The Rarity Follies
Moderator: MOD_SPWaW
The Rarity Follies
OK, how come when rarity is on I can get German tanks with one color scheme but the same tank with another color scheme is unavailable?
Retreat is NOT an option.
Because the German camo color scheme is only available from 43 to 49.....gray is available all the time. By default, the game selects the camo color units from 43 on.
Which helps explain why there is no room in the German OOB....all those duplicate units just to have a "neat" color scheme... :rolleyes: :p
Which helps explain why there is no room in the German OOB....all those duplicate units just to have a "neat" color scheme... :rolleyes: :p
Nice answer. But doesn't that give Germany a workaround to rarity? I am just wondering?Originally posted by Flashfyre:
Because the German camo color scheme is only available from 43 to 49.....gray is available all the time. By default, the game selects the camo color units from 43 on.
Which helps explain why there is no room in the German OOB....all those duplicate units just to have a "neat" color scheme... :rolleyes: :p
regards,
sven
[ June 17, 2001: Message edited by: sven ]
Does this mean the gray tanks are unavailable after 43? Otherwise it seems the player would have a decided advantage in getting tanks.Originally posted by Flashfyre:
Because the German camo color scheme is only available from 43 to 49.....gray is available all the time. By default, the game selects the camo color units from 43 on.
:p
Retreat is NOT an option.
No, REMF...as far as I can tell, the gray color tracks are still available after 43. And I think the rarity factors are the same for both. Which would mean a decided advantage for purchases....for example, I was doing a random battle in Sep. 1943 with German vs Soviet forces....selected a PzGrndr platoon, and guess what...after buying the first one (in all camo), the armed halftrack became unavailable. But not the gray color one. So my second platoon has camo basic halftracks and a gray armed one. 
Seems kinda unfair, doesn't it? I mean, if I can buy an "unavailable" unit just because it has a different paint sceme, but my opponent rares out on his M3 halftracks, he has to buy another model. Same thing with the PzIIIL...two colors, so one might be "red" while the other is still "green".
Things that make you say "Hmmmmmmmmm....."
Seems kinda unfair, doesn't it? I mean, if I can buy an "unavailable" unit just because it has a different paint sceme, but my opponent rares out on his M3 halftracks, he has to buy another model. Same thing with the PzIIIL...two colors, so one might be "red" while the other is still "green".
Things that make you say "Hmmmmmmmmm....."
"Hmmmmmmmmm...." indeed, Flash! Or even perhaps an emphatic "IT'S NOT FAIR OR RIGHT AND SHOULD BE CORRECTED!"Originally posted by Flashfyre:
No, REMF...as far as I can tell, the gray color tracks are still available after 43. And I think the rarity factors are the same for both. Which would mean a decided advantage for purchases....for example, I was doing a random battle in Sep. 1943 with German vs Soviet forces....selected a PzGrndr platoon, and guess what...after buying the first one (in all camo), the armed halftrack became unavailable. But not the gray color one. So my second platoon has camo basic halftracks and a gray armed one.
Seems kinda unfair, doesn't it? I mean, if I can buy an "unavailable" unit just because it has a different paint sceme, but my opponent rares out on his M3 halftracks, he has to buy another model. Same thing with the PzIIIL...two colors, so one might be "red" while the other is still "green".
Things that make you say "Hmmmmmmmmm....."
Retreat is NOT an option.
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Paul Vebber
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IF you don't like the OOB's you have an editor to change them. If you don't like how rarity works turn it off.
This game is like a tool kit. We give you the ability to do what ever you want.
Delete the camoed or grey vehicels if you don't like them, change the costs, what ever you want.
No matter what we change some folks will not like what we change it to, so we give you the ability to change it!
Now we are working on a new game that will have fixes to a lot fo the underlying problems in the SP OOB data format.
We can chase our tail constantly trying to tweak the old ones, or make something new.
We have decided to do the latter!
So now its time for those out there who think they can do better in the OOB department to actually give it a shot.
