Notes from a Small Island

[Canoerebel]

Anyhow, DS isn't going up the river. It'll patrol at the mouth, while the invasion force (hopefully) goes up to Tungchow.

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

TFs with BBs and with CVs accepted orders to steam up the river a few hexes to Tungchow, so I think it'll work. If not those, hopefully at least my amphibious TFs (APAs would be the largest vessels) and escorting DDs could make the journey.

If worst came to worse - if my ignore and the evil vagaries of the game again showed me I was in error - then the default primary target is Chefoo. For that target I have a large army fully prepped. The enemy garrison is small.

15,000 tons is the threshold for river navigation. Your BB TFs won't balk until they get there.

Note that Nanking will have mines, so sending AMs or DMS might be wiser than sending DDs. A lot of your minor ASW vessels can also sweep mines. AFAIK Nanking has no fort (it doesn't start with one but I suppose CD units could have been added later - but I doubt it.)

What are those TFs outside of Kume Jima? Bombardment TFs?

[Canoerebel]

Those TFs are barges and small fry.

[JeffroK]

I did a test using stock scenario 1.

It is possible to run BB (35000t plus) to Nanking and Tungchow, I couldnt target Taichow with a SCTF as it isnt a port bu you may be able to target an amphibTF, forgot to try!.

(I actually got the TF to dock at the ports)

Bum on!!!

[Canoerebel]

Thanks, Jeff. I suspected that was true, as my big boy TFs were accepting orders to go that far.

Apparently, Taichow isn't even on the river! I cant even get APDs to accept orders to land there. I learned this about 45 days ago. I had an Amphib Force HQ 100% prepped for the base (so that's the one I switched over to Samah). I left many of the troops prepped for Taichow alone, figuring that Erik might make a stand there.

[JeffroK]

I'm surprised you cant even target the hex for a non-base invasion?

[Canoerebel]

That's right. I get a "Task Force Cannot Move Inland" error message when I try.

[MakeeLearn]

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

That's right. I get a "Task Force Cannot Move Inland" error message when I try.

Too many Sand Pebbles.

[JeffroK]

Maybe the ghost of "Simon" is blocking the river.

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Thanks, Jeff. I suspected that was true, as my big boy TFs were accepting orders to go that far.

Apparently, Taichow isn't even on the river! I cant even get APDs to accept orders to land there. I learned this about 45 days ago. I had an Amphib Force HQ 100% prepped for the base (so that's the one I switched over to Samah). I left many of the troops prepped for Taichow alone, figuring that Erik might make a stand there.

Use the F6 key to see hex side details. Taichow has red (no passage) on each of the river hex sides. Tungchow has red on the SW side but blue on the NW side.

I am very surprised the code for river navigation does not take effect until Nanking - that is one long, narrow bay!

[JeffroK]

From Britannica
https://www.britannica.com/place/Yangtze-River

The river then turns to the northeast, passes through a widening valley, and flows out onto the southern North China Plain. The width of the river increases at this point to between 3,000 and 6,000 feet (900 and 1,800 metres), and the depth in places approaches 100 feet. In this region there are a number of large cities, including Anqing, Wuhu, and Nanjing. The Grand Canal (Da Yunhe), which, with a length of nearly 1,100 miles (1,800 km), is one of the longest canals in the world; it crosses the Yangtze in the vicinity of the city of Zhenjiang.
The Yangtze delta

The Yangtze delta, which begins beyond Zhenjiang, consists of a large number of branches, tributaries, lakes, ancient riverbeds, and marshes that are connected with the main channel. During major floods the delta area is completely submerged. Lake Tai, with an area of about 930 square miles (2,410 square km), is notable as the largest of the many lakes in the delta. The width of the Yangtze in the delta, as far as the city of Jiangyin, ranges from less than 1 mile to almost 2 miles (1.6 to 3.2 km); farther downstream the channel gradually widens and becomes a large estuary, the width of which exceeds 50 miles (80 km) near the mouth of the river. Major cities in the delta include Wuxi, Suzhou, and, at the river’s mouth, Shanghai.
Navigation

The Yangtze is the principal navigable waterway of China. Along the river for 1,700 miles (2,700 km) there is intensive cargo and passenger traffic. The river serves as a continuation of the sea routes, binding the inland and coastal ports together with other major cities into a transportation network in which Nanjing, Wuhan, and Chongqing play the leading roles. Motorized junks, other powered vessels, and a small number of sail craft are widely used for transporting cargo. Because of the ship locks at the Three Gorges Dam, large ships of up to 10,000 tons can travel as far upriver as Chongqing. Water routes in the Yangtze basin total about 35,000 miles (56,300 km). The Yangtze is joined to navigable stretches of the Huang He and the Huai, Wei, and Hai rivers by the Grand Canal, which is further connected with the seaports of Hangzhou and Tianjin.

