AI for MWIF - Turkey
Moderator: Shannon V. OKeets
AI for MWIF - Turkey
Turkey setup AI
Turkey Forces
RES 3-2 MIL, 2-3 MIL
3-1 GAR,3-4 CAV,4-3 INF, 4-1 GAR,3-3 INF,4-2-2 HQI, 5-3 INF wp
1939 5-4 MTN wp
1940 5-4 MOT, 1-3 INF DIV
1941 1 TAC
1942 6-5 MEC wp
1 CA,1 CP,1 FTR2
Turkey has one basic setup strategy:
* Region defence (Normal defence): Turkey is divided into regions and each region is given units to face the threat to it, depending on the size of the threat and the priority of the region
Turkey has two special setup strategies:
* Capital defence: Is just as the name suggests a setup where the Turkey
land units are setup to defend Ankara.
- Primary Region: Ankara
* Hero city Ankara and Istanbul defence: When faced with a mighty enemy the chance of holding the border is slim, the Turkish land units are setup around Ankara and Istanbul
- Primary Region: Ankara and Istanbul
Turkey has four extreme strategies:
* Attack Bulgaria: An attacking force of units, not needed in defence against the current threat or factory defence, are placed near Bulgaria to attack it if the chance is given.
- Primary Region: BulgariaGreeceBorder
* Attack Syria: An attacking force of units, not needed in defence against the current threat or factory defence, are placed near Syria to attack it if the chance is given..
- Primary Region: SyriaBorder
* Attack Greece: An attacking force of units, not needed in defence against the current threat or factory defence, are placed near Greece to attack it if the chance is given
- Primary Region: BulgariaGreeceBorder
* Attack USSR: An attacking force of units, not needed in defence against the current threat or factory defence, are placed near Ussr to attack it if the chance is given
- Primary Region: UssrBorder
Declaration of war
Given a GE/IT declaration of war and Western allies/USSR control of Turkey OR USSR/Western allies declaration of war and GE/IT control of Turkey. The suggested reasoning for the AI could be as below.
Threats to guard against:
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from the USSR
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Syria
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Bulgaria
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Greece
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Persia
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Iraq
* Threat of paradrop on/close to Ankara
* Threat of paradrop on/close to Istanbul
* Threat of paradrop on BulgariaGreeceBorder region
* Threat of paradrop on UssrBorder region
* Threat of paradrop on SyriaBorder region
* Threat of paradrop on NorthCost region
* Threat of paradrop on Erzurum region
* Threat of paradrop on Adana region
* Threat of paradrop on Izmir region
* Threat of paradrop on Antalya region
* Threat of invasion from Black Sea
* Threat of invasion from Eastern Mediterranean Sea
* Threat of activation of Bulgaria
* Threat of activation of Persia
* Threat of activation of Iraq
* Threat of having the land unit disrupted
* Threat of a marine walkover from Cyprus
* Threat of a marine walkover from Greece/Italian islands
Good hopes:
* Chance of intervention from controlling power
* Chance to try to cut/capture of USSR oil fields (Only if enemies already in the USSR, to avoid boost to production multiple)
* Chance to try to conquer Bulgaria
* Chance to try to conquer Greece
* Chance to try to conquer Syria
* Chance to try to capture Iraq oil field
* Chance to try to step on facedown allied/axis unit(s)
Simplified data for the setup script:
Threat Levels
Small: 1-3 DIV or 1-2 CORP/ARMY or 1 CORP/ARMY + 1-2 DIV
Medium: More that Small and less than Large
Large: 5+ CORP/ARMY OR 8+ DIV
Turkish Forces groups:
1939
Poor: 3-1 GAR, 3-4 CAV, 3-3 INF
Fair: 4-1 GAR, 4-3 INF
Good: 5-3 INF wp
HQ: 4-2-2 HQI
1940
Poor: 3-1 GAR, 3-4 CAV, 3-3 INF
