All things Football (soccer) related

[shunwick]

The second round of games in Group C are now complete.

Denmark 1 Australia 1. Enjoyable game to watch. Denmark disappointing, especially in the second half. Australian equalizer came from a VAR inspired soft penalty (and I am being generous here). Australia have no cutting edge. Still in with a chance but they play Peru in their last game and they are another team that cannot score goals. High quality goal from Denmark.

France 1 Peru 0. France are quality in patches but overall disappointing so far. Peru have no credible cutting edge and it's a real shame that they become the fourth team to book their flight back home.

Anyone willing to share their thoughts on VAR? It's still on trial and obviously with teething troubles. As I understand it, it's supposed to provide clarity on controversial decisions or to spot things the ref misses. But so far, it seems to have caused as much controversy as is supposed to stop. Early days for VAR? Or an experiment too far?

Best wishes,
Steve

[rico21]

To complete the Tabloid.
The France team is very disappointing.
In two games, she won only twice. [:D][:D]

[shunwick]

OMG

Best wishes,
Steve

[warspite1]

Two games - two excellent performances from Modric. Croatia are not a team I'd like to play in the next round.


VAR what a total and utter joke.

[Piteas]

Yesterday, it was very funny watching the argentine TVs after the Argentina vs Croatia. A team never received so many and imaginative insults [:D]

The argentine commentators have a reputation for being crazy, but yesterday they were possesed for the devil.

"Messi, you´re the son of 70.000 bitches...sorry, not thousands... son of 70.000 millions of bitches!"
"Caballero (goalkeeper), be a honorable man...Commit suicide!"
"Now I want to die, I want to die... we´re a f* joke for the Brasilians"
"Messi, stay in Barcelona. Don´t back to Argentina. It is a friend´s advice"
"Messi is God, of course... because he never appears when you call him!"
"I hate them. The exile is little sentence for them... you understand my words.

Etc..

[VPaulus]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Two games - two excellent performances from Modric. Croatia are not a team I'd like to play in the next round.


VAR what a total and utter joke.

I haven't seen many games, but it already helpded in one or two games. Maybe you are just seeing the negative side.
In Portugal, we've played the last season with VAR and I think the outcome is positive.
I agree it still needs to be tweaked. But it's the future.

[bazjak]

Messi has only played for one team for most of his career and that team is Barca
A team that has some of the best and gifted players in the world
Take him away from those superstars and put him in a team that is average (like most teams ) and he is an average player
If you want to be the best you have to work at it like Ranaldo
Portugal are not a very good team but he is proving how good he is

[shunwick]

The second round of games in Group D are now complete.

Argentina 0 Croatia 3. The Argentinians commit ritual suicide as Croatia dish out plenty of misery on Messi & co on top of some clinical finishing. I described Portugal earlier as being an average team plus Ronaldo. I was thinking of calling Argentina a below average team plus Messi. But, to be honest, I don't think Argentina are team at all. They have one game left in the group against Nigeria and they have to perform just to recapture a little bit a pride. Congrats to Croatia who confirm their place in the knockout round.

Iceland 0 Nigeria 2. Nigeria were well worth the win including two cracking goals. Iceland missed a VAR induced penalty late in the game with the ball still rising. Everything is set up nicely for a group finish and the Nigeria v Argentina game on Tuesday is looking a bit tasty.

So Argentina still have a chance to qualify from the group as do Nigeria. If Argentina are to progress they will have to become a team. They have until Tuesday to work on that.

Best wishes,
Steve

[shunwick]

ORIGINAL: VPaulus

ORIGINAL: warspite1
VAR what a total and utter joke.

I haven't seen many games, but it already helpded in one or two games. Maybe you are just seeing the negative side.
In Portugal, we've played the last season with VAR and I think the outcome is positive.
I agree it still needs to be tweaked. But it's the future.

Overall, I agree that VAR is the future and needing to be tweaked, certainly. We need to see more consistency between VAR and Refs. It is by no means a perfect system and probably never will be. The best we can hope for is that the combination of Refs plus VAR get more decisions right than they get wrong.

Best wishes,
Steve

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: VPaulus

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Two games - two excellent performances from Modric. Croatia are not a team I'd like to play in the next round.


VAR what a total and utter joke.

I haven't seen many games, but it already helpded in one or two games. Maybe you are just seeing the negative side.
In Portugal, we've played the last season with VAR and I think the outcome is positive.
I agree it still needs to be tweaked. But it's the future.

warspite1

Yes I am seeing the negative side. To be clear if VAR works as it should then it is a good thing.

