Rommel dismissed at turn 2

[MrBlizzard]

Hi, playing Torch to Tunisia,
At turn 2 Erwin Rommel as been dismissed as commander of Afrika German Italian Panzer Army. [X(]
Replaced by inept general Robotti [:-]
I can't believe it... I'm very disappointed [:@]
Who will fight at Kasserine? Robotti?
Rommel has only a grade 2 for political, that's why he has been dismissed so quickly.
in 1942 he shouldn't have this low grade, he was a favorite of Hitler until the involvement in bombing in 1944.

I will never be able to replace Robotti, he has 43 of dismissal cost and I get just 2 political points a turn in this scenery... [:(]

Please fix this
thanks

[IslandInland]

ORIGINAL: MrBlizzard

Hi, playing Torch to Tunisia,
At turn 2 Erwin Rommel as been dismissed as commander of Afrika German Italian Panzer Army. [X(]
Replaced by inept general Robotti [:-]
I can't believe it... I'm very disappointed [:@]
Who will fight at Kasserine? Robotti?
Rommel has only a grade 2 for political, that's why he has been dismissed so quickly.
in 1942 he shouldn't have this low grade, he was a favorite of Hitler until the involvement in bombing in 1944.

I will never be able to replace Robotti, he has 43 of dismissal cost and I get just 2 political points a turn in this scenery... [:(]

Please fix this
thanks

Bad luck I guess. [:)]

[szmike]

it is an old bug and it was fixed quite some time ago, but then I didn't play the game the last year or so. Maybe it reappeared?

[MrBlizzard]

Yes thanks, I found your old thread with the same problem for the "Rommel attacks" scenario:
Rommel attacks

I noticed Joel Billings asked: "why is not happening the same in Torch scenario?" Here you are! [:D]
Reading the discussion I suspect the problem was not resolved.

The problem IMHO is the very low political value Rommel is starting with, it's just "3".
So there should be an (high) random possibility for him to be fired. But it is random, so not always happens.

In my game I had 4 defeats with Rommel so probably political value decreased to "2" and it was even more probable for him to be dismissed.

Now I need 43 political points to change Robotti... I'm stuck with him forever... [:(]





PS: At least Robotti is a better administrator than Rommel [:'(]

[IslandInland]

ORIGINAL: MrBlizzard

Yes thanks, I found your old thread with the same problem for the "Rommel attacks" scenario:
Rommel attacks

I noticed Joel Billings asked: "why is not happening the same in Torch scenario?" Here you are! [:D]
Reading the discussion I suspect the problem was not resolved.

The problem IMHO is the very low political value Rommel is starting with, it's just "3".
So there should be an (high) random possibility for him to be fired. But it is random, so not always happens.

In my game I had 4 defeats with Rommel so probably political value decreased to "2" and it was even more probable for him to be dismissed.

Now I need 43 political points to change Robotti... I'm stuck with him forever... [:(]





PS: At least Robotti is a better administrator than Rommel [:'(]

You could rationalise this by thinking Hitler might well have fired him given his historical rapid retreat from Egypt to Tunisia. Hitler wasn't happy about his general's yielding a yard let alone hundreds of miles.

[Sardaukar]

Just on the amusing side...with those that Robotti could as well be a robot... [:D]

[MrBlizzard]

ORIGINAL: IslandInland

ORIGINAL: MrBlizzard

Yes thanks, I found your old thread with the same problem for the "Rommel attacks" scenario:
Rommel attacks

I noticed Joel Billings asked: "why is not happening the same in Torch scenario?" Here you are! [:D]
Reading the discussion I suspect the problem was not resolved.

The problem IMHO is the very low political value Rommel is starting with, it's just "3".
So there should be an (high) random possibility for him to be fired. But it is random, so not always happens.

In my game I had 4 defeats with Rommel so probably political value decreased to "2" and it was even more probable for him to be dismissed.

Now I need 43 political points to change Robotti... I'm stuck with him forever... [:(]





PS: At least Robotti is a better administrator than Rommel [:'(]

You could rationalise this by thinking Hitler might well have fired him given his historical rapid retreat from Egypt to Tunisia. Hitler wasn't happy about his general's yielding a yard let alone hundreds of miles.

Yeah sure except for 2 issues:
- we're just at turn 2, Rommel is still in Lybia far away from Tunisia! Historically he leaded at Kasserine in 1943.
- Hitler would never never dismiss Rommel just to put in charge... an Italian burocrat general. He would have put a good german general.

And here is the second problem, the "german-italian panzer HQ" has italian nationality (yellow) so the substitute is taken from italian general pool instead than from german.

[Searry]

Rommel is bad as an army level General anyway and this is reflected on his stats. If you check the tank corp commander formula you can see Rommel is quite good in commanding a corps.
I personally think he should have never been more than a corps commander. He was too hands on.

[Denniss]

Robotti should not even be there as he was in Yugoslavia since 1941 which is off-limits in WitW

[xhoel]

To add to the things everyone else said, the Germans would never allow an Italian General to command their forces. And Rommels rating seems pretty low to me. He was on Hitlers good side till the plot.

[MrBlizzard]

I found this:
"While Rommel was at Kasserine at the end of January 1943, the Italian General Giovanni Messe was appointed commander of Panzer Army Africa, renamed the Italo-German Panzer Army in recognition of the fact that it consisted of one German and three Italian corps. Though Messe replaced Rommel, he diplomatically deferred to him, and the two coexisted in what was theoretically the same command. On 23 February Armeegruppe Afrika was created with Rommel in command. It included the Italo-German Panzer Army under Messe (renamed 1st Italian Army) and the German 5th Panzer Army in the north of Tunisia under General Hans-Jürgen von Arnim."

So Rommel promoted to army group Afrika HQ and substituted by italian general Messe in italian-german panzer army

[xhoel]

Was that appointment done for political reasons? I wasn't aware of it and as far as I know the Germans did not see the Italian leadership very favourly.

[MrBlizzard]

ORIGINAL: xhoel

Was that appointment done for political reasons? I wasn't aware of it and as far as I know the Germans did not see the Italian leadership very favourly.

I think so, appointment done for political reasons, I wasn't aware too [;)]
Anyway Rommel was promoted, not dismissed and had the control of the entire group army.

[LiquidSky]

Alfred Guzzoni of the Italian 6th Army was in control of all Axis forces in Sicily when the allies landed...so apparently Hitler would allow Italians to command Germans.

Hube did take over later when he showed up with his Panzer Corp HQ.

[xhoel]

Yes and no. GL Von Senger und Etterling was the one who issued orders to the German troops under the command of the 6th Italian Army. He was the German liason officer in the 6th Army HQ but took his orders directly from Kesserling. Guzzoni delegated the command of sectors where the German units were concentrated to Hube on the 16th of July.

[MrBlizzard]

Just wanted to share this funny post factum with you
After a long escape from El elamein the german-italian army leaded by unknown general Robotti (that previously replaced sacked Rommel) managed to encircle and destroy the mighty british 8th army leaded by Monty!
I didn't trust in Robotti but I had to change my mind
Robotti rules ! [:D] [:D] [:D]

[Capitaine]

I just finished reading an excellent, first hand account of Germany in WWII. As I recall, Rommel was often ill, and Hitler believed he was needed for the coming Allied invasion of France, which he believed even at this time was imminent. Also, Hitler wanted to spare Rommel the ignominy of losing the war in Tunisia, which Hitler viewed as inevitable at this time.

[IslandInland]

ORIGINAL: MrBlizzard

Just wanted to share this funny post factum with you
After a long escape from El elamein the german-italian army leaded by unknown general Robotti (that previously replaced sacked Rommel) managed to encircle and destroy the mighty british 8th army leaded by Monty!
I didn't trust in Robotti but I had to change my mind
Robotti rules ! [:D] [:D] [:D]

An armoured brigade and a brigade of the NZ division hardly constitutes the entirety of the 8th Army. Perhaps Robotti has good PR people. [:)]

[MrBlizzard]

ORIGINAL: IslandInland

ORIGINAL: MrBlizzard

Just wanted to share this funny post factum with you
After a long escape from El elamein the german-italian army leaded by unknown general Robotti (that previously replaced sacked Rommel) managed to encircle and destroy the mighty british 8th army leaded by Monty!
I didn't trust in Robotti but I had to change my mind
Robotti rules ! [:D] [:D] [:D]

An armoured brigade and a brigade of the NZ division hardly constitutes the entirety of the 8th Army. Perhaps Robotti has good PR people. [:)]

If you don't see you don't believe eh? [8|]
It's possible to see an image with other 3 Br units surrendered in my previous thread "captured equipment".
In total 8th army lost 7 mech/arm units encircled and destroyed, other 2 were mauled and routed. 8th Br army HQ and X Br Corps HQ were mauled and redeployed to Benghasi.
Not so bad for Robotti [8D]

[MrBlizzard]

3 turns ago