Why the hosing of international customers?

[Fallschirmjager]

Yeah, I bought a game from Battlefront, and it was shipped from Ireland (shipping cost $7). Having said that, I actually still prefer to buy from high street stores. I like browsing among the titles and comparing prices between stores. This is how I've bought my games for the last twenty-odd years. Old habits die hard. It's a form of gentle exercise, as well!

Hyphz. I'm fortunate as far as GAME stores go. There are three of them in Newcastle (within a couple of hundred yards of each other!) and one in the Metrocentre. There are also numerous other games stores in this area. A CHIPS store has recently opened in Consett. This is the first dedicated games shop we've ever had! Videogaming must be really popular at the moment.

Buying directly from Matrix give them a MUCH

[Fallschirmjager]

Yeah, I bought a game from Battlefront, and it was shipped from Ireland (shipping cost $7). Having said that, I actually still prefer to buy from high street stores. I like browsing among the titles and comparing prices between stores. This is how I've bought my games for the last twenty-odd years. Old habits die hard. It's a form of gentle exercise, as well!

Hyphz. I'm fortunate as far as GAME stores go. There are three of them in Newcastle (within a couple of hundred yards of each other!) and one in the Metrocentre. There are also numerous other games stores in this area. A CHIPS store has recently opened in Consett. This is the first dedicated games shop we've ever had! Videogaming must be really popular at the moment.

Buying directly from Matrix give them a MUCH larger cut of the profits from the games sale

[Paul Vebber]

Very true! ANd we are very appreciative of those that do!

But we understand everyone doesn't have the luxury, so we provide as many options as we can to get games into players hands.

interestingly based on past polls about 25% of you are "hard core" fans that go out of your way to support us. About 65% of you are the "silent majority" that does what you can and the 10% that is left seem to REALLY dislike us.

Interestingly that "disenchanted 10%" seems to be the case with other wargame companies too.

Are you the same 10%???

just kidding

Have we just P'd you off? or is there any hope of reclaiming you?

[Fallschirmjager]

If you please 100% your doing something wrong

I think a Euro Matrix office would be a good idea

You might take a hit when first starting it up.....but you would gain it back later

North America and Europe are going to be the largest markets

Might I also suggest a Canadian warehouse for our friends up north?

[Les_the_Sarge_9_1]

Ya Canadian Warehouse, you can store them right here in my shed Paul

[StrategyCat]

We´re not screwing anybody here.

I didn't say you were. What I wrote was:

and not come off as screwing their customers

come off = appear to = look like = give the impression, etc., etc.

Our shipping and handling is $8.95 and you get a trackable shipment that protects both us and you.

USPS would probably be cheaper and they also offer package tracking. I had this discussion over the weekend with David Heath who claimed that the USPS does not offer tracking. Apparently, he hasn't been to the post office in a couple of years.
Here's the front page to their website, which clearly has a 'Track& Confirm' option: http://www.usps.com/welcome.htm?from=gl ... =0001home2

We also offer phone orders that neither battlefront or HPS offer as far as we can tell.

I can't tell if Battlefront does (it does't look like it), but HPS does, although it's not toll free (big deal).

We also offer our products through retail which HPS does not do.

Granted, but we're not discussing retail. We are discussing your charging exorbitant shipping fees to those customers who are gracious enough to buy directly from you in order to support you better.

Actually its battlefornt that doesn't calculate your shipping charge until you "proceed to check out".

At the bottom of their products page it says 'Review our Ordering Options and Sales Policy Page', which is a link to a page that details shipping charges. Yes, it's in small print, but it's there. Customers can view that page and see their shipping cost *before* choosing which products to buy and long before they get to the check out counter.
HPS of course clearly lists their shipping charges at the very top of the purchasing page. Once again, customers can see their shipping costs before they decide what or if to buy.

USPS only gets the package to the country, the local postal system takes it from there.

So? What's your point? I'm aware that many foreign postal services have theft problems, but once again, it should be the customers choice to use it or not.

Your implication that you don't see the shipping cost until AFTER you check out is simply untrue.

I never implied that, and to think anyone would is absurd. Of course shipping charges are not revealed only after checkout, as that would be nothing short of fraud. What I wrote was:

Here, you don't find out about the $66 shipping cost to your hut in Botswana, Africa until you get to the cash register.

"...until you get to the cash register..." not after you check out.

You see it and can choose among options right from the shopping cart before you even get to the screen that asks for your credit card.

Options? What options? People overseas *have no* options. They are forced to ship with FedEx and pay an exorbitant rate. I went through all the continents the other day and I don't remember there being a single one (other than USA domestic and Canada) that offers any "options".
Lets forget about Botswana and look at Europe. How many shipping options are there for Europe? Answer: One, FedEx at $43.