Did anyone watch the Argentina vs Croatia game? There were potentially bone breaking challenges going on and Otamendi kicked a Croatian in the back whilst the latter was on the floor. In a non-VAR world the talking point would be the referee who makes the wrong decisions. In a VAR world the talking point is the VAR refs that missed them. The difference? The VAR refs are supposed to have the benefit of numerous replays from different angles to see what the ref may have missed.

So then what the hell was last night all about? What was Harry Kane getting wrestled to the ground Greco-Roman stylee all about?

Remember referees have been told at this World Cup to try and cut-out the wrestling in the box. So if that is a specific edict from on high then why were the VAR refs to inept?

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: bazjak

Messi has only played for one team for most of his career and that team is Barca
A team that has some of the best and gifted players in the world
Take him away from those superstars and put him in a team that is average (like most teams ) and he is an average player
If you want to be the best you have to work at it like Ranaldo
Portugal are not a very good team but he is proving how good he is

warspite1

Whereas Ronaldo is playing with amateurs at Real and previously at Manchester United?

People have their opinion on whether Ronaldo or Messi is better and that is fine and an interesting debate. But you think Messi is just an average player? Not sure how many would agree with that but its not going to be many - and certainly not many of his professional footballing peers.

[shunwick]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

warspite1

Yes I am seeing the negative side. To be clear if VAR works as it should then it is a good thing.

Did anyone watch the Argentina vs Croatia game? There were potentially bone breaking challenges going on and Otamendi kicked a Croatian in the back whilst the latter was on the floor. In a non-VAR world the talking point would be the referee who makes the wrong decisions. In a VAR world the talking point is the VAR refs that missed them. The difference? The VAR refs are supposed to have the benefit of numerous replays from different angles to see what the ref may have missed.

So then what the hell was last night all about? What was Harry Kane getting wrestled to the ground Greco-Roman stylee all about?

Remember referees have been told at this World Cup to try and cut-out the wrestling in the box. So if that is a specific edict from on high then why were the VAR refs to inept?

There could have been multiple red cards in the Argentina v Croatia game. Otamendi deserved a straight red. There are no premier league refs out in Russia and we are seeing the results of that. The problem I see is that the Ref and the VAR team have to be singing from the same song sheet. It also seems that FIFA has told refs to be lenient.

The Ref & VAR combination is still a work in progress as far as I am concerned. And as far as I know, VAR were not even involved with the Harry Kane incidents and were probably not involved with the Otamendi incident. Such things are, apparently, not in their remit.

Best wishes,
Steve

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: shunwick

ORIGINAL: warspite1

warspite1

Yes I am seeing the negative side. To be clear if VAR works as it should then it is a good thing.

Did anyone watch the Argentina vs Croatia game? There were potentially bone breaking challenges going on and Otamendi kicked a Croatian in the back whilst the latter was on the floor. In a non-VAR world the talking point would be the referee who makes the wrong decisions. In a VAR world the talking point is the VAR refs that missed them. The difference? The VAR refs are supposed to have the benefit of numerous replays from different angles to see what the ref may have missed.

So then what the hell was last night all about? What was Harry Kane getting wrestled to the ground Greco-Roman stylee all about?

Remember referees have been told at this World Cup to try and cut-out the wrestling in the box. So if that is a specific edict from on high then why were the VAR refs to inept?

There could have been multiple red cards in the Argentina v Croatia game. Otamendi deserved a straight red. There are no premier league refs out in Russia and we are seeing the results of that. The problem I see is that the Ref and the VAR team have to be singing from the same song sheet. It also seems that FIFA has told refs to be lenient.

The Ref & VAR combination is still a work in progress as far as I am concerned. And as far as I know, VAR were not even involved with the Harry Kane incidents and were probably not involved with the Otamendi incident. Such things are, apparently, not in their remit.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

Out of interest, why would the VAR refs not be interested in opining on whether Harry Kane was fouled, but were interested in whether other players were fouled in the box? Who decides what is VAR'd? It can't just be the ref surely because he may miss something - which makes VAR pretty pointless??? I'm pretty sure in the Iceland - Nigeria game the non-penalty overturn came from the VAR peeps - the ref had decided it was not a penalty.

I am also at a loss as to how the refs can be told to be lenient and at the same time to cut out the WWE penalty area stuff.

There's lenient for somethings sure - but kicking a player or trying to snap a player's leg in two can't EVER be something the calls for leniency.

[shunwick]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: shunwick

ORIGINAL: warspite1

warspite1

Yes I am seeing the negative side. To be clear if VAR works as it should then it is a good thing.

Did anyone watch the Argentina vs Croatia game? There were potentially bone breaking challenges going on and Otamendi kicked a Croatian in the back whilst the latter was on the floor. In a non-VAR world the talking point would be the referee who makes the wrong decisions. In a VAR world the talking point is the VAR refs that missed them. The difference? The VAR refs are supposed to have the benefit of numerous replays from different angles to see what the ref may have missed.