We got started in the modding biz becasue we thought we could do better than what was there. Well now is time as we move on to devote our time to a new game, for those who think they can do better than we did on the OOBs to step up and show everybody what they can do.
We've given you the tools and options to play it how you want, but we don't have the time to work on the new and constantly fiddle with the old.
Organize yourselves, get a group going. We can answer questions. We will continue to fix bugs (but not extensively until we get the new game going). We have put everything we can into SP:WaW, now is the time when those who don't like the OOB's to look at how they would do it better.
That is how we got started and if we are going to move ahead, then a new group of folks is going to have to step up and take the torch.
We will continue to offer SP:WaW for free, we will continnue to support it the best we can (with bug fixes periodically), but there is only so much we can do for a game that is free. Especially when it comes to things like OOB arguments where everybody is free to do what they want to tweak them to their fancy.
[ June 17, 2001: Message edited by: Paul Vebber ]
This game is like a tool kit. We give you the ability to do what ever you want.
Delete the camoed or grey vehicels if you don't like them, change the costs, what ever you want.
No matter what we change some folks will not like what we change it to, so we give you the ability to change it!
Now we are working on a new game that will have fixes to a lot fo the underlying problems in the SP OOB data format.
We can chase our tail constantly trying to tweak the old ones, or make something new.
We have decided to do the latter!
So now its time for those out there who think they can do better in the OOB department to actually give it a shot.
We got started in the modding biz becasue we thought we could do better than what was there. Well now is time as we move on to devote our time to a new game, for those who think they can do better than we did on the OOBs to step up and show everybody what they can do.
We've given you the tools and options to play it how you want, but we don't have the time to work on the new and constantly fiddle with the old.
Organize yourselves, get a group going. We can answer questions. We will continue to fix bugs (but not extensively until we get the new game going). We have put everything we can into SP:WaW, now is the time when those who don't like the OOB's to look at how they would do it better.
That is how we got started and if we are going to move ahead, then a new group of folks is going to have to step up and take the torch.
We will continue to offer SP:WaW for free, we will continnue to support it the best we can (with bug fixes periodically), but there is only so much we can do for a game that is free. Especially when it comes to things like OOB arguments where everybody is free to do what they want to tweak them to their fancy.
[ June 17, 2001: Message edited by: Paul Vebber ]
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Paul Vebber
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You and your opponent should have the same ones. You can exchange them with the game files.
If you don't the "secure" mode will give an indication, but will no longer end the game. The online game requires the same OOBs - every time I have exchanged them with an opponant it has worked.
unsecure games don't care.
If you don't the "secure" mode will give an indication, but will no longer end the game. The online game requires the same OOBs - every time I have exchanged them with an opponant it has worked.
unsecure games don't care.
Thanks for the info, Paul. As for me, I'll just play the German side whenever possible since I don't think I'd be able to get my various opponents to accept any OOB balancing I might do one my own.Originally posted by Paul Vebber:
IF you don't like the OOB's you have an editor to change them. If you don't like how rarity works turn it off.
So now its time for those out there who think they can do better in the OOB department to actually give it a shot.
[ June 17, 2001: Message edited by: REMF ]
Retreat is NOT an option.
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Panzer Leo
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Hi Bud !
Was thinking of our little discussion on this toppic and when I read your post here, I took a closer look at the true troop costs.
Well, I think I have to apologize, I was wrong
When you told me the Kings were to low in cost, I just took a look at the costs displayed in the purchase screen, but didn't actually buy them and calculate, what real costs they had. So the display for a King in '45 is 163, but when you buy it,it's only 122
Also, I do not understand, why the bonus of the elite-formation does not add to the costs ? A Panther of a regular formation costs as much as a Panther from a elite one. As the true troop costs are based on the experience of the crew, this seems not to be right. I tested the steps of the cost adjustment for the King, setting the historics off and the troop quality manually. 70 is the zero-level where the true costs meet the set ones in the OOB (202 for King). I went down 5 exp. points and the display in the buy-menue tells me 190 (sounds pretty reasonable to me - the costs I would expect). Then I purchase the King and the real costs are 142. A drop of 60 points ??? Why not the displayed 190 ???