Fair: 4-1 GAR, 4-3 INF
Good: 5-3 INF wp, 5-4 MTN wp
HQ: 4-2-2 HQI
1941
Poor: 3-1 GAR, 3-4 CAV, 3-3 INF, 1-3 INF DIV
Fair: 4-1 GAR, 4-3 INF
Good: 5-3 INF wp, 5-4 MTN wp, 5-4 MOT
HQ: 4-2-2 HQI
1943
Poor: 3-1 GAR, 3-4 CAV, 3-3 INF, 1-3 INF DIV
Fair: 4-1 GAR, 4-3 INF
Good: 5-3 INF wp, 5-4 MTN wp, 5-4 MOT, 6-5 MEC wp
HQ: 4-2-2 HQI
Turkish Regions
BulgariaGreeceBorder // All border hexes within 2 hex from Bulgaria and Mainland Greece
Name: Bulg
Hexes = Border Border(Turkey, GreeceMainland) AND Border(Turkey, Bulgaria) + 2 // 1 hex inland from border
Priority = 3 //1 highest, 7 lowest
UssrBorder // All border hexes within 1 hex from the USSR
Name: Ussr
Hexes = Border(Turkey, Ussr) + 1 // 1 hex inland from border
Priority = 4
SyriaBorder // All border hexes within 1 hex from Syria
Name: Syria
Hexes = Border(Turkey,Syria) + 1 // 1 hex inland from border
Priority = 5
NorthCost // All Invadable costal hexes from the Black Sean +1 hex inland
Name: North
Hexes = InvadableCoast(Turkey,Black Sea) + 1 // 1 hex inland from the coast
Priority = 5
Erzurum //Erzurum and all hexes around
Name: Erzurum
Hexes = Erzurum +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 6
Istanbul // Istanbul and all hexes around
Name: Istan
Hexes = Istanbul +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 2
Ankara // Ankara and all hexes around
Name: Anka
Hexes = Ankara +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 2
Adana // Adana and all hexes around
Name: Adana
Hexes = Adana +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 5
Izmir // Izmir and all hexes around
Name: Izmir
Hexes = Izmir +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 5
Antalya // Antalya and all hexes around
Name: Anta
Hexes = Antalya +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 7
Simplified logic of the primary rule of the setup script
1 Set the threat level for all Turkish regions
2 Calculate the number of units needed to meet the given threats for all Turkish regions
3 Calculate whether there are extra or too few units to handle all threats
4 Consider using a special defense
5 For all Turkish regions decide how many units each it is assigned.
5a If a Normal defence is chosen, modify allocation of defending units to each Turkish region depending on whether there are extra or too few units.
5b If a Special defense is chosen, the defence has coded how many of the available units the primary region(s) is assigned. The rest of the units are assigned like by Normal defence.
6 Sort all Turkish regions according to their threat level and priority
7 For all Turkish regions pick which units it is assigned.
7a Assign 1 poor unit to each region with a Small threat level, until there are no more poor units, or no more regions with a Small threat level. The
purpose behind doing this is to limit the number of good or fair units given
to regions with a Small threat level. Note that this does not apply to
regions with a No threat level that have 1 unit allocated (e.g., regions with
a priority of 1 or 2).
7b Assign 1 good unit to each region with a Large threat level, until there are
no more good units, or no more regions with a Large threat level
7c Distribute any remaining units
8 The exact placement of units in each region is decided by a special AIO routine.
Turkey Forces
RES 3-2 MIL, 2-3 MIL
3-1 GAR,3-4 CAV,4-3 INF, 4-1 GAR,3-3 INF,4-2-2 HQI, 5-3 INF wp
1939 5-4 MTN wp
1940 5-4 MOT, 1-3 INF DIV
1941 1 TAC
1942 6-5 MEC wp
1 CA,1 CP,1 FTR2
Turkey has one basic setup strategy:
* Region defence (Normal defence): Turkey is divided into regions and each region is given units to face the threat to it, depending on the size of the threat and the priority of the region
Turkey has two special setup strategies:
* Capital defence: Is just as the name suggests a setup where the Turkey
land units are setup to defend Ankara.