So then what the hell was last night all about? What was Harry Kane getting wrestled to the ground Greco-Roman stylee all about?

Remember referees have been told at this World Cup to try and cut-out the wrestling in the box. So if that is a specific edict from on high then why were the VAR refs to inept?

There could have been multiple red cards in the Argentina v Croatia game. Otamendi deserved a straight red. There are no premier league refs out in Russia and we are seeing the results of that. The problem I see is that the Ref and the VAR team have to be singing from the same song sheet. It also seems that FIFA has told refs to be lenient.

The Ref & VAR combination is still a work in progress as far as I am concerned. And as far as I know, VAR were not even involved with the Harry Kane incidents and were probably not involved with the Otamendi incident. Such things are, apparently, not in their remit.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

Out of interest, why would the VAR refs not be interested in opining on whether Harry Kane was fouled, but were interested in whether other players were fouled in the box? Who decides what is VAR'd? It can't just be the ref surely because he may miss something - which makes VAR pretty pointless???

I am also at a loss as to how the refs can be told to be lenient and at the same time to cut out the WWE penalty area stuff.

There's lenient for somethings sure - but kicking a player or trying to snap a player's leg in two can't EVER be something the calls for leniency.

For VAR, take a look at this:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdwOL08NfxQ

That is FIFA TV.

As for leniency, that is down to the Refs not VAR. I agree with you that some of those incidents were downright dangerous if not criminal. But still down the Ref.

If the Refs have been told to go easy on the yellow cards (and I have no proof that they have other than what has gone on so far) then that is still down to the Ref. Only Red cards are reviewed by VAR.

FIFA have been clear on what gets reviewed by VAR. Is that enough? No, not in my opinion.

Best wishes,
Steve

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: shunwick

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: shunwick




There could have been multiple red cards in the Argentina v Croatia game. Otamendi deserved a straight red. There are no premier league refs out in Russia and we are seeing the results of that. The problem I see is that the Ref and the VAR team have to be singing from the same song sheet. It also seems that FIFA has told refs to be lenient.

The Ref & VAR combination is still a work in progress as far as I am concerned. And as far as I know, VAR were not even involved with the Harry Kane incidents and were probably not involved with the Otamendi incident. Such things are, apparently, not in their remit.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

Out of interest, why would the VAR refs not be interested in opining on whether Harry Kane was fouled, but were interested in whether other players were fouled in the box? Who decides what is VAR'd? It can't just be the ref surely because he may miss something - which makes VAR pretty pointless???

I am also at a loss as to how the refs can be told to be lenient and at the same time to cut out the WWE penalty area stuff.

There's lenient for somethings sure - but kicking a player or trying to snap a player's leg in two can't EVER be something the calls for leniency.

For VAR, take a look at this:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdwOL08NfxQ

That is FIFA TV.

As for leniency, that is down to the Refs not VAR. I agree with you that some of those incidents were downright dangerous if not criminal. But still down the Ref.

If the Refs have been told to go easy on the yellow cards (and I have no proof that they have other than what has gone on so far) then that is still down to the Ref. Only Red cards are reviewed by VAR.

FIFA have been clear on what gets reviewed by VAR. Is that enough? No, not in my opinion.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

Thank-you - yes so that proves that the man-handling of Harry Kane WAS being looked at by the VAR team.

They were also looking at the Otamendi and Rebic incidents.

That's a disgrace in the case of the latter two, and woefully inconsistent in the case of the Kane incidents.

[shunwick]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: shunwick

ORIGINAL: warspite1


warspite1

Out of interest, why would the VAR refs not be interested in opining on whether Harry Kane was fouled, but were interested in whether other players were fouled in the box? Who decides what is VAR'd? It can't just be the ref surely because he may miss something - which makes VAR pretty pointless???

I am also at a loss as to how the refs can be told to be lenient and at the same time to cut out the WWE penalty area stuff.

There's lenient for somethings sure - but kicking a player or trying to snap a player's leg in two can't EVER be something the calls for leniency.

For VAR, take a look at this:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdwOL08NfxQ

That is FIFA TV.

As for leniency, that is down to the Refs not VAR. I agree with you that some of those incidents were downright dangerous if not criminal. But still down the Ref.

If the Refs have been told to go easy on the yellow cards (and I have no proof that they have other than what has gone on so far) then that is still down to the Ref. Only Red cards are reviewed by VAR.

FIFA have been clear on what gets reviewed by VAR. Is that enough? No, not in my opinion.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

Thank-you - yes so that proves that the man-handling of Harry Kane WAS being looked at by the VAR team.

They were also looking at the Otamendi and Rebic incidents.

