OT: Good book recommendations for newcomers

[dr.hal]

Wow some really good spot on recommendations. Now NOT being an "old salt" but a new pepper, I would agree with the Toll trilogy starting with the "Pacific Crucible" and I would certainly add the "Shattered Sword" for an in-depth look at the events leading up to Midway and then the battle. On the start of the war and to get a feel for just how lopsided the whole western part of the Pacific was, I would agree with "The Fleet that the Gods Forgot". Unfortunately there seems to be a lack of books that concentrate on the Japanese in the opening months of the war that would complement the gods forgotten fleet. As a final thought, and certainly one of the reasons I am involved in this game as opposed to countless others, is that it DOES teach a player a lot about the Pacific theater in World War Two. Although I think reading books greatly compliments that experience, I don't think it's a prerequisite.

[Chickenboy]

ORIGINAL: dr.hal
Unfortunately there seems to be a lack of books that concentrate on the Japanese in the opening months of the war that would complement the gods forgotten fleet.

John III, how does Kaigun do in addressing this issue? I recall that you purchased and read that book a few years back.

[Anachro]

The noted military scholar H.P. Willmott wrote a decent book on Japanese and Allied strategies in the Philippines/DEI from the outbreak of war to April 1942. It was written in '82 though.

Empires in the Balance: Japanese and Allied Pacific Strategies to April 1942

@John Not sure, I'd have to go back and find the article. It was posted on these very forums in some thread here in the General section a while back.

[Anachro]

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
John III, how does Kaigun do in addressing this issue? I recall that you purchased and read that book a few years back.

Kaigun deals less with the war itself and more with the Japanese preparations and naval development, in capabilities, doctrine, and strategy, leading up to the outbreak of war (i.e. from the modernization of the IJN in the 1890s, through the Sino and Russo Wars, up to '41). So it doesn't go into much detail about Japanese efforts in the early war itself.

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: dr.hal

Unfortunately there seems to be a lack of books that concentrate on the Japanese in the opening months of the war that would complement the gods forgotten fleet.

warspite1

Well Rising Sun mentioned above is a pretty good place to start (although probably not if you want something strictly comparable to TFTTGF). But for a more high level view from the Japanese side from Manchuria onwards.

[rustysi]

Rising Sun, Falling Skies (Java Campaign)

Good book on a largely uncovered aspect of the opening moves.

Also recommend Forgotten Ally.

Covers the 'mess' that is China pretty well. Don't look for battles so much as the intrigues of the theater.

[rustysi]

ORIGINAL: philabos

Ian W Toll trilogy starts with Pacific Crucible, final book due out next year.

Was waiting for the final one to tackle all.

[rustysi]

What's Pacific Crucible about?

About 600 pages(?)

[rustysi]

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I'm proud (in a weirdly masochistic way) to say that I haven't read a single book on Warspite's list.

What's wrong with his list? I read a few of them.

[philabos]

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

ORIGINAL: philabos

Ian W Toll trilogy starts with Pacific Crucible, final book due out next year.

What's Pacific Crucible about?

The start of the war, 1941-42.
Toll spends some time on the personalities. One tale I found fascinating was the Nimitz appointment to CincPac.
King was anxious to get him from Washington to PH and lined up air transport. Nimitz refused and decided to take the train to the west coast, using the time to get his act together.

[BBfanboy]

Other than that, did Nimitz and King work well together? I've never heard about any conflict or amity between them.

[dr.hal]

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

Other than that, did Nimitz and King work well together? I've never heard about any conflict or amity between them.

I'm not sure ANYONE worked well with King, everything I've read about the man suggests he was very "difficult" to get along with and certainly didn't make "friends"! But I don't recall any open hostility between the two. I can't remember where it was (thus no reference) but I remember reading that Nimitz didn't like King at all...however there was respect... that's about it.

[Lokasenna]

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

ORIGINAL: philabos

Ian W Toll trilogy starts with Pacific Crucible, final book due out next year.

What's Pacific Crucible about?

The first 6 months of the war for the US Navy, specifically the Pacific.

It was very good.

I'm only a little ways into the Conquering Tide, which is part 2. Which is a shame, but I've just been reading less.