- Primary Region: Ankara
* Hero city Ankara and Istanbul defence: When faced with a mighty enemy the chance of holding the border is slim, the Turkish land units are setup around Ankara and Istanbul
- Primary Region: Ankara and Istanbul
Turkey has four extreme strategies:
* Attack Bulgaria: An attacking force of units, not needed in defence against the current threat or factory defence, are placed near Bulgaria to attack it if the chance is given.
- Primary Region: BulgariaGreeceBorder
* Attack Syria: An attacking force of units, not needed in defence against the current threat or factory defence, are placed near Syria to attack it if the chance is given..
- Primary Region: SyriaBorder
* Attack Greece: An attacking force of units, not needed in defence against the current threat or factory defence, are placed near Greece to attack it if the chance is given
- Primary Region: BulgariaGreeceBorder
* Attack USSR: An attacking force of units, not needed in defence against the current threat or factory defence, are placed near Ussr to attack it if the chance is given
- Primary Region: UssrBorder
Declaration of war
Given a GE/IT declaration of war and Western allies/USSR control of Turkey OR USSR/Western allies declaration of war and GE/IT control of Turkey. The suggested reasoning for the AI could be as below.
Threats to guard against:
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from the USSR
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Syria
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Bulgaria
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Greece
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Persia
* Threat of enemy land units entering Turkey from Iraq
* Threat of paradrop on/close to Ankara
* Threat of paradrop on/close to Istanbul
* Threat of paradrop on BulgariaGreeceBorder region
* Threat of paradrop on UssrBorder region
* Threat of paradrop on SyriaBorder region
* Threat of paradrop on NorthCost region
* Threat of paradrop on Erzurum region
* Threat of paradrop on Adana region
* Threat of paradrop on Izmir region
* Threat of paradrop on Antalya region
* Threat of invasion from Black Sea
* Threat of invasion from Eastern Mediterranean Sea
* Threat of activation of Bulgaria
* Threat of activation of Persia
* Threat of activation of Iraq
* Threat of having the land unit disrupted
* Threat of a marine walkover from Cyprus
* Threat of a marine walkover from Greece/Italian islands
Good hopes:
* Chance of intervention from controlling power
* Chance to try to cut/capture of USSR oil fields (Only if enemies already in the USSR, to avoid boost to production multiple)
* Chance to try to conquer Bulgaria
* Chance to try to conquer Greece
* Chance to try to conquer Syria
* Chance to try to capture Iraq oil field
* Chance to try to step on facedown allied/axis unit(s)
Simplified data for the setup script:
Threat Levels
Small: 1-3 DIV or 1-2 CORP/ARMY or 1 CORP/ARMY + 1-2 DIV
Medium: More that Small and less than Large
Large: 5+ CORP/ARMY OR 8+ DIV
Turkish Forces groups:
1939
Poor: 3-1 GAR, 3-4 CAV, 3-3 INF
Fair: 4-1 GAR, 4-3 INF
Good: 5-3 INF wp
HQ: 4-2-2 HQI
1940
Poor: 3-1 GAR, 3-4 CAV, 3-3 INF
Fair: 4-1 GAR, 4-3 INF
Good: 5-3 INF wp, 5-4 MTN wp
HQ: 4-2-2 HQI
1941
Poor: 3-1 GAR, 3-4 CAV, 3-3 INF, 1-3 INF DIV
Fair: 4-1 GAR, 4-3 INF
Good: 5-3 INF wp, 5-4 MTN wp, 5-4 MOT
HQ: 4-2-2 HQI
1943
Poor: 3-1 GAR, 3-4 CAV, 3-3 INF, 1-3 INF DIV
Fair: 4-1 GAR, 4-3 INF
Good: 5-3 INF wp, 5-4 MTN wp, 5-4 MOT, 6-5 MEC wp
HQ: 4-2-2 HQI
Turkish Regions
BulgariaGreeceBorder // All border hexes within 2 hex from Bulgaria and Mainland Greece
Name: Bulg
Hexes = Border Border(Turkey, GreeceMainland) AND Border(Turkey, Bulgaria) + 2 // 1 hex inland from border
Priority = 3 //1 highest, 7 lowest
UssrBorder // All border hexes within 1 hex from the USSR
Name: Ussr
Hexes = Border(Turkey, Ussr) + 1 // 1 hex inland from border
Priority = 4
SyriaBorder // All border hexes within 1 hex from Syria
Name: Syria
Hexes = Border(Turkey,Syria) + 1 // 1 hex inland from border
Priority = 5
NorthCost // All Invadable costal hexes from the Black Sean +1 hex inland
Name: North
Hexes = InvadableCoast(Turkey,Black Sea) + 1 // 1 hex inland from the coast