If you want to bitch - feel free. But please don't misrepresent our operation in doing so.

I haven't misrepresented anything. It is you who is misquoting me and thereby misrepresenting what I wrote.

OK, enough of this. You folks are set in your ways and that's that. In my opinion, if SSG were smart they'd sell their games themselves, just like BFC and HPS are doing.

[Marc von Martial]

In my opinion, if SSG were smart they'd sell their games themselves

Aha, and what leads you to that?

[Blunderbuss]

Buying directly from Matrix give them a MUCH larger cut of the profits from the games sale

Hmm. e.g. Korsun Pocket bought online. $49.99 + $8.95 (I think?) shipping. Total Price $58.94. Converted to £37.40, with several days delay for delivery.

Alternative. Fifteen minute drive to Metrocentre. £29.99 from GAME. Maybe trade in an old PS2 game (after blowing off the dust ). Get loyalty points on card. Ten day no-quibble refund policy, so if I don't like it, back it goes.

I really AM on a limited budget. If I want to buy something, I look around for the best deal. Besides, Matrix will still make a profit on the sale, regardless of where I buy it from.

Another thing. Before I found this (and Battlefront's) site, I hadn't really considered the notion of supporting an individual games publisher. This is a new concept for me to deal with.

[Pawlock]

Hmm. e.g. Korsun Pocket bought online. $49.99 + $8.95 (I think?) shipping. Total Price $59.94. Converted to £37.40, with several days delay for delivery.

Alternative. Fifteen minute drive to Metrocentre. £29.99 from GAME. Maybe trade in an old PS2 game (after blowing off the dust ). Get loyalty points on card. Ten day no-quibble refund policy, so if I don't like it, back it goes.

I really AM on a limited budget. If I want to buy something, I look around for the best deal. Besides, Matrix will still make a profit on the sale, regardless of where I buy it from.

Another thing. Before I found this (and Battlefront's) site, I hadn't really considered the notion of supporting an individual games publisher. This is a new concept for me to deal with.

Shoukd have tried Duchet games, £26.99 + £1.00p&p within UK.

[Blunderbuss]

Shoukd have tried Duchet games, £26.99 + £1.00p&p within UK.

Korsun Pocket was just an example. I haven't bought it (yet). :rolleyes:

[Hertston]

Hmm. e.g. Korsun Pocket bought online. $49.99 + $8.95 (I think?) shipping. Total Price $58.94. Converted to £37.40, with several days delay for delivery.

You forgot the import VAT (tax, to not EU folks) you will get stung for when it arrives - that's another tenner you will either get billed for later (courier) or have to pay before you get your package (post).

The Matrix distributors in the UK, Just-Play, provide a very good service IMHO, reasonable prices and release not long after that in the US. For once, the £30 price tag for KP compares very favourably.

Battlefront provide a reasonable service provided they havn't signed a distribution deal with bloody cdv for the game concerned. If that's the case, you get a censored (Wafflegrenadiers, anybody ?) game with .pdf manual months late. Which I wouldn't mind, if Battlefront would still sell direct - but they now refuse to ship to Europe anything that .cdv have licensed.

HPS ship cheap (mail, but it still arrives in 3-4 days), but you still get stuck with the VAT. There's a couple of Euro retailers who distribute their stuff with minimal P&P costs, though.

Interesting point on supporting individual publishers. I certainly look very closely at all Matrix games even if I don't get all of them, and you do come across some interesting stuff that way that you wouldn't normally consider. I'd never have bought ToS:WS if anyone else had published it, and for some reason the Fading Suns game appeals - not normally my sort of thing. Squad Assault and Highway to the Reich I'd have bought anyway having played their previous non-Matrix incarnations. I hope Highway gets better exposure from Matrix than Battlefront gave Airborne Assault - AA is easily the best computer wargame I've ever played, and that includes Combat Mission 1&2, Uncommon Valor and now Korsun Pocket. Sad so few of the BF "combat zombies" ever tried it.

[Firefly]

I've found that with Game (or EB to call them by their real name) is that the selection of PC games varies with the size of shop, we have two here in Kingston (all of 200 yards apart), the smaller seems to cater more for console gamers and doesn't have KP or Titans of Steel yet. The larger has plenty of copies of both, although admittedly neither made it to the 'New Releases' shelf. What always amuses me is all their products have a 'Lowest Price Guarantee' sticker, when often the same game is different prices in the two shops.

The reason why 'Just Play' reverts to 'Just Flight' when you order is that they are a sub-section of 'Just Flight', who are better known for their MS Flight Sim add-ons.

Of course I only found out that there was a British/Euro version of UV two weeks after I'd paid 40 quid in a shop that specialises in imports. I got a nice cardboard box though.

