chemical arty/trench warfare

[mathiaswargamefan]

hello,

again no chemical weapons in the game? it must be included! and also real trench war how it was on the western front.

mathias

[1775Cerberus]

I would say they are in an abstract way. Remember that you are dealing with 25 mile hexes. Corps of infantry and cavalry. Squadrons of ships. Chemicals used are just a fraction of the frontage of that 25 mile hex. At best a Brigade frontage of that Corps. They are most certainly there, however at a level of use or command that is several layers below you.

[Hartmann]

Chemical warfare was/is particularily disgusting and thus I don't know how I'd feel about its concrete inclusion - I know this isn't a particularily "good" argument as atomic bombs and strategic bombing of cities as against civilians should be even more disturbing and is still a staple of WW2 strategy games. Anyway, as chemical warfare was basically used in the same role as heavy artillery shelling in preparation of a breakthrough it might be abstractly represented by an artillery upgrade level. Also, I think it was most effective in the very beginning when it came as a surprise, so there might be something like an event representing it.

[mathiaswargamefan]

the "25 mile argument" is then the same problem with arty or rockets, it hit in reality only a small area of the hex....

and the western front trench war is not included, so how it was, unfortunately..

[xwormwood]

In a way one could argue that this is included in infantry and artillery techs.

One solution could be to offer "one-time" tech advances, to be used in a single combat of choice.
Ted Raicers "The Great War in Europe" used a chit-pull procedure to offer players some chemcal weapons and flame throwers. If the player was lucky to pull such a chit during the chit pull phase, he could use it to enhance one combat result. But only as long as he was the first player to use this specific gas, like chlorine. Once your opponent used "his" chlorine first, your own chit became worthless, as these weapons only offered a short time bonus, after which all war parties adjusted their forces accordingly.

I like this chit pull phase very much, it was a brilliant way to enhance the game play.

[xwormwood]

Why do say that the western front trench war is not included?
Have you played the game?

Or do you try to tell that the first SC WW1 game didn't offer a historical accurate trench experience?
If yes, you might want to drop a few lines why you feel this way.

[Hartmann]

ORIGINAL: xwormwood

In a way one could argue that this is included in infantry and artillery techs.

One solution could be to offer "one-time" tech advances, to be used in a single combat of choice.
Ted Raicers "The Great War in Europe" used a chit-pull procedure to offer players some chemcal weapons and flame throwers. If the player was lucky to pull such a chit during the chit pull phase, he could use it to enhance one combat result. But only as long as he was the first player to use this specific gas, like chlorine. Once your opponent used "his" chlorine first, your own chit became worthless, as these weapons only offered a short time bonus, after which all war parties adjusted their forces accordingly.

I like this chit pull phase very much, it was a brilliant way to enhance the game play.

Yeah, because of the initial surprise effect a "one time advantage" would probably be the best solution - in this engine probably via event for the first player reaching and using a certain artillery upgrade level.

[1775Cerberus]

After a bit further thought I think that you could add Chemical Warfare as a separate research tree. Level one could give a 0-3% chance of moral reduction. Level two could give 3-6% reduction. While level 3 could give 6-10% reduction. It allows players to pursue chemical warfare to add to the effectiveness of artillery bombardments, but may or may not pay off on a corps level game.

[Xsillione]

Simple solution: included into infantry tech.
Little better one: events, asking you to use it or not, if used, it reduces the enemy units next to your a bit, with chance of diplomatic cost.
Somewhat better: Separate tech, cheaper and faster than normal infantry, but cancels out each other, so only your advantage matters.
Proper one: Separate tech and improvement for units, with toggle to use it or just have the defensive part (cancelling out enemy tech), and if used, it can have ramifications.

Probably the first one will be used, if they want to sell the game in some countries and not have any backlash.