The Elephant Vanishes : obvert (J) vs Historiker_SqzMyLemon_Canoerebel (A)

[Lowpe]

How many fletchers do the Allies have...I guess no way of knowing, but that is what I would be worried about.

Well done, I hope there is some ammo left in your ships.

[CaptBeefheart]

Holy epic clash of steel, Batman! I'd say good luck, but I'm an AFB. Anyway, thanks for the entertainment. Greyjoy, wherever he is, would be proud.

Cheers,
CC

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

How many fletchers do the Allies have...I guess no way of knowing, but that is what I would be worried about.

Well done, I hope there is some ammo left in your ships.

It seems all of the Fletchers set out in TFs were engaged and retired to the SE 1-2 hexes with their TFs due to lack of ammo. I'd suspect some have a bit left, but probably no torpedoes.

He may have some in reserve, which would now be brilliant for the Allies, and could really suck for the IJN. I'm even worried about the DE/PF ships that are so abundant, and not so much worse than an IJN DD by this point in the war.

In the BB TFs the big guns are very low, as expected, but all have some secondary (and tertiary on some, with 12.7cm guns) that are full or nearly full. I'd think if they're fighting DDs they's use these guns to as the ranges would be reduced. The IJN DDs have full ammo in two of the three BB TFs, and I had some from the cruisers that had broken off before combat to escort mine struck compatriots, and they have been reassigned to the BB TFs to add some fully loaded fresh ships. Also, all DD still have their long lances.

One IJN CA TF will run back in from Bihoro after reloading from an early battle. It can make the 8 hexes in the night phase, and will be set to bombard, but who knows what will be there then.

The Yamato and the fast BBs will run directly at the remaining USN ships one hex away, and we'll see if they can catch them low on ammo, and some damaged. I don't know if Repulse went under, but the VPs would suggest she didn't. About 6-7 subs, Es, AMCs and PBs will also he'd for this hex form all directions.

The Mutsu TF will try to bombard with what's left, and the gamble here is that if he doesn't sortie the hordes, it might get another shot at the runways and revetments, but if he does, they'll be first to engage a host of new ships, take a pounding, and retire (hopefully shielding the rest of the damaged from being sunk.

I've got 3 CAs moving at cruise speed back to Bihoro, and another TF moving at 7 hexes a phase but with some damage and low ammo. Want to get them back to safety.

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: Commander Cody

Holy epic clash of steel, Batman! I'd say good luck, but I'm an AFB. Anyway, thanks for the entertainment. Greyjoy, wherever he is, would be proud.

Cheers,
CC

It took me a while to commit to this one. I kept pushing it back, and this time the moon was right, all of the ships were in places and the Allies hadn't done anything new that I could see.

This one had the potential to get really boring really soon, and just a constant downhill slope for the Japanese. Hopefully this will reinvigorate the game and force the Allies into similar risks.

Yikes! [;)][X(]

[Lowpe]

ORIGINAL: obvert


He may have some in reserve, which would now be brilliant for the Allies, and could really suck for the IJN. I'm even worried about the DE/PF ships that are so abundant, and not so much worse than an IJN DD by this point in the war.

Nah, that would'n have been brilliant. Simply fortuitous that he had a bunch of Fletchers workings off system damage...but they might be in pier side mode.

Where is the American Navy? Such a key base protected by two old battleships and one battle cruiser when Japan had so much of their Navy left?

Were any of the fights away from the harbor...i.e. Allied fleets reacting to your initial rush?

Do you think the runway is closed? No CAP over the ships but CAP over the base so I guess he used 0 CAP range settings. You can sweep those ground troops on the rail line now and catch some bleeding cap.

A while back I asked where was the USN. I guess we know where it isn't. Since you have the Kuriles, you should be able to spot what the response is, but my guess is you have a real chance to deliver some very healthy blows in the next couple of days and from your replies you are attempting that...perhaps this will buy a big chunk of time before the next big invasion...true if the target is the Kuriles but probably not so true if the hammer will fall on upper Malaya.

So much depends upon what is sitting in harbor among those 700 ships.

Once the rail line is cleared, the Allies will be able to put all those planes on the rail lines indefinitely -- well at least till the deathstar shows back up again.

Stacking limit game, is there any chance to take back Sakhalin? That would be mythic.

Well done.