On topic, I always bring up the Campaign for Guadalcanal, but Jack Coggins, as a good one to read. Lots of bonus technical illustrations and maps, too - I think done by Mr. Coggins, who was an ace illustrator. I got a used copy on eBay a long time ago, and a while back I saw one floating around in a local used book store but it's been gone from there for a year or so maybe.

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: rustysi

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I'm proud (in a weirdly masochistic way) to say that I haven't read a single book on Warspite's list.

What's wrong with his list? I read a few of them.

warspite1

I'm sure you have rustysi. Each to their own but its strange (to me) for one to have a keen interest in the game/Pacific War and not to have read any of those books, but as I say, each to their own.

I've been picked up on producing a collection and not a single book as per the OP's direction. Fair enough.

I think if I had to pick a single book for newcomers to read alongside starting out on this game then it would need to be a book that covers the entire war so that the reader/player has at least a high level understanding of what happened when, why, and how things panned out the way it did. On that basis I would have to go with Rising Sun.

Tolland's work is not the 'best' book on the list I provided (Shattered Sword and Guadalcanal take those prizes (in that order) and there are other books that could easily have made the list but I left them off as they are individual battle-centred and so too specific - Road of Bones (Keane) about Kohima and Shame of Savo (Loxton) about the Savo naval battle being two more excellent and recommended tomes. Shattered Sword gets around that single battle limitation and makes my list due to the additional insight the authors give about Japanese (and American) operating procedure.

However if I am about to embark on the game (and the title of the thread is "Good book recommendations for newcomers"), then my recommendation would have to be a book that gives the overall picture of the Pacific War. Having an in-depth knowledge of Japanese carrier doctrine or the RN contribution to the war would seem of limited value if I don't know the bigger picture and basics such as what happened when.

But I guess that reflects the way I've always read about subjects in history. Start with a high level work, an overview so I have some context of what was happening when and then, if I like the subject, I start to drill down further.

[fcooke]

I now have a hankering to re-read Shattered Sword.....

[obvert]

ORIGINAL: philabos

Ian W Toll trilogy starts with Pacific Crucible, final book due out next year.

+1

Very good and detailed examination.

I'd add Fortress Against the Sun: The B-17 Flying Fortress in the Pacific; Gene Eric Salacker and Rising Sun, Falling Skies by Jeffrey Cox which both detail the beginning of the war from the Allied perspective. It's a good primer to the start of any grand campaign to remember why the beginning wen the way it did, and what you can do )perhaps) to improve that , for either side. [;)]

[spence]

A great book dealing with surface (nighttime) combat: Guadalcanal Decision at Sea by Eric Hammel

Since it's now 0609 6 December here but it's already 7 December in Japan an interesting book would be : A Long Days Journey Into War which examines the day that Japan attacked Pearl Harbor from the first moment it was Dec 7th 1941 (near Midway) until the last moment it was Dec 7th 1941 (also near Midway) all over the world.

[rsallen64]

I have read and/or own most of the books in Warspite's list, and agree with his recommendations. Toland's Rising Sun is a great overall view of the entire war, as is John Costello's Pacific War, which I would heartily recommend. I did read Cox's book but honestly, I had some issues with it. I thought he did a great job of covering a topic that is largely passed over in the history books, and he does so in great detail, but I thought his constant berating of the Allied commanders and their decision-making, while somewhat justified, overlooked the fact they were operating with very limited resources and in a very constrained political environment. He made his point and that's fine, but he hammered it in over and over again to the point I decided to forego purchasing his Guadalcanal book, even though that's my favorite campaign. H.P. Wilmott's first two books cover the first months of the war very well, from both sides, and Lundstrom's First South Pacific Campaign is great as well.

[AW1Steve]

I own pretty much all the books that have been mentioned here , and I agree that they are all great. But before you go specialized , a good general history is called for , to put each of them in their respective places. I love Wilmott , but would recommend for your very 1st book , The Eagle and the Sun by Spector. A truly great , easy to read general overall history. [:)]

[Chickenboy]

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I own pretty much all the books that have been mentioned here , and I agree that they are all great. But before you go specialized , a good general history is called for , to put each of them in their respective places. I love Wilmott , but would recommend for your very 1st book , The Eagle and the Sun by Spector. A truly great , easy to read general overall history. [:)]

Coming from you, Steve, that's a powerful recommendation. I [sheepishly] confess that I haven't read that book, but will be putting it on my Amazon list for Christmas. [8D]