Priority = 5
Erzurum //Erzurum and all hexes around
Name: Erzurum
Hexes = Erzurum +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 6
Istanbul // Istanbul and all hexes around
Name: Istan
Hexes = Istanbul +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 2
Ankara // Ankara and all hexes around
Name: Anka
Hexes = Ankara +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 2
Adana // Adana and all hexes around
Name: Adana
Hexes = Adana +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 5
Izmir // Izmir and all hexes around
Name: Izmir
Hexes = Izmir +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 5
Antalya // Antalya and all hexes around
Name: Anta
Hexes = Antalya +1 // 1 hex around
Priority = 7
Simplified logic of the primary rule of the setup script
1 Set the threat level for all Turkish regions
2 Calculate the number of units needed to meet the given threats for all Turkish regions
3 Calculate whether there are extra or too few units to handle all threats
4 Consider using a special defense
5 For all Turkish regions decide how many units each it is assigned.
5a If a Normal defence is chosen, modify allocation of defending units to each Turkish region depending on whether there are extra or too few units.
5b If a Special defense is chosen, the defence has coded how many of the available units the primary region(s) is assigned. The rest of the units are assigned like by Normal defence.
6 Sort all Turkish regions according to their threat level and priority
7 For all Turkish regions pick which units it is assigned.
7a Assign 1 poor unit to each region with a Small threat level, until there are no more poor units, or no more regions with a Small threat level. The
purpose behind doing this is to limit the number of good or fair units given
to regions with a Small threat level. Note that this does not apply to
regions with a No threat level that have 1 unit allocated (e.g., regions with
a priority of 1 or 2).
7b Assign 1 good unit to each region with a Large threat level, until there are
no more good units, or no more regions with a Large threat level
7c Distribute any remaining units
8 The exact placement of units in each region is decided by a special AIO routine.
"'Malta - The Thorn in Rommel's Side"
RE: AI for MWIF - Turkey
West Turkey


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"'Malta - The Thorn in Rommel's Side"
RE: AI for MWIF - Turkey
East Turkey


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"'Malta - The Thorn in Rommel's Side"
RE: AI for MWIF - Turkey
Ex of a 1940 Defence against a land attack and invasion


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"'Malta - The Thorn in Rommel's Side"
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brian brian
- Posts: 3191
- Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 6:39 pm
RE: AI for MWIF - Turkey
IMO, Ankara is not worth defending at all unless the USA is coming in with two PARA corps. Otherwise it is so far from the borders that the controlling major power will surely be able to do something before an enemy can approach Ankara. Anything less than two full PARA corps with an equal amount of ground support is an empty threat. I really hope the AI doesn't treat the possible landing of a single para division as a reason to ever stack units on the capital....it really must evaluate the true risk of a paratrooper attack, which from a single unit is generally going to be less than a 10% chance of success. If it doesn't do this, the human player will learn to deploy a para div near a minor before a DOW and then the AI will just sit there with too many resources guarding against this 'threat'. I'm not sure it is really worth putting a 'poor' unit in each region with a 'small' threat - he who defends everything, defends nothing. (And if Syria is on Turkey's side at the moment of DoW, that border is not very threatened, so in the 1940 example I think Panderma is far more important to guard than Adana, frex.)
The primary region for Turkey to defend is Istanbul, far more important than any other region, in almost any DoW/alignment scenario I can think of, except a Russian attack with no threat from a full MAR corps.