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

ORIGINAL: obvert


He may have some in reserve, which would now be brilliant for the Allies, and could really suck for the IJN. I'm even worried about the DE/PF ships that are so abundant, and not so much worse than an IJN DD by this point in the war.

Nah, that would'n have been brilliant. Simply fortuitous that he had a bunch of Fletchers workings off system damage...but they might be in pier side mode.

I'm hoping the subs were working off damage too. 30-40 USN subs in late 44 in one hex filled with IJN BBs doesn' make me feel really good right now.

Where is the American Navy? Such a key base protected by two old battleships and one battle cruiser when Japan had so much of their Navy left?

When they left the situation warranted keeping many with the CVs, and if they hadn't been I might have rushed them with the IJN at that point. I hear you, but it would have been a risk to get them in during the recent months. I'd spot a few cruisers and BBs more easily than small DD TFs he's sent, and he can't LR CAP over the far Kuriles, yet.

Another reason to do this kind of thing sooner rather than later is the range and quality of US fighters will be much improved soon.

Were any of the fights away from the harbor...i.e. Allied fleets reacting to your initial rush?

Nope. Seems all were on no reaction patrols.

Do you think the runway is closed? No CAP over the ships but CAP over the base so I guess he used 0 CAP range settings. You can sweep those ground troops on the rail line now and catch some bleeding cap.

I think it's near to closed if not all of the way, and it would be risky to rely on CAP in that situation. Especially not knowing if more fresh IJN ships are ready to bombard now (as they are).

I also have about 400 fighters sweeping Shikuka, and I hope this will deal with any CAP that may come up since those will be reduced groups with poor morale and high fatigue most likely.

A while back I asked where was the USN. I guess we know where it isn't. Since you have the Kuriles, you should be able to spot what the response is, but my guess is you have a real chance to deliver some very healthy blows in the next couple of days and from your replies you are attempting that...perhaps this will buy a big chunk of time before the next big invasion...true if the target is the Kuriles but probably not so true if the hammer will fall on upper Malaya.

So much depends upon what is sitting in harbor among those 700 ships.

Once the rail line is cleared, the Allies will be able to put all those planes on the rail lines indefinitely -- well at least till the deathstar shows back up again.

I'll try another fast transport to shut it at another point ASAP. Catching them at Toyohara would be even better, since that is close and has less flak.

Stacking limit game, is there any chance to take back Sakhalin? That would be mythic.

Yes. It would be.

I think there is a chance to take back Toyohara, which would probably be enough to cause the Allies some real problems. If I could land troops one hex away and rest them for a bit, then walk them in, while the base is hit to lower supply, it could be possible. A big if though. And there is a lot to do before even thinking about that.

Well done.

[/quote]

Dan wrote some time last night to say he thought it might be a while to get the turn back. Actually he said; "... I elected to run turn. It took just 2.3 light years. It’ll take 2.7 more to deal with the complexities of the turn."

Then, about 10 minutes ago, I got an email from him. I had asked about sync issues. he wrote back simply; "No sync issues."

Attached is file wpae015.pws [X(]

[Lowpe]

So your saying you got a rage turn...flipped with very few orders?

[Lokasenna]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

How many fletchers do the Allies have...I guess no way of knowing, but that is what I would be worried about.

Well done, I hope there is some ammo left in your ships.

It's an easy total number to remember [:D]. 175.

How many do the Allies actually have right now? Well, dunno.

[Lokasenna]

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

So your saying you got a rage turn...flipped with very few orders?

I doubt it.

For my part, when a beating like this occurs... it actually makes the turn very easy because what needs to happen is very obvious. Hence, fast turn.

[obvert]

Here is the air loss screen. That should be most of the B-29-1 now.

[obvert]

I managed to get through the replay and do the turn. No time left to update now.

I'll just say it was interesting, and the airfield at Shikuka was not closed ... [X(]

More details tomorrow.

[BillBrown]

ORIGINAL: obvert

I managed to get through the replay and do the turn. No time left to update now.

I'll just say it was interesting, and the airfield at Shikuka was not closed ... [X(]

More details tomorrow.

Tomorrow???? How do you expect us to wait that long???? [:D]

[obvert]

The turn started with too many small inconclusive reactions to go through. Not that interesting, except to say that a lot of Es, PBs, PTs, MTBs and even DDs and cruisers are running low on ammo and fuel. A lot of combats starting at 30k yards and then both commanders flee.


