engineer rgt and other topic

[BrianG]

when do the engineer regiments become available to build?

And can someone explain the difference between construction and engineer/sapper su's?

[eskuche]

According to ob.csv engineer-sapper brigade with 200 or so squads is available November '41.

Pioneers for Germans have engineer value but it looks like the Soviet support unit ones don't...?

[Telemecus]

ORIGINAL: eskuche
Pioneers for Germans have engineer value but it looks like the Soviet support unit ones don't...?

Deliberate choice by Denniss. Not sure if that is still true in later war.

[eskuche]

Just checked Bagration. Seems like only on-map assault engineer brigades have it.

[chaos45]

I think they removed the soviet engineer regiments from the game basically. As they all convert to Battalions now and thus are worthless to build or really keep around.

It was one of the best/only really useful soviet SU in the early game...one of the reasons IMO for many patches now the Soviets against decent German play cant hold the line anymore. It was a pretty big nerf to early game soviet CV, as not only did they assist with digging in but was the highest CV SU the soviets had in the early game once fully trained.

So removed soviet CV and removed soviet digging ability both with their removal = massive nerf overall to soviet CV.

Its the problem with some of the changes over time a small change can have very large effects on a game balance with this many units played over a longer time period/lots of turns.

[joelmar]

Do you still play chaos?

[Denniss]

Soviets did not have Assault engineer types like germans, they started to build them from scratch in late 41/42. All they had were construction engineers thus there should be no change for digging/entrenching.
If I remember right they had some specialized Flamethrower squads for offensive/assault ops but most of them were stationed at the western front. And you know what happened there.

And the very limited number of Sapper Rgts they had were disbanded in late 41 (if not lost earlier) and not re-instated.

I do not want the old time of WitE back where every Soviet player had corps with three Sapper Rgts to easily brush through the biggests enemy fortifications while none of them built the actually existing On-Map Assault-Sapper Brigades.


If you find ahistorical content of the Axis side which happens to be grossly misused as the Sapper Rgts were I will change this too.

[chaos45]

Denniss...the issue is game mechanics...make the Soviet Assault Sapper BDEs a support unit and it works with the game mechanics. As a brigade on map with stacking limits they are useless in the current version of the game. They don't have enough CV to stack for an assault...and in general if Im relying a General to make a roll and commit them as a reserve I would rather use a Tank BDE or division sized element.

So they are useless clutter in the Game. The Soviet player has to build them if they want them and they are pointless to build. If you want to add them as historical adds to the Soviet OB feel free but otherwise they are not worth the precious AP to build for the little use they are in the game as an on map unit.

I would also argue they were absolute fort busters...in the many games I played they really didn't affect forts much as the Soviets had nerfed fort reduction on their engineers for since ever. The key thing they did was allow the soviets to dig in quickly and added precious CV in 1941 and 1942.