That's a disgrace.

Otamendi and Rebic did not get red cards. So, not reviewed by VAR.

FIFA investigated the Harry Kane incidents and confirmed VAR working ok. Bad news for the Ref. Will be interesting to see if he gets anymore games in this world cup.

Best wishes,
Steve

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: shunwick

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: shunwick



For VAR, take a look at this:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdwOL08NfxQ

That is FIFA TV.

As for leniency, that is down to the Refs not VAR. I agree with you that some of those incidents were downright dangerous if not criminal. But still down the Ref.

If the Refs have been told to go easy on the yellow cards (and I have no proof that they have other than what has gone on so far) then that is still down to the Ref. Only Red cards are reviewed by VAR.

FIFA have been clear on what gets reviewed by VAR. Is that enough? No, not in my opinion.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

Thank-you - yes so that proves that the man-handling of Harry Kane WAS being looked at by the VAR team.

They were also looking at the Otamendi and Rebic incidents.

That's a disgrace.

Otamendi and Rebic did not get red cards. So, not reviewed by VAR.

FIFA investigated the Harry Kane incidents and confirmed VAR working ok. Bad news for the Ref. Will be interesting to see if he gets anymore games in this world cup.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

What so you are saying they only review red cards in case they should not be red - but not potential red card incidents? Not my reading of it.

Violent conduct and dangerous tackles can be penalised using VAR. Second-yellow cards cannot.

Red cards. If the referee has decided a foul has been committed, then VAR can be used to decide whether a red card should be awarded.

If its only reviewing red cards then what is the point of that? I can't believe that is the correct interpretation.

Sorry in the case of Harry Kane what did FIFA say was okay and how did those incidents differ from Nigeria vs Croatia???

[shunwick]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: shunwick

ORIGINAL: warspite1


warspite1

Thank-you - yes so that proves that the man-handling of Harry Kane WAS being looked at by the VAR team.

They were also looking at the Otamendi and Rebic incidents.

That's a disgrace.

Otamendi and Rebic did not get red cards. So, not reviewed by VAR.

FIFA investigated the Harry Kane incidents and confirmed VAR working ok. Bad news for the Ref. Will be interesting to see if he gets anymore games in this world cup.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

What so you are saying they only review red cards in case they should not be red - but not potential red card incidents? Not my reading of it.

Violent conduct and dangerous tackles can be penalised using VAR. Second-yellow cards cannot.

If that is the case then what is the point of that? I can't believe that is the correct interpretation.

Sorry in the case of Harry Kane what did FIFA say was okay and how did those incidents differ from Nigeria vs Croatia???

VAR can only suggest that the ref looks at an incident. VAR cannot overrule the ref. If the ref does not want to look ....

The problems you mention (with which I agree) are more down to the ref than VAR. That is a problem in itself.

Best wishes,
Steve

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: shunwick

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: shunwick



Otamendi and Rebic did not get red cards. So, not reviewed by VAR.

FIFA investigated the Harry Kane incidents and confirmed VAR working ok. Bad news for the Ref. Will be interesting to see if he gets anymore games in this world cup.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

What so you are saying they only review red cards in case they should not be red - but not potential red card incidents? Not my reading of it.

Violent conduct and dangerous tackles can be penalised using VAR. Second-yellow cards cannot.

If that is the case then what is the point of that? I can't believe that is the correct interpretation.

Sorry in the case of Harry Kane what did FIFA say was okay and how did those incidents differ from Nigeria vs Croatia???

VAR can only suggest that the ref looks at an incident. VAR cannot overrule the ref. If the ref does not want to look ....

The problems you mention (with which I agree) are more down to the ref than VAR. That is a problem in itself.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

If you want to know all you need to know about the total horsepoo that is VAR then have a look at Serbia vs Switzerland. Total and utter nonsense.

[shunwick]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: shunwick

ORIGINAL: warspite1

warspite1

What so you are saying they only review red cards in case they should not be red - but not potential red card incidents? Not my reading of it.

Violent conduct and dangerous tackles can be penalised using VAR. Second-yellow cards cannot.

If that is the case then what is the point of that? I can't believe that is the correct interpretation.

Sorry in the case of Harry Kane what did FIFA say was okay and how did those incidents differ from Nigeria vs Croatia???

VAR can only suggest that the ref looks at an incident. VAR cannot overrule the ref. If the ref does not want to look ....

The problems you mention (with which I agree) are more down to the ref than VAR. That is a problem in itself.

Best wishes,
Steve

warspite1

If you want to know all you need to know about the total horsepoo that is VAR then have a look at Serbia vs Switzerland. Total and utter nonsense.

Yep I am watching it at the moment. And yes Serbia should have had a penalty.

Best wishes,
Steve