Like it is now, I have to say sorry, I'm on your side now and the Kings are defenetily to low cost (the other stuff is aswell, 'cause it affects everything) :rolleyes:
Someone got a clue what's happening here ?
Was thinking of our little discussion on this toppic and when I read your post here, I took a closer look at the true troop costs.
Well, I think I have to apologize, I was wrong
When you told me the Kings were to low in cost, I just took a look at the costs displayed in the purchase screen, but didn't actually buy them and calculate, what real costs they had. So the display for a King in '45 is 163, but when you buy it,it's only 122
Also, I do not understand, why the bonus of the elite-formation does not add to the costs ? A Panther of a regular formation costs as much as a Panther from a elite one. As the true troop costs are based on the experience of the crew, this seems not to be right. I tested the steps of the cost adjustment for the King, setting the historics off and the troop quality manually. 70 is the zero-level where the true costs meet the set ones in the OOB (202 for King). I went down 5 exp. points and the display in the buy-menue tells me 190 (sounds pretty reasonable to me - the costs I would expect). Then I purchase the King and the real costs are 142. A drop of 60 points ??? Why not the displayed 190 ???
Like it is now, I have to say sorry, I'm on your side now and the Kings are defenetily to low cost (the other stuff is aswell, 'cause it affects everything) :rolleyes:
Someone got a clue what's happening here ?
Mir nach, ich folge euch !
My solution for the duplicate unit issue would be to set one color scheme up to a certain date, then replace it with the other. In the case of German halftracks, the gray until mid '43, the camo from mid'43 to end of '49. Then only one of the units would be available at any given time.
But how to get the rest of the world to agree to this..?..?..?..??
But how to get the rest of the world to agree to this..?..?..?..??
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Panzer Leo
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- Location: Braunschweig/Germany
Good he wants to be sure that he can purchase both...Originally posted by Panzer Leo:
They already should be set up to certain a date. The reason why they come available after this date is the new rarity feature, allowing you to purchase units even after their set end date (with a decreasing chance). The only thing that helps is turning rarity off.
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Panzer Leo
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Panzer Leo
- Posts: 403
- Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2001 9:00 pm
- Location: Braunschweig/Germany
Well, Sven got my point, but I'll explain it a bit more specific...
There're two options to avoid the double-appearance of the SPW251 (or the tanks).
1.As far as I know from the back of my mind the gray one is available till end of 42, the camo comes up on Jan 43. The gray will only vanish from the purchasing screen when rarity is off.
2.If you want rarity and no double appearance, the only thing you can do is eliminate one of the two and make the remaining available the whole time, or give one of them a different unit-type, set up a new formation and keep the two seperated this way.
So just changing the dates of availability won't do it...
There're two options to avoid the double-appearance of the SPW251 (or the tanks).
1.As far as I know from the back of my mind the gray one is available till end of 42, the camo comes up on Jan 43. The gray will only vanish from the purchasing screen when rarity is off.
2.If you want rarity and no double appearance, the only thing you can do is eliminate one of the two and make the remaining available the whole time, or give one of them a different unit-type, set up a new formation and keep the two seperated this way.
So just changing the dates of availability won't do it...
Mir nach, ich folge euch !
Leo I still notice that you have a choice sometimes....Originally posted by Panzer Leo:
Well, Sven got my point, but I'll explain it a bit more specific...
There're two options to avoid the double-appearance of the SPW251 (or the tanks).
1.As far as I know from the back of my mind the gray one is available till end of 42, the camo comes up on Jan 43. The gray will only vanish from the purchasing screen when rarity is off.
2.If you want rarity and no double appearance, the only thing you can do is eliminate one of the two and make the remaining available the whole time, or give one of them a different unit-type, set up a new formation and keep the two seperated this way.
So just changing the dates of availability won't do it...
sven