to cut off North supply, but not reflected via supply displays. How the units all lose supply/readiness and stay that way is unusual, but I see others are doing play throughs to see if it can be duplicated. Hopefully something will emerge.

I watch and learn.

[larryfulkerson]

Here's the supply situation at the start of turn three. It's not a whole lot better than last turn. On the east side
it's not high enough for operations. On the west side supply is ample. A lot of my units have been doing three-dot
attacks and now they're tired and need a rest and refit. Losses have been, actually I haven't had a look at the losses
yet. I'll check that out.

[larryfulkerson]

Here's T4 and the supply is almost nil in South Korea but the rails are bringing supply to the capital of South Korea
already. The units are tired and worn out but I can rotate the tired ones for fresh ones if I can just find some
fresh ones.

[larryfulkerson]

Here's T5 and as you can see there's starting to be some supply, very little, but some, down near Teagu in South Korea.
I've driven further into South Korea and the supply situation is abysmal.

[Primarchx]

I know supply is the primary influence on readiness but absorbing replacements can decrease readiness as well, correct?