This first combat went well for the IJN, getting a few expendable ships in to battle the cruisers trying to get back to safety. The next was unfortunately abandoned by both sides before any good hits were landed.
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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 127,44, Range 8,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Okikaze, Shell hits 2
DD Hakaze
DD Akikaze
DD Shiokaze, Shell hits 1

Allied Ships
CL Trenton, Shell hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
DD Hunt, Shell hits 2
DD Hutchins
DD Irwin, Shell hits 6, on fire, heavy damage

Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
Range closes to 24,000 yards...

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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 127,44, Range 10,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Okikaze
DD Hakaze, Shell hits 1
DD Akikaze
DD Shiokaze

Allied Ships
CA Boston
DD Chauncey, Shell hits 1
DD Fullam
DD Halford
DD McGowan
DD Mullany
DD Murray
DD Newcomb

Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
Range closes to 10,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 10,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 10,000 yards
DD Shiokaze engages DD Chauncey at 10,000 yards

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[obvert]

The BBs had to wade through about a dozen PT TFs but most were low on ammo or fuel and didn't close in, luckily.
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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 11,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
BB Nagato
BB Yamato
BB Ise
BB Hyuga
DD Kazegumo
DD Makigumo
DD Makinami
DD Tamanami
DD Hatsukaze
DD Tanikaze
DD Arashio
DD Kasumi
DD Hatsushima
DD Wakaba
DD Ariake

Allied Ships
PT-220
PT-259, Shell hits 1
PT-260
PT-261, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
PT-262
PT-263
PT-278

Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards

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[obvert]

The fast BBs got a good shot at the USN cruisers, but after the turn I noticed they still had their 14cm and 12.7cm ammo left. Not sure why they don't expend it in these fights, but I've seen it over and over throughout the years. The ships are well within range of those guns, and they're the best targets this TF found all turn, but it was mostly the DDs firing in this one.
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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 127,44, Range 11,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
BB Kongo, Shell hits 1
BB Hiei, Shell hits 1
DD Hayanami, Shell hits 5, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Kiyonami
DD Hamanami
DD Asashimo, Shell hits 1
DD Natsugumo
DD Yamagumo

Allied Ships
CA Astoria
CL Santa Fe, Shell hits 2
DD Abbot, Shell hits 1
DD Stembel, Shell hits 1
DD Strong, Shell hits 2
DD David Taylor, Shell hits 3

Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese radar detects Allied task force at 11,000 yards
BB Hiei engages CL Santa Fe at 11,000 yards
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[obvert]

A few sets of Es get crushed by the USN before the fast old DDs arrive and take advantage of the lack of ammo in this very good USN TF. This was fun to watch as the DDs got in close to 2k yards and raked the ships with their 25mm AA guns! [8D][X(]


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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 11,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
E No.17, Shell hits 2
E No.21, Shell hits 17, heavy fires, heavy damage
E No.29, Shell hits 19, heavy fires, heavy damage
E No.31, Shell hits 13, and is sunk

Allied Ships
DE Austin, Shell hits 1
DE Canfield
DE Crouter
DE Edward C. Daly
DE Dempsey
DE Eisele, Shell hits 3, heavy fires

Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
Range closes to 28,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 28,000 yards
Range closes to 26,000 yards...

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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 8,000 Yards

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
OS2U-3 Kingfisher: 4 destroyed

Japanese Ships
DD Yakaze, Shell hits 2
DD Yukaze, Shell hits 2
DD Nokaze, Shell hits 1
DD Namikaze, Shell hits 7, and is sunk

Allied Ships
CA Wichita, Shell hits 8, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk
CL Columbia, Shell hits 6
DD Brown, Shell hits 33, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
DD Swanson, Shell hits 44, and is sunk
DD Worden, Shell hits 37, and is sunk

Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 8,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 8,000 yards
Allied ships attempt to get underway
DD Nokaze engages CA Wichita at 8,000 yards
DD Brown engages DD Namikaze at 3,000 yards
Merrill, A.S. "Tip" orders Allied TF to disengage
Range closes to 2,000 yards
DD Yukaze engages DD Swanson at 2,000 yards

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[obvert]

Some MTBs paid their way by hitting the DEs hard. Odd, but I guess at night and if the USN was low on ammo, not unexpected.
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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 6,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
MTB G-541
MTB G-552
MTB G-842, on fire
MGB G-876
MTB G-883

Allied Ships
DE Levy, Shell hits 1
DE Samuel S. Miles, Shell hits 4, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
DE Parks
DE Riddle
DE Swearer, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
DE Waterman

Japanese Ships Reported to be Approaching!
Allied TF begins to get underway
Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 8,000 yards
Range closes to 6,000 yards...
Range closes to 4,000 yards

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[obvert]

We got a few shots at the escort less Columbia, but couldn't help her under. Both subs and MTBs had their shots. Damn!