So its technically possible to sail to Nanking, it wouldnt be a fun trip.

[konevkovskiy]

from wiki :Japanese takeover

On January 28, 1932, the Japanese attacked the Chinese nationalists around Shanghai. Around midnight, Japanese carrier aircraft bombed the city in the first major aircraft carrier action in the Far East. Three thousand Japanese troops proceeded to attack various targets, such as train stations, around the city. From 1931 to 1933, the cruiser Tenryū was assigned to patrol the Yangtze River and was thus in combat during the January 28 Incident at Shanghai in 1932. The Battle of Shanghai of 1937 was the first of the twenty-two major engagements fought between the National Revolutionary Army, Republic of China and the Imperial Japanese Army, Empire of Japan during the Second Sino-Japanese War. It was one of the largest and bloodiest battles of the entire war. On August 13, 1937, the Japanese and Chinese exchanged fire in Shanghai in the ongoing war. The Chinese 88th Division retaliated with mortar attacks. Sporadic shooting continued through the day until 4pm, when the Japanese headquarters ordered the naval ships of the Third Fleet, stationed in the Yangtze and the Huangpu River to open fire on Chinese positions in the city. In the late night of August 13, Chiang Kai-shek ordered Zhang Zhizhong to begin the Chinese offensive the next day. On August 22, the Japanese 3rd, 8th, and 11th Divisions made an amphibious assault under cover from naval bombardments and proceeded to land in Chuanshakou (川沙口), Shizilin (獅子林), and Baoshan (寶山), towns on the northeast coast some fifty kilometers away from downtown Shanghai. Japanese landings in northeast Shanghai suburban areas meant that many Chinese troops, who were deployed in Shanghai's urban center, had to be redeployed to coastal regions to counter the landings.


HMS Moth as captured IJN Suma in 1942
The Japanese navy shelled Shanghai from its warships. It used ships to support the Army in Shanghai and Nanking. A task force of over 100 ships was used to move forces upriver and take Hankow (now Wuhan) in the summer of 1938. Japanese aircraft sank two Chinese naval cruisers guarding the river during these actions.

With the Japanese advance into the east coast of China in 1937, enterprises and numerous people withdrew from Wuhan to the west and Sichuan. The Kuomintang navy undertook the responsibility of defending the Yangtze River and covering the withdrawal. On 24 October, while patrolling the waters of the Yangtze River near the town of Jinkou, in Wuchang (Jiangxia, Wuhan), the Zhongshan was bombed by six Japanese aircraft . The aircraft dived, strafed and bombed the Zhongshan. Despite shooting down two of the aircraft, the Zhongshan eventually sank due to the serious damage she had sustained. Twenty-five Chinese officers and soldiers were killed in the battle

No idea if I did this right, but interesting info that seems poignant.

KK

[MakeeLearn]

Warships on the Yangtze
or is that... up the Yangtze

http://thehmsconsort.co.uk/hms_concord_plaque.htm

[Canoerebel]

Hey, "epic escape" sounds interesting. I have no idea what that's referring to. I'll read later today, as time permits. Thanks for the tip.

[MakeeLearn]

Imperial Japanese Navy Warships Fire Artillery During Landings At Liuho, Lotien - North of Shanghai

https://www.pond5.com/stock-footage/794 ... andin.html

[MakeeLearn]

Advance On Hankow (1938)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7XHhRygdWU

BRITISH WARSHIPS SHELLED ON YANGTZE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXvS_gMeo2g

[MakeeLearn]

The real Sand Pebbles

[adarbrauner]

The Amethist under heavy shelling

https://youtu.be/hc9tOWtmjf4

Nice MOVIE!

[MakeeLearn]

ORIGINAL: adarbrauner

The Amethist under heavy shelling

https://youtu.be/hc9tOWtmjf4

Nice MOVIE!

Yes, good movie.

"The real HMS Amethyst was used at the start of filming. A special effects explosion was made too big and blew a hole in the hull, flooding the engine room. Amethyst was sent to the breakers and HMS Magpie was used for the rest of the film."

"HMS Amethyst sustained more damage during filming than during the actual battle."

"The River Orwell, which runs between Felixstowe and Ipswich, in Suffolk, England doubled as the Yangtze River during the making of this film.


"The black-and-white feline seen aboard the Amethyst represents "Able Seacat" Simon, the ship's cat who became a celebrity after receiving the PDSA's Dickin Medal (at the behest of Lt. Cmdr. Kerans) for morale raising, despatching a rat infestation and surviving cannon shell injuries. The entire Amethyst crew attended his funeral in 1949 following his death of a viral infection caused by his war wounds."

[JeffroK]

Its nice to educate some yanquis.