[Blunderbuss]

I hope Highway gets better exposure from Matrix than Battlefront gave Airborne Assault - AA is easily the best computer wargame I've ever played, and that includes Combat Mission 1&2, Uncommon Valor and now Korsun Pocket. Sad so few of the BF "combat zombies" ever tried it.

I've definitely seen Airborne Assault on the shelves. Every time I go into GAME it seems to have a different price on it. So it's really good, eh? I'll nab it next time it's in their sale!

[Paul Vebber]

What I wrote was:

What you wrote was:

Furthermore, both of these companies have their various shipping costs clearly stated *before* you get to check out, unlike this place.

You clearly are trying to make it look like we were doing something those companies were not, when infact we let you set the shipping cost in the 'shopping cart' before you go to check out.

Your protestations show you are simply trying to muck rake and have little constructive to offer other than "you know better" than us rubes.

Since you have talked to David and you are apparently an expert in international supply chain management, I'll shut up until the company you start-up drives us out of business.

[Les_the_Sarge_9_1]

Hey Paul you have likely heard the oft mangled expression "the proof is in the pudding" right?

The correct expression is of course "the proof of the pudding is in the taste"

The proof of Matrix Games is in their games

I have never regretted any connection with Matrix Games, nor regretted anything I have gotten from them.

There will always be a loud vocal minority angry about something. I just ignore them.

[Paul Vebber]

Ya, that 10% that every company has that seems to hate their guts just makes you want do something generic like open a bakery or something some mornings...

[StrategyCat]

You clearly are trying to make it look like we were doing something those companies were not, when infact we let you set the shipping cost in the 'shopping cart' before you go to check out.

Let me further clarify my point. My point is, as a consumer, it would benefit me to know the shipping costs and policies *before* I browse around a company's website filling up my shopping cart - understand?

In other words, it would be nice to know ahead of time what the shipping costs and policies are, because if I know it will cost me $65 to have something shipped to me in Africa, then I will likely not waste my time looking at your "E-Store" in the first place - understand?

This is especially true since most people who go to your E-Store are well aware that your games can be had cheaper elsewhere - and know where else to look for them. I would guess that a good percentage of people who bother to buy directly from you (as I did, last week) only do so because they prefer to support you directly, which is to your benefit.

And what do you do in appreciation for these people? You *screw* them at the last possible moment, just before they give their credit card number, with exorbitant shipping rates.

Yes, I know you obviously show the shipping cost prior to check out - but it's *just prior*, after people have already spent time browsing your E-Store.
It is only *after* people have spent the time filling up their shopping cart that the exorbitant shipping rates are revealed, which makes me wonder not only how many people decide not to buy at that point, but how many people are ****** off at having spent their time browsing your E-Store to begin with.

This is the point then, that you are socking people with exorbitant shipping rates at the last possible moment, just before they give their cradit card numbers, which I would guess pisses many of them off to the extend that they don't buy.

My point is not hard to understand, if you take your blinders off for a second.

[Les_the_Sarge_9_1]

It boggles me to even try to comprehend you StrategyCat.

In the words of the sgt major from the film The Seige of Firebase Gloria...

"you are in dire need of a blowjob"

Oh my god you spent some of your precious life browsing an e-store and were only informed of the shipping cost at the last moment. Such a hideous tragedy.

You might do yourself a favour and cut up your credit card, discontinue your online service, and stop wasting your precious life.

[Hertston]

The problem is that GAME, like an awful lot of stores, simply won't put them on shelves as long as Just Play aren't paying through the nose for shelf space (which I can certainly understand they wouldn't want to). They use the space for the ones who did pay, and fill up with old stock for sale.

I did buy Titans of Steel; KP wasn't there, but I've mail ordered it from Just Play (who seem to mysteriously change their name to Just Flight when you order from them.. um, ok).

We have three GAME stores in Plymouth too (including one stuck away in a corner in Debenhams, and the former EB). On release day I found one copy of KP in the largest (which I bought) and two copies of KP in the ex-EB (one of which I also bought) - that was it, no copies anywhere else. GAME has really gone downhill lately.. hyphz is right about the shelf space. Judging from the blurb they sent out recently to loyalty card holders they have this deal with EA, which is great is you want BF1942 or the Sims - otherwise forget it.

"Just Play" is a recent offshoot of "Just Flight".. they only distributed flightsim add-ons until recently, but wanted to expand into other areas. I'm very happy with their distribution of Matrix games so far, you can always order online if you can't get them in the store, prices (for once) compare very favorably with the US, and we get the games only a short time after the US release. We even get halfway-decent manuals considering the DVD box restriction everybody is forced into these days. It's infinitely better for UK customers than the goddamawful Battlefront/CDV arrangement.