The most common way for Turkey to enter the game is after a German alignment after a successful Barbarossa. After that happens, the Turks usually have three objectives to pick from....invading Syria, Iraq, or a Russian-held Persia - where they will probably have an advantage over the German lines which will probably not be that far east yet. (They can also help with the usually bloody Axis campaigns to take Tiflis and then Baku). In that case they do need to keep in mind defense on the Syrian border and around the Dardanelles, depending on force levels in the Med at the time. The AI surely needs a set-up to handle any possible scenario, and you have an excellent handle on that, but I don't see one mentioned above for it's most common possible set-up after a friendly German alignment so I'm thinking that will be done separately? The Germans don't direct their entire war effort and probably their Offensive Chits towards the difficult goal of aligning Turkey just to then have it sit there worried about an Allied attack.
Oh and there is the generally rare scenario of an Axis controlled Middle East resulting in a large force in Persia making it far enough from NW Persia that it can align Turkey without having gotten past Rostov on the main front but that would take some poor Russian play.
The primary region for Turkey to defend is Istanbul, far more important than any other region, in almost any DoW/alignment scenario I can think of, except a Russian attack with no threat from a full MAR corps.
The most common way for Turkey to enter the game is after a German alignment after a successful Barbarossa. After that happens, the Turks usually have three objectives to pick from....invading Syria, Iraq, or a Russian-held Persia - where they will probably have an advantage over the German lines which will probably not be that far east yet. (They can also help with the usually bloody Axis campaigns to take Tiflis and then Baku). In that case they do need to keep in mind defense on the Syrian border and around the Dardanelles, depending on force levels in the Med at the time. The AI surely needs a set-up to handle any possible scenario, and you have an excellent handle on that, but I don't see one mentioned above for it's most common possible set-up after a friendly German alignment so I'm thinking that will be done separately? The Germans don't direct their entire war effort and probably their Offensive Chits towards the difficult goal of aligning Turkey just to then have it sit there worried about an Allied attack.
Oh and there is the generally rare scenario of an Axis controlled Middle East resulting in a large force in Persia making it far enough from NW Persia that it can align Turkey without having gotten past Rostov on the main front but that would take some poor Russian play.
- paulderynck
- Posts: 8501
- Joined: Sat Mar 24, 2007 5:27 pm
- Location: Canada
RE: AI for MWIF - Turkey
With the Limited Straits option, if the Russians can make an effort and control the Black Sea and the Wallies control the E. Med, then no Axis reinforcements are going past Istanbul.
Paul
RE: AI for MWIF - Turkey
If Germany attacks Turkey, there is no point in defending Istanbul really. What is important to defend is Scutari and Panderma, as they are the reason Germany is attacking, for naval access to the Black Sea. Though you want to put some troops in Europe just so they have to make the effort of smacking them.
And if you dont defend Ankara a single paratrooper can easily land in the fields outside, where the fighter is positioned in the example above, and next impulse leasurely stroll into Ankara with a declaration of surrender ready to be signed.
It has been done before...[8D]
And if you dont defend Ankara a single paratrooper can easily land in the fields outside, where the fighter is positioned in the example above, and next impulse leasurely stroll into Ankara with a declaration of surrender ready to be signed.
It has been done before...[8D]
Gott weiss ich will kein Engel sein.
RE: AI for MWIF - Turkey
Conquering Ankara is not enough to conquer Turkey.ORIGINAL: morgil
And if you dont defend Ankara a single paratrooper can easily land in the fields outside, where the fighter is positioned in the example above, and next impulse leasurely stroll into Ankara with a declaration of surrender ready to be signed.
It has been done before...[8D]
All factory cities have to be taken too. I believe that there is one in Istanbul.
RE: AI for MWIF - Turkey
The only thing German forces need too take Istanbul in two impulses is a little bit of sunshine.
Gott weiss ich will kein Engel sein.
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brian brian
- Posts: 3191
- Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 6:39 pm
RE: AI for MWIF - Turkey
good point on landing adjacent and advancing in ... the Turkish Infantry division could cover that possibility, since adjacent Paras could not subsequently attack. And that would be important, because Istanbul is not hard to take for an attacker coming in from Bulgaria. But it should be difficult to subsequently cross the strait from Istanbul. It's always a fine line in WiF, how many units to trade for how much time.
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Shannon V. OKeets
- Posts: 22165
- Joined: Wed May 18, 2005 11:51 pm
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