They did get to a few Fletchers though as well! Amazing!
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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 8,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
MTB G-538, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
MTB G-542
MTB G-543
MTB G-545, Shell hits 1, and is sunk

Allied Ships
DD Brownson
DD Owen, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
DD Philip
DD Picking
DD Renshaw, Shell hits 1, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage

Japanese Ships Reported to be Approaching!
Allied TF begins to get underway
Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
Range closes to 24,000 yards...
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[obvert]

Another inconclusive battle with ammo still left in the magazines. Grrrr.

Even more frustrating after three IJN CAs run up against the damaged Fletchers, which obviously still have something left in the tank. Mogami is sunk by a close range torpedo. [:(]
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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 127,44, Range 11,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
BB Kongo, Shell hits 2
BB Hiei, Shell hits 2
DD Kiyonami
DD Hamanami
DD Asashimo, on fire
DD Natsugumo

Allied Ships
CL Nashville, Shell hits 1
DD Bradford
DD Halsey Powell, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Prichett
DD Pringle, Shell hits 2
DD Abner Read
DD Remey

Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
Range closes to 28,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 28,000 yards
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 22,000 yards

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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 12,000 Yards

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
E13A1 Jake: 4 destroyed

Japanese Ships
CA Mogami, Shell hits 13, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
CA Mikuma, Shell hits 3
CA Kumano, Shell hits 1
DD Onami, Shell hits 5, and is sunk
DD Kishinami, Shell hits 18, and is sunk

Allied Ships
DD Brownson, Shell hits 1
DD Owen, Shell hits 9, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Philip, Shell hits 7
DD Picking, Shell hits 12, heavy fires
DD Renshaw, Shell hits 5, and is sunk

Japanese Ships Reported to be Approaching!
Allied TF begins to get underway
Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 12,000 yards
CA Mogami engages DD Renshaw at 12,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
CA Kumano engages DD Philip at 2,000 yards
DD Kishinami engages DD Brownson at 10,000 yards
Task forces break off...
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[obvert]

Mikuma and Kumano continue on undaunted and wreck some havoc among the slowed and ready compromised USN forces.
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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 8,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Mikuma
CA Kumano

Allied Ships
DE Bowers, Shell hits 9, and is sunk
DE Harmon, Shell hits 23, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
DE Loeser, Shell hits 5, and is sunk
DE Neuendorf, Shell hits 7, and is sunk

Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
DE Neuendorf engages CA Kumano at 8,000 yards
CA Kumano engages DE Loeser at 8,000 yards
Range closes to 3,000 yards

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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 8,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Mikuma
CA Kumano, Shell hits 2

Allied Ships
DD Brownson, Shell hits 50, and is sunk
DD Philip, Shell hits 12, and is sunk
DD Picking, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk

Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 8,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 8,000 yards
Allied ships attempt to get underway
DD Picking sunk by CA Kumano at 8,000 yards

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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 8,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Mikuma, Shell hits 2
CA Kumano, Shell hits 1

Allied Ships
DE Levy, Shell hits 28, and is sunk
DE Parks, Shell hits 10, and is sunk
DE Riddle, Shell hits 42, and is sunk
DE Waterman, Shell hits 3, and is sunk

Japanese Ships Reported to be Approaching!
Allied TF begins to get underway
Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 8,000 yards
CA Kumano engages DE Waterman at 8,000 yards

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Night Time Surface Combat, near Shikuka at 126,43, Range 8,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Mikuma
CA Kumano

Allied Ships
PT-319, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
PT-320, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
PT-321, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
PT-322, Shell hits 2, and is sunk
PT-323, Shell hits 1, and is sunk
PT-324, Shell hits 2, and is sunk

Japanese Ships Reported to be Approaching!
Allied TF begins to get underway
Improved night sighting under 100% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Partly Cloudy Conditions and 100% moonlight: 11,000 yards
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 8,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 8,000 yards
PT-319 sunk by CA Kumano at 8,000 yards
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