armored vehicles not moving in artillery barrage

[gbem]

hi... apparently armored vehicles have the balls not to move out of a barraged zone on their own... as a result it is painful to micromanage every individual unit especially in huge battles as they simply do not have the initiative to move out of a bombardment zone...

[Phoenix100]

+1

The micro-management of such issues is problematic, also, due to the delay incurred. It's not just armoured vehciles that don't move. I'm finding all units have this static approach to being under fire. I'm not sure if I am missing a trick still - was there some order sequence I should have used that would mean that when under fire they will seek cover and concealment? I can't find it yet, at any rate.

[exsonic01]

Aren't the tanks automatically move when DPICM or HE falls? I always see tanks automatically running away when DPICM falls. But you may feel that their "running away" distance is too short...

[zacklaws]

My experience is they do move out of artillery barrages, my scenario they did today they did.Infantry would go to ground as it would be more dangerous to keep moving. But on occasions they do not as you say, but is there a reason why? Has it something to do with the AI ,ie suppressed, confusion, morale and training levels etc.

Another experience I also see is, you can place a barrage down in front of an advancing unit, and they will stop and this is before you open fire

[gbem]

they actually dont move out of the way... i can confirm this

[Phoenix100]

Well, zack.., I'm not sure it's always best for infantry to merely go to ground, no? If there's a house nearby, for example - if they're prone right outside a building - then they would be better served to crawl into it, no? They're no more exposed to the chance of a hit lying still than they are crawling. There could be a morale reason - as you suggest - for lying still (with fright) of course.

[gbem]

exactly... also i might add... this logic does not apply to armored vehicles... its actually smarter to move out of the barrage zone especially against cluster munitions for armored vehicles

[22sec]

Vehicles are able to and do move out from under an artillery barrage. I think sometimes there are factors such as taking damage and suppression that slow or stop movement. Also, if you’re vehicles are caught under a DPICM strike they’re probably gonna be dead before they can even think about moving. Artillery is king of the battlefield, and in AB you witness that first hand.

[gbem]

artillery brings dignity to what would otherwise be a bloody brawl... problem is my tanks dont scatter upon DPICM bombardment... they only do so if the submunition hits the tank itself... as a result artillery is more lethal in AB than in real life... at the very least there should be a scatter command with no delay along with a take cover command that overrides all previous orders... this simulates the automatic scattering that occurs during an artillery barrage... thats a reasonable request dont you think?

[zacklaws]

Just to confirm what I know and have seen in the Alpha, the Beta and the final release, I have just done a lengthy test of artillery barrages using HE and DPICM on armoured vehicles and they just drive through it. Odd ones remain which I presume have been damaged but the trend is to get out of the area. One setting that I did not test as I did not have the time was the training and morale values which I did in the alpha and beta but cannot recall at what level things did happen. At a guess a too low training value may have them remain in the area.

[gbem]

ive done tests aswell on leos and T-72s... they only move out of the way when a direct hit is incurred...they sit in the barrage in other tests... i havent taken training into consideration yet (used 70s era stuff for testing wanted to standardize training) but ill give it a look see

[zacklaws]

Rereading the original post, I have a feeling that it is in reference to your own forces. If so, in which case are the units advancing under a "Contact" movement order which if I recall, they will stop under artillery fire. Under a "Contact" order all movement halts when encountering the enemy etc or something happens close by and to get them moving again another order has to be given which seems to happening in this case ie micromanaging

Maybe also the AI uses a "Contact" movement order too so similar may happen.

The "contact" order is something I rarely use as it can cause issues like this. Also if I do use this order, I find it pointless doing meticulous routes to follow because as soon as contact is made, all the route is deleted. So you can spend minutes doing a route, but within seconds of a scenario starting all that hard work is wasted. My method of using "contact" is to just give it one movement instruction in the direction and place I want the unit to go. I think in the beta, I suggested that the unit just halts on contact and the route is not deleted so then they can be ordered to move again at some point and if the waypoints are draggable, then the route can be quickly ammended to avoid the enemy or flank them etc.

[Adam Rinkleff]

Well, for what its worth, the AI armored vehicles DO move out from under a barrage.
You probably just need to be on top of the orders yourself.

[gbem]

i think a scatter order with no delay actually sounds like a reasonable proposal.... what do u guys think?

[Adam Rinkleff]

ORIGINAL: gbem

i think a scatter order with no delay actually sounds like a reasonable proposal.... what do u guys think?

Yah, more SOP options would certainly be of use. There are situations where you wouldn't want them to scatter, and situations where you would.

[Adam Rinkleff]

Actually, I think they do move under artillery fire. I just had a barrage, and my APC definitely moved on its own. I think maybe the move in 'cover' SOP is what makes them move. Not sure, but it relocated without orders.

[Veitikka]

It's quite interesting to watch all these different theories to emerge. Anyway, static vehicles do escape DPICM strikes, when a DPICM shell lands near to them. Vehicles do not escape HE shells. I don't think all vehicles should always escape all indirect fire, e.g. medium/heavy mortar shells, that are quite ineffective against vehicles. Also, it can be debated if an infantry unit should start running around when shells start landing around them. Perhaps in a short barrage it's better for the infantry to stay in one place, and if it's known that the barrage will last for a while then it's better to move to find cover.

Should the vehicles abandon their planned paths to escape DPICM? In my opinion no. Doing so would cause extra chaos, and in the end the formation would probably have to more through the barrage anyway.

[Veitikka]

If infantry is 'hiding', they're shelled, and they automatically escape the HE rounds, then they can reveal their positions and get killed in the process.

[zacklaws]

Vehicles do not escape HE shells

My experience is that they do and armored vehicles will drive out off or through an HE barrage. I have just reconfirmed it with 48 guns firing HE into a tgt area aprox 500+ metre square. All the tgt vehicles where T-80's or T-64's, as they had not been identified they was just identified as tracked vehicles.

I recorded some videos but sadly because of the forum limitations, I cannot post them.

[gbem]

idk i still think a scatter order to immediately scramble a formation should at least be optional... and remains both